पी एम हो तो मोदी जैसा...........

[amankadian]

bhai na to mai garam hu or na mai kisi ko marna chahta hu... or please clarify kar do quote kar ke agar maine koi violent comment kiya hai to...
or aap fir se kisi aadmi ko bina jane allegation laga ruhe ho jativad ka... mugjhe ek bhi video/audio dikha do jahan pe modi kisi ko bhadka ruha ho... haan main modi ke secular sabit kar dene wale 10 video abhi de sakta hu...
bhai insaan ka congressi hona, bjp ka suppoter hona, ya rss ka karyakarta hona, ya hindu hona, ya jat hona, muslim hona itna jarori nahi hai jitna khule vicharon (open minded) ka hona jarori hai... aapne 4 news dekhi... 10 news padhi or modi ke bare mai raye bana li... this is not fair...
development ko to maine 3 post pehle se side rukh diya tha...

ye bold wali baat bahut sahi lagi bhai. kuch hona jaruri nhi hai bas dusro insaan ke liye respect honi jaruri hai
news ke year maine khub uski speech sun rhaki hai tv pe. He never sound like a kind hearted person.

or his position pe wo hai uske lie sab saman hone chiye bhai

 

[sanjeev1984]

Yes brother these things happen!!!! You, me, modi, rajiv gandhi, US government, Indian Govt(BJP or Congress, which ever is ruling) or any one on earth can never stop this. It will happen when it has to happen. And we cant blame one single person for it. No body wants riots like situation in his/her state. But it happens. Important is how we take it. One side we have Modi, Left it to supreme court to investigate and cooperating/supporting the whole process and on other side we have some other leader who were/are so scared that they cant even talk about this.

Bhai these things happen?

You are sure the police didnt look the other way? About 1984 riots, read HS Phoolka's book "When a big tree falls". For Gujarat, read various NGO reports of witnesses and Human rights commission. I dont have an enmity with Modi to blame him unnecessarily.

 

[bazardparveen]

Here are some other hard facts -
1. In 2001 Gujarat ranked 4th in per capita income. Now its 6th.
2. Gujarat has worse malnutrition figures than Uttar Pradesh according to a report by National Commission of Applied Economic Research.
3. 44.6% of Guj's children are malnourished and 66% in the age group of 0-5 are anaemic.
4. Maternal maternity rate only came down by 12 points between 2004-2009. In the same period the national maternal mortality rate was down by 50 points. So Gujarat was below the national average.
5. Vibrant Guj website claims that about $876Bn worth of MoUs have been signed since 2003. In truth RBI says that only $7.5Bn FDI flowed into Guj in this period, which is a mere 5% of total national FDI inflow. In the same period TN gathered 6% and Maharashtra got 35%.

So there are a lot of things which have been faked and covered up by Modi's PR machine.

But my purpose isnt to show Gujarat in a bad light. The state is miled ahead of many states in India. In women's right and industrial and labor laws it is one of the best places. But lets not overblow the trumpet.

I never read too much into FDI and Per capita income as these are not absolute measure of development. Like Ambanis are earning too much also increases per capita income and FDI.

Malnutrition data was of year 2005-06 released by government of India in 2012 which showed Gujarat as one of the worst states. First of all, government must answer what it was doing for last 5 years with the data. May be compiling it. Shame on media who suppressed year and didn't ask GOI anything (http://deshgujarat.com/2012/05/10/4...ster-informs-parimal-nathwani-in-rajya-sabha/). They jumped on Gujarat. After this, Gujarat government took steps like state asked for grain donation through a full fledged campaign. About Maternal maternity rate, I am not sure about basis and time of the data. You may be right.

"But lets not overblow the trumpet."

Agree. In-fact, media must ask from every political party that if things can happen in Gujarat, then, why not in entire nation. Outright lies, biased news have become identity of main stream media. They are bigger danger to the nation, even bigger than corrupt politicians.

 

[sanjeev1984]

bhai pehle mugjhe modi se itni nafrat thi ki kisi muslim ko bhi nahi hogi... but ab mugjhe modi ke secular credential pe koi shaq nahi hai... i m still open and welcome if you have any proof to reflect his inclination towards any particular community... please send me the link i'll educate others too...

ye bold wali baat bahut sahi lagi bhai. kuch hona jaruri nhi hai bas dusro insaan ke liye respect honi jaruri hai
news ke year maine khub uski speech sun rhaki hai tv pe. He never sound like a kind hearted person.

or his position pe wo hai uske lie sab saman hone chiye bhai

 

[swaich]

Yes brother these things happen!!!! You, me, modi, rajiv gandhi, US government, Indian Govt(BJP or Congress, which ever is ruling) or any one on earth can never stop this. It will happen when it has to happen. And we cant blame one single person for it. No body wants riots like situation in his/her state. But it happens. Important is how we take it. One side we have Modi, Left it to supreme court to investigate and cooperating/supporting the whole process and on other side we have some other leader who were/are so scared that they cant even talk about this.

Brother, even if they do. Why should we forget them? Why shouldnt we find the culprits and punish them? We tried in Sikh riots, we failed in spite of 10 commisions. We tried in Guj and we will fail again. But that doesnt mean we should condone it and forget about it and say "yeh to chalta hi rehta hai duniya mein".

I think it all comes down to a few basic yet important differences between you and me and perhaps between many other individuals. You believe economic progress should be a criteria above everything else when deciding about a politician, especially in a country like ours with desperate need for growth.

I believe a person's character is the most important criteria and economic progress comes second especially as our country has so many different communities.

 

[sanjeev1984]

bhai mugjhe lag ruha hai ab aapka sone ka time ho gaya hai isi liye aisi batein karne lage ho... paisa to na america ke pass kam hai or na japan ke pass... ab unse koi sawaal pooche ki wahan pe sab itna accha hai, paisa bhi hai to sab chood kar india kyon aate ho??? is hisaab se to tata or ambani se bhi ye sawal kar dena chahiye ki itni sai companies hain or itna paisa bhi kama liye ab or naye venture suru kyon kar ruhe ho or jayda profit kyon kama ruhe ho??? ye aapke last comment se to aisa lag ruha hai "mugjhe kuch to likhna tha to maine likh diya"...

Punjab Ke baad gujarati sabse jayda abroad main ja rhe hai. ek bhai bol rha hai 2nd number ka states ka states hai world main gujarat . fer kyun wo abroad jate hai tine cache state ko chodkar

 

[sanjeev1984]

bhai maine development ke concept ko to side main rukh diya hai... 2002 ke hi riot aise hain jisme India ki history main sab se jayda culprit ko saza mili hai... or itne detailed tarike se investigation hui hai... agar modi ne kabhi investigation se muh fera hota ya vo india ki integrity ke against hota to aaj mai bhi aap ke sur mai sur mila ke bol ruha hota... but aisa nahi hai... or ruhi baat ki 1984 ke riots ki... to ek bar fir se unki investigation ki seriousness ko study kar lena jawab mil jayega... or character ke bare mai baat suru karne se pehle mugjhe please ye bata dena ki insaan ke koun-koun se traits, uske character ko reflect karte hain... ek bar character ko define kar ke... fir modi ke character ko discuss karangae...

Brother, even if they do. Why should we forget them? Why shouldnt we find the culprits and punish them? We tried in Sikh riots, we failed in spite of 10 commisions. We tried in Guj and we will fail again. But that doesnt mean we should condone it and forget about it.

I think it all comes down to a few basic yet important differences between you and me and perhaps between many other individuals. You believe economic progress should be a criteria above everything else when deciding about a politician, especially in a country like ours with desperate need for growth.

I believe a person's character is the most important criteria and economic progress comes second especially as our country has so many different communities.

 

[bazardparveen]

Punjab Ke baad gujarati sabse jayda abroad main ja rhe hai. ek bhai bol rha hai 2nd number ka states ka states hai world main gujarat . fer kyun wo abroad jate hai tine cache state ko chodkar

Wait, I mentioned wrongly, not second best in world. It got award second time for transparency in governance. Correcting the main post.

Now, transparency, even if it would have been second best in the world; doesn't mean it is best in every aspect. Really Disappointing to see that you are coming to conclusions without reading totality of the post. I already mentioned that there may be something here and there. But most of the facts are true. I can't remember every data. Here is the link. http://m.indianexpress.com/news/"gujarat-wins-un-award-for-public-service"/637910/

The above reveals one more positive; Swagat, grievance redressal system via video conferences.

 

[swaich]

bhai maine development ke concept ko to side main rukh diya hai... 2002 ke hi riot aise hain jisme India ki history main sab se jayda culprit ko saza mili hai... or itne detailed tarike se investigation hui hai... agar modi ne kabhi investigation se muh fera hota ya vo india ki integrity ke against hota to aaj mai bhi aap ke sur mai sur mila ke bol ruha hota... but aisa nahi hai... or ruhi baat ki 1984 ke riots ki... to ek bar fir se unki investigation ki seriousness ko study kar lena jawab mil jayega... or character ke bare mai baat suru karne se pehle mugjhe please ye bata dena ki insaan ke koun-koun se traits, uske character ko reflect karte hain... ek bar character ko define kar ke... fir modi ke character ko discuss karangae...

Bhai, there were planned attacks in which administration and police helped or abetted the mobs. Various indepdendent journalists, NGOs and witnesses have confirmed this. Aap Gujarat riots ke wiki page of padh le or uske neeche refrenced sources ko bhi. Aap ko kaafi kuch clear ho jayega. Here' an extract -

"India's National Human Rights Commission (NHRC), an official body, found evidence in the killings of premeditation by members of Hindu extremist groups; complicity by Gujarat state government officials; and police inaction in the midst of attacks on Muslims. The NHRC also noted "widespread reports and allegations of well-organized persons, armed with mobile telephones and addresses, singling out certain homes and properties for death and destruction in certain districts-sometimes within view of police stations and personnel," suggesting the attacks may have been planned in advance. Christians were also victims in Gujarat, and many churches were destroyed."[SUP][54][/SUP]

The New York Times' Celia Dugger reported that witnesses were "dismayed by the lack of intervention from local police", who often "watched the events taking place and took no action against the attacks on Muslims and their property".[SUP][41][/SUP] Human Rights Watch reported that in some cases members of the state police force led rioting mobs, "aiming and firing at every Muslim who got in the way", or instead of offering assistance "led the victims directly into the hands of their killers."[SUP][42][/SUP] Calls for assistance to the police, fire brigades, and even ambulance services generally proved futile.[SUP][42][/SUP]

Now how can such level of state complicity be possible without the approval of Modi?

And do watch the documentary on the riots 'The Final Solution'.

 

[sanjeev1984]

bhai ye sari report maine bhi padhi hain or bahot sare video bhi dekhe hain... police inactive hoti to riot rokne ke liye jo firing ki vo kaise hui... or wahi reports ye bhi bolti hain ki 500 se jayada log police firing mai mare gaye hain...or agar police biased hoti to, un sab reports mai hi hai ki police firing main marne walo mai se more than 90% log hain... or ye 90% hindu police ne biased ho ke nahi mare... riot karne wale jayada hindu the to mare gaye... kuch muslim the to vo bhi mare gaye...

or ruhi baat police ke na involve hone ki to ek example deta hu... "humare plot mai ek western union wale ne dukaan rent pe le rukhi hai... kuch din pehle, ek habshi (nigerian) raat lok tood kar us shop main ghuss gaya... paise chori karne ke chakkar mai... usko kya pata tha ki raat ko koun uske liye wahan paisa chood kar jayega... jab vo lock tood ruha tha tab uski aawaz baju wali tent ki dukan mai soye huae ek helper ne sun li... pehle to vo dekhta ruha... jab vo habshi ander ghuss gaya to us helper ne bahar se shutter gira kar shop lock kar di... or humein phone kar diya... humne 100 pe police ko phone kar diya... raat ke 3:00 baje the do PCR shop ke saamne se gujri... humne dono ko rukawaya... bhaiyo ne rook to li but ek PCR wale ne jawab diya ki humara chai ka time ho agaya hai or doosre ne jawab diya ki duty time over ho gaya hai... 35-40 min ke baad wahan ek PCR aai... usme the 1 driver, 2 sipahi, 1 SI... 4 policia utar to aaye but shutter uthane ki kisi ki himmat nahi ho ri thi... wahan main or mera bhai the... humne police walo ko pehle to dhamkaya fir khud hi shutter khola... us habshi ko pakda or PCR mai baithaya... " ye example koi kahani nahi hai satya ghatna pe adharit hai... or moral of the story ye hai ki police wale bhi hum jaise hi hote hain... dar unko bhi lagta hai or salary bhi kam hoti hai, to dew bhi nahi pi sakte (taki dar ke aage jeet nazar aa jaye)... ye to normal si chori ki ghatna thi... jisme police ne action nahi liya.. iske liye mai shiela dixhit ko responsible declare kar du kya... gujarat ke haadse mai to darr or emotions dono hi involve the... jab mai police walo ke dar ke karan CM or guilty nahi declare kar ruha to ... fir doosi situation main darr or emotion ke karan wahan ke CM ko kaise responsible thera hu????

or mugjhe ye accha laga ye dekh kar ki india mai aise log hain jo 2002 ke victims ke liye itna sochte hain... but ye soch kar dukh hota hai ki baki desh ke victims ke bare mai agar iska 1% bhi effort kar liya hota to shayad india aaj kisi or hi raste pe hota....

Bhai, there were planned attacks in which administration and police helped or abetted the mobs. Various indepdendent journalists, NGOs and witnesses have confirmed this. Aap Gujarat riots ke wiki page of padh le or uske neeche refrenced sources ko bhi. Aap ko kaafi kuch clear ho jayega. Here' an extract -





Now how can such level of state complicity be possible without the approval of Modi?

And do watch the documentary on the riots 'The Final Solution'.

 

[swaich]

bhai ye sari report maine bhi padhi hain or bahot sare video bhi dekhe hain... police inactive hoti to riot rokne ke liye jo firing ki vo kaise hui... or wahi reports ye bhi bolti hain ki 500 se jayada log police firing mai mare gaye hain...or agar police biased hoti to, un sab reports mai hi hai ki police firing main marne walo mai se more than 90% log hain... or ye 90% hindu police ne biased ho ke nahi mare... riot karne wale jayada hindu the to mare gaye... kuch muslim the to vo bhi mare gaye...

or ruhi baat police ke na involve hone ki to ek example deta hu... "humare plot mai ek western union wale ne dukaan rent pe le rukhi hai... kuch din pehle, ek habshi (nigerian) raat lok tood kar us shop main ghuss gaya... paise chori karne ke chakkar mai... usko kya pata tha ki raat ko koun uske liye wahan paisa chood kar jayega... jab vo lock tood ruha tha tab uski aawaz baju wali tent ki dukan mai soye huae ek helper ne sun li... pehle to vo dekhta ruha... jab vo habshi ander ghuss gaya to us helper ne bahar se shutter gira kar shop lock kar di... or humein phone kar diya... humne 100 pe police ko phone kar diya... raat ke 3:00 baje the do PCR shop ke saamne se gujri... humne dono ko rukawaya... bhaiyo ne rook to li but ek PCR wale ne jawab diya ki humara chai ka time ho agaya hai or doosre ne jawab diya ki duty time over ho gaya hai... 35-40 min ke baad wahan ek PCR aai... usme the 1 driver, 2 sipahi, 1 SI... 4 policia utar to aaye but shutter uthane ki kisi ki himmat nahi ho ri thi... wahan main or mera bhai the... humne police walo ko pehle to dhamkaya fir khud hi shutter khola... us habshi ko pakda or PCR mai baithaya... " ye example koi kahani nahi hai satya ghatna pe adharit hai... or moral of the story ye hai ki police wale bhi hum jaise hi hote hain... dar unko bhi lagta hai or salary bhi kam hoti hai, to dew bhi nahi pi sakte (taki dar ke aage jeet nazar aa jaye)... ye to normal si chori ki ghatna thi... jisme police ne action nahi liya.. iske liye mai shiela dixhit ko responsible declare kar du kya... gujarat ke haadse mai to darr or emotions dono hi involve the... jab mai police walo ke dar ke karan CM or guilty nahi declare kar ruha to ... fir doosi situation main darr or emotion ke karan wahan ke CM ko kaise responsible thera hu????

or mugjhe ye accha laga ye dekh kar ki india mai aise log hain jo 2002 ke victims ke liye itna sochte hain... but ye soch kar dukh hota hai ki baki desh ke victims ke bare mai agar iska 1% bhi effort kar liya hota to shayad india aaj kisi or hi raste pe hota....

Bhai, police ne tab action liya jab media ka pressure barh gaya. Army bhi bulayi gayi thi. Par tab tak the damage had been done. The riots started on 27th, and reached their worst on 28th. But the police firing incidents happened by 2nd March. In the meantime even an ex MP had been killed. Aapne Ehsaan Jaafri case to parha hi hoga.

Apne bahut acha example diya police ki inefficiency ka. Par jab yahi police ko pata ho ki unhe upar se puri support hai to woh sher ban jate hain. Aisa hi hua tha Gujarat mein.

 

[rekhasmriti]

may be bad choice of words--
guilty as charged

modi was responsible for so many muslim deaths in godhara

as a CM -------leader of a state-

he has proved to be phenomenal

in spite of all what he has doen-

whole gujaart has accepeted him as his LEader

bas yar wok ek cheez par khela----- n usse paat tha woh kam laregi-- usse kehte hai future-vision-

he worked on development- provide amenities to people

---------us narmada project ke liye, duniya sadak par dharna dene aa gayee-----------
but modi na manna ram g ki bhi-
coz he knows usse mere logon ka bahal hoga

bhad gaya - tumhaar pollution


sir g- no one can be perfect - ab yhe humei judge karna hai ki uski qualities se humei zyda fayda hai ya disqualities se zyada nuksan

Bahut badia kaam kia log ko marwa kar. .........ager wo Modi muslam hota or Hindu ko marwata fir kya bolte aap

You don't have heart ..... kitni araam se bol rhe ho ki kitne muslaman karwye ...Omg wo insaan nhi they kya


Hero that's sound not for him. Criminal. Kiska baap mara, kiski maa, kisike bacche. Kabi socha hai un muslim parviaar ka kya hua hoga.

more then 1000s women got widows

 

[rekhasmriti]

i m kinda curious

waht made u change ur mind

bhai pehle mugjhe modi se itni nafrat thi ki kisi muslim ko bhi nahi hogi... but ab mugjhe modi ke secular credential pe koi shaq nahi hai... i m still open and welcome if you have any proof to reflect his inclination towards any particular community... please send me the link i'll educate others too...

 

[virj]

Here's my line of argument, let me know if you get it easily or I will try breaking it down further for you.

Two wrongs do not make a right. We cant justify Modi's guilt by saying "Others are guilty too, ask them to apologize first!" This is not a kid's chocolate stealing game in school. No political party is scot free.

And when did I say I support Congress? Does opposing Modi or BJP automatically mean a Congress supporter? Congress is no good on protecting minority rights. They are sham secular. Narasimha Rao had intelligence inputs that Babri will be destroyed, yet he didnt send in central forces.

I have voted 4 times uptill now in total. Never for Congress.



Gujarat isnt developed yet. Its still developing. But its developed as compared to most other states. I hope this is not too hard to understand.

I am not ready to risk a leader like Modi. That guy couldnt manage a riot in his own state, rather allowed it to happen. How will he manage a multitude of such issues all over the country?

And let me tell you something, it doesnt take a lot for the official machinery - the police, administration to get into a tacit understanding of which community to support. And this affects normal people too. Rajiv's hand in the riots could have never been confirmed pr proven. Yet the police actually helped the mobs with voter lists. People killed their own neighbors because it seemed like common understanding that Sikhs have to be punished for killing Gandhi. Similar thing happened in Gujarat after Godhra. The Hindu population was naturally seething with anger, so were the mostly Hindu administration who were sympathetic to the mobs of rioters. But this is where an impartial CM could have come in and prevented such loss. Yet he didnt do it and instead 'allowed' things to deteriorate.

I am ok with the BJP coming to power, but not Modi as PM.

मेने तो पहली ही कही थी के तू सबने एक सामान चश्मे त देखे तो कोई दिक्कत न हे. इब तू नु कवे हे के सारी पार्टी ही दोषी हे कांग्रेस भी दोषी हे तो फेर इस सोनिया हर मनमोहन ने भी परधानमंत्री नहीं बनना चाहिए. रही development की बात तो में कगाची आंकड़े में विस्वास नहीं करा करदा. ओदे एक गेडा मार आ तेने पंजाब हर गुजरात में फरक बेर पाट जागा. और तेरा यु तर्क के एक बढ़िया विकासशील परदेश को और विकासशील बनाना बहोत आसान हे तो भाई फेर तो आज बिहार सबते आगे होना चाहिए था और पंजाब भी टॉप की स्टेट होना था पर हरयाणा ने पंजाब पीछे छोड़ दिया per capita income में. नु काया करे हे ने के टॉप पे पहुंचना आसान हे टॉप पे बने रहना मुस्किल हो हे
इब तेरी बातां का सार यु हे: तू सिर्फ मोदी ने परधानमंत्री इसलिए नहीं देखना चावे कौनकी वो गुजरात में दंगे नहीं रोक सका. तेरा अकेला तर्क यो हे तो फेर नु बता कौन परधानमंत्री बनना चाहिए तेरी नज़र में. तेने ही कही हे के हमाम में सब नंगे हे. मेरी नज़र में तो जितने विकल्प हे तेरे अन्ना हजारे हर रामदेव ने मिलाके यो सबते बढ़िया लगे हे इब तू तेरा विकल्प बता

 

[sanjeev1984]

police starting se hi active hi... or aapko ye bhi maluum hoga ki humare yahan 50:1 ratio hai common manolice ka... or shayad ratio is-se bhi jayada ho... ab police walo itne bade area ko shaat rukhne ke liye time to lagega hi... vo bhi insaan hain... superman to nahi hain... taj ke 3 terrorist ko control karne main kitni sari mumbai police or NSG ke kitne commandos lage the, fir bhi 6 dim mai control kar paye the... gujarat mai to common aadmi hi terrorist bana hua tha chahe hindu ho ya muslim... (ab pls ye mat bolna ki taj te terrorist trained the is liye itne log or din lage... wahan trained the to retaliation force bhi jayada thi... yahan untrained the to rioters vs force ka ratio bhi jayada tha)

bhai mai media ke pressure ke concept ko nahi maanta... ye media kya pressurize karegi kisi ko jo khud biki hui hai... aisi media kya pressure banayegi jo news kam sunate hain or humara entertainment jayada karte hain... kabhi to nazar surkash kavach sale karte hain, kabhi ek call kar ke ek face identify karne pe logo ko hazaro ka inaam dete hain, kabhi souna slim belt sale karte hain, kabhi to barkha dutt jaise log 2g spectrum mai involve huae dikhte hain... ye kya pressure karangae kisi ko... or agar media ke pressure jaisi cheez hoti to media ne wahan modi ko action lene ke liye jitna pressurize nahi kiya jitna aaj tak use resign karwane ke liye kiya hai.. agar modi media ka pressure maanta to na narmada dam banta... or modi kab ka pressure mai aa ke resign kar chuka hota... ye kaisa concept hai ki modi media ke pressure mai action to le leta hai but resign nahi karta...

Ex-MP bhi insaan hi hai, superman to nahi hai... riots ke time mai jab, sab logon ke sur pe khoor sawar hai, or curfew jaisi halat hai... aise mai to ghar pe baithna hi samajhdari hai (chahe vo Ex-MP hindu ho ya muslim)... superhero ban ke public ko provoke karega to or kya ho sakta hai... jo hua vo theek to nahi hua but agar aise mahool main vo apne ghar mai ander hota to jayada safe hota... or agar itna hi patience sab mai hota to na riots hote... or na bechara Ex-MP mara jata...

Bhai maine police ye nahi kahan ki police inefficient hai... maine kaha hai ki vo bhi insaan hain... unke bhi bacche hain.. or unko bhi marne se darr lagta hai... mere family and relatives mai kafi log police mai hain... ek unkle hain crime branch mai. thode senior hain... unki batai hui baat batata hu... ek bar unki team ko order mila tha...delhi ke ek kafi naami criminal ko uthane ka... unki sari team ko ye bhai pata tha ki vo criminal kis time pe, kitne logo ke saath, kahan aane wala hai... ek restro se uthana tha usko... sari team ko ye bhi pata tha ki uske pass kounse weapons hain or kitni ammunition hai... un unkle ki team ka ek inspector us goone ki table pe baith kar wapas aa gaya or bola sir kisi or ko bol do ye karne ke liye mai nahi kar sakta... to bhai mere kehne ka taatpariye ye hai ki support sher nahi banati... situation sher banati hai... i hero ka 50 criminals ko peetna sirf movies mai hi chalta hai... ground reality kuch or hi hoti hai... vo bhi ek situation thi ki kuch logo ne mil kar 80 log jinda jala diye... wahan ve sher ban gaye... or ye bhi ek situation thi ki fir logo ne mil kar, sher ban kar... kuch or log mar/jala diye... (kiya to dono ne galat... but sher kisi neta ki support ke karan nahi bane... sher bane to situation ke karan...) or jab police sher ban gai tab dono kism ke log aaram se baith gaye...

Bhai, police ne tab action liya jab media ka pressure barh gaya. Army bhi bulayi gayi thi. Par tab tak the damage had been done. The riots started on 27th, and reached their worst on 28th. But the police firing incidents happened by 2nd March. In the meantime even an ex MP had been killed. Aapne Ehsaan Jaafri case to parha hi hoga.

Apne bahut acha example diya police ki inefficiency ka. Par jab yahi police ko pata ho ki unhe upar se puri support hai to woh sher ban jate hain. Aisa hi hua tha Gujarat mein.

 

[dahiyask]

mane to nu laga hai ke yahan pe congress walo ki ginti badh rahi hai. Aaj pure desh me congress , so called secular(like mulayan, lallu,vampanthi aur ab ye nitish )or muslim ko chhod kar koi bhi aisa nahi hai jo Modi ko PM nahi dekhna chahta ho. Aaj refrendum karvo lo Modi ke aage desh ko koi bhi neeta tik nahi payega. Lekin is desh ka durbhagya hai ke jis ko desh chahta hai vo nahi ban pata aur jis ko vo videshi aurat sonia chahti hai vo ban jata hai chaye vo PM ho ya Prseident. desh ke sare log chahte the ke Kalam saheb president bane lekin dekho kya hua.

 

[swaich]

मेने तो पहली ही कही थी के तू सबने एक सामान चश्मे त देखे तो कोई दिक्कत न हे. इब तू नु कवे हे के सारी पार्टी ही दोषी हे कांग्रेस भी दोषी हे तो फेर इस सोनिया हर मनमोहन ने भी परधानमंत्री नहीं बनना चाहिए. रही development की बात तो में कगाची आंकड़े में विस्वास नहीं करा करदा. ओदे एक गेडा मार आ तेने पंजाब हर गुजरात में फरक बेर पाट जागा. और तेरा यु तर्क के एक बढ़िया विकासशील परदेश को और विकासशील बनाना बहोत आसान हे तो भाई फेर तो आज बिहार सबते आगे होना चाहिए था और पंजाब भी टॉप की स्टेट होना था पर हरयाणा ने पंजाब पीछे छोड़ दिया per capita income में. नु काया करे हे ने के टॉप पे पहुंचना आसान हे टॉप पे बने रहना मुस्किल हो हे
इब तेरी बातां का सार यु हे: तू सिर्फ मोदी ने परधानमंत्री इसलिए नहीं देखना चावे कौनकी वो गुजरात में दंगे नहीं रोक सका. तेरा अकेला तर्क यो हे तो फेर नु बता कौन परधानमंत्री बनना चाहिए तेरी नज़र में. तेने ही कही हे के हमाम में सब नंगे हे. मेरी नज़र में तो जितने विकल्प हे तेरे अन्ना हजारे हर रामदेव ने मिलाके यो सबते बढ़िया लगे हे इब तू तेरा विकल्प बता

Economy wali baat pe pehle hi bata chuka hun ki kai states Guj se aage hain. Same for health and social indicators.

Aur beech mein Punjab or Haryana kahan se aa gaye?

Baki, appka question "Ki agar Modi nahin to kaun?" valid hai. I like BJP as a party more than Congress jo ki sirf chamchagiri jante hain. If BJP comes to power they have a plethora of leaders to choose from. I think Jaswant Singh is a good enough guy. True aap keh sakte hain ki Mdi is a better leader, adminstrator etc. But Jaswant Singh isnt communal. He doesnt run away from interviews when asked about controversial topics. And he will have the honor of resigning if something like Godhra and Guj riots happened under his watch.

 

[swaich]

police starting se hi active hi... or aapko ye bhi maluum hoga ki humare yahan 50:1 ratio hai common manolice ka... or shayad ratio is-se bhi jayada ho... ab police walo itne bade area ko shaat rukhne ke liye time to lagega hi... vo bhi insaan hain... superman to nahi hain... taj ke 3 terrorist ko control karne main kitni sari mumbai police or NSG ke kitne commandos lage the, fir bhi 6 dim mai control kar paye the... gujarat mai to common aadmi hi terrorist bana hua tha chahe hindu ho ya muslim... (ab pls ye mat bolna ki taj te terrorist trained the is liye itne log or din lage... wahan trained the to retaliation force bhi jayada thi... yahan untrained the to rioters vs force ka ratio bhi jayada tha)

bhai mai media ke pressure ke concept ko nahi maanta... ye media kya pressurize karegi kisi ko jo khud biki hui hai... aisi media kya pressure banayegi jo news kam sunate hain or humara entertainment jayada karte hain... kabhi to nazar surkash kavach sale karte hain, kabhi ek call kar ke ek face identify karne pe logo ko hazaro ka inaam dete hain, kabhi souna slim belt sale karte hain, kabhi to barkha dutt jaise log 2g spectrum mai involve huae dikhte hain... ye kya pressure karangae kisi ko... or agar media ke pressure jaisi cheez hoti to media ne wahan modi ko action lene ke liye jitna pressurize nahi kiya jitna aaj tak use resign karwane ke liye kiya hai.. agar modi media ka pressure maanta to na narmada dam banta... or modi kab ka pressure mai aa ke resign kar chuka hota... ye kaisa concept hai ki modi media ke pressure mai action to le leta hai but resign nahi karta...

Ex-MP bhi insaan hi hai, superman to nahi hai... riots ke time mai jab, sab logon ke sur pe khoor sawar hai, or curfew jaisi halat hai... aise mai to ghar pe baithna hi samajhdari hai (chahe vo Ex-MP hindu ho ya muslim)... superhero ban ke public ko provoke karega to or kya ho sakta hai... jo hua vo theek to nahi hua but agar aise mahool main vo apne ghar mai ander hota to jayada safe hota... or agar itna hi patience sab mai hota to na riots hote... or na bechara Ex-MP mara jata...

Bhai maine police ye nahi kahan ki police inefficient hai... maine kaha hai ki vo bhi insaan hain... unke bhi bacche hain.. or unko bhi marne se darr lagta hai... mere family and relatives mai kafi log police mai hain... ek unkle hain crime branch mai. thode senior hain... unki batai hui baat batata hu... ek bar unki team ko order mila tha...delhi ke ek kafi naami criminal ko uthane ka... unki sari team ko ye bhai pata tha ki vo criminal kis time pe, kitne logo ke saath, kahan aane wala hai... ek restro se uthana tha usko... sari team ko ye bhi pata tha ki uske pass kounse weapons hain or kitni ammunition hai... un unkle ki team ka ek inspector us goone ki table pe baith kar wapas aa gaya or bola sir kisi or ko bol do ye karne ke liye mai nahi kar sakta... to bhai mere kehne ka taatpariye ye hai ki support sher nahi banati... situation sher banati hai... i hero ka 50 criminals ko peetna sirf movies mai hi chalta hai... ground reality kuch or hi hoti hai... vo bhi ek situation thi ki kuch logo ne mil kar 80 log jinda jala diye... wahan ve sher ban gaye... or ye bhi ek situation thi ki fir logo ne mil kar, sher ban kar... kuch or log mar/jala diye... (kiya to dono ne galat... but sher kisi neta ki support ke karan nahi bane... sher bane to situation ke karan...) or jab police sher ban gai tab dono kism ke log aaram se baith gaye...

I agree aaj ki media shaq se pare nahin hai. Paid news ki bi kaafi batein uthi hain. Par 2002 was still different. Media rise pe tha. Aur media ka kaafi issues pe logon pe bahut bada effect that. Aapko Kargil issue to yaad hoga. Media ki frontline reporting se hi desh mein deshbhakti ki awaz gunji thi aur pura desh ek saath that. Aur bhi kayi muddon pe media ne constructive role ada kiya hai. Anna Hazare ka mudda bh le lijiye. Kya media ne Anna ka saath nahi diya? Is liye media of generalize karna aur unke kaam ko nakaar dena gala hai.

Sir, lagta hai apne riots mein Gulbarg society ke baare main parha nahi hai. Agar parha hota to aisi baat naa karte. Ehsaan jaafri ke baarein mein dhyaan se padhiye. Ek aadmi jiski society ko mob ne gher rakha jai woh khud kyun bheerh ko uksayega? Mob ne use dhoke se maara. Kaha gaya ki woh usse baat karna chahti hai aur fir chali jayegi. Par uske gate se bahar aate hi jala dala. Aur aap use provocation keh rahe hain? Ek 70 saal ka admi kya provocation karega? His society Gulbarg was 2 km away from police commissioner's office in central Ahmedabad. He called Modi and several police official repetedly for 5 hours. Yet no help arrived.

Aur ye proocation Police ke liye bahut convenient excuse hota hai. 1984 mein pehle din sirf Sikhs ki arrest hui thi, woh jinho ne apne self defense ke liye fire kiya that.

I too have some extended family members in police. Baaki police ko jab power ho wo kya kya kar sakti hai, woh sare Punjab ne 80s mein dekha hai. There are too many cases of Police abuse of powers to write down.

 

[sanjeev1984]

Rekha ji... suppose that you are a policewoman (at any level, from constable to commissioner). Can you give me assurance that you will not let happen a single case of crime of any kind??? I know you can't. Why??? Because people's actions are out of your control. Than, can I state that as your inefficiency???(when you are giving your 100% for duties and responsibility)??? No, I should not state that you are inefficient(I can, But i should not!!!). But your performance and seriousness about you duties need to be checked and measured and examined? According to me this should be the way of a educated person (by the way it depends on people to follow it or not).
1). I can criticize you for whatever happened, and for not maintaining the law and order? But I should never put allegations on you and put all blame on you by stating that you did this. (As things were out of your control.) (Correct me, If i m wrong!!!)
2). Your seriousness can be examined only on the basis of the action you would be taking against the culprits and bringing them to the judicial system. Which will set example for other future criminals too.

Train burning in Godhra and riots were out of control of Modi(Whereas media always shows Modi as culprit). Modi took every possible action to maintain peace. And even now co-operates will the investigation team appointed by Supreme Court of India. What else people expect him to do??? Resignation/ Apology!!!! Why??? Why should he apologize for the sins, which he never committed??? And why should he resign too??? I hope you know 2002 are the only riots in the history of this world for which investigation team have taken the statements of more than 45000 (please don't assume that, by mistake i put one extra zero or two, it is fourty five thousand...) peoples (which includes victims, bureaucrats, culprits, witnesses, politicians etc.). That is what he did for those riots of 2002.

And for Gujarat, I have worked there for few years. After 2002, gujarat has not witnessed even a single riot after then and not a single day curfew. And a lot of things which can change one's mind/opinion.

i m kinda curious

waht made u change ur mind

 

[sanjeev1984]

Aisa kya different tha 2002 mai??? Jo us time ke news reader the ek saal baad sabne aaj apne news chennal ki dukan khol li hai... kahan se aaya itna paisa??? tab se hi to kama ruhe hongae??? humare saamne aaj aa ruha hai... 1965 or 71 mai to itne news chennal nahi the... desh to tab bhi ek saath khada tha... media ko credit kahan se chla gaya desh ko joodne ka??? or media ke kuch constructive acts (pata nahi koun se???) and unke sare distructive acts pe parda dal sakta hai... but kisi state ki 10 saal ki growth se wahan se 6 din ke riots ko nahi bhulaya ja sakta... vo bhi jisme common log hi culprit the or common log hi victim... badhiya vichar hain... but bhai itna negative hona accha nahi hota...

Bhai maine kya padha hai or kya nahi is par aap kaise comment kar sakte ho... maine pehle bhi kahan hai... aap apni raye kuch jayada jaldi bana lete ho... thoda time lagaya karo.. do-chao alag angle se socha karo fir raye banaya karo kisi ke bare mai... maine gulberg society ke bare mai padha bhi hai or dekha bhi hai... 2002 mai gulberg mai riot huae... ek bar in sawalo ke jawab likh dekha (as aapne kafi detail mai padha hoga... or aap ko sara ghatna karam bhi yaad hoga...)
1). riot to 2002 mai huae but jakia jafri ne first time modi ke aarop kab lagaya???
2). modi pe aarop lagane se pehle alag-alag investigation teams ne kitni bar jaika jafri ka statement liya tha???
3). jakia jafri ne ab tak kitni bar statement change kiya hai???
4). jakia jafri ko modi pe aarop lagane mai itna time kyon lag gaya???
5). CM office ke records main ehsaan jafri ki dialed ya incomming call record kyon nahi mila? mr jafri ke phone record mai bhi wahan ke local logo ke hi no mile (incomming and out going)??? ehsaan jafri telepathy se baat kar ruha tha kya modi se, jo ki baat bhi kar li or kahin koi record bhi nahi hai???
6). kuch or bhi hai... but pehle bhai inke hi jawab de do....

Bhai provoke karne ke liye age certificate ki jarurat hoti hai kya??? jo ye bol ruhe ho ki 70 saal ka aadmi kya provoke karega... mere dada ji 85 saal ke hain... teen din pehle mere dada ne mere chaha ke ladke ko provoke kar ke ek bechara rikhsha wala bihar pitwa diya... bhai provoke to koi bhai kar sakta hai... bas bolna hi to hai...

Police Commissioner ka office 2 kilometre to kya agar gulberg society mai bhi hota... to 4500 log jinke pass hathyar hain, unke saamne Police Comm. kya karta... Again Vo bhi insaan hai Superman nahi hai bhai... or kitni baar bolu???... or agar vo police Comm wahin pe kafi sari force lagwa deta to kahin or jayada log mare jate... resources to limited hi hain jaisa ki maine pehle bola...

Bhai punjab ne 80 mai jo dekha vo terrorism tha... usko aap north east ke nexals se ya kashmir ke terrorism se to cmpare kar sakte ho but 10-15 din ke riots ke saath compare karna theek nahi hai... ek mai cold blodded killers hain jo plan kar ke logo ko marte hain/maarte the... or doosri taraf provoked logo ke gusse ka eruption hai...

I agree aaj ki media shaq se pare nahin hai. Paid news ki bi kaafi batein uthi hain. Par 2002 was still different. Media rise pe tha. Aur media ka kaafi issues pe logon pe bahut bada effect that. Aapko Kargil issue to yaad hoga. Media ki frontline reporting se hi desh mein deshbhakti ki awaz gunji thi aur pura desh ek saath that. Aur bhi kayi muddon pe media ne constructive role ada kiya hai. Anna Hazare ka mudda bh le lijiye. Kya media ne Anna ka saath nahi diya? Is liye media of generalize karna aur unke kaam ko nakaar dena gala hai.

Sir, lagta hai apne riots mein Gulbarg society ke baare main parha nahi hai. Agar parha hota to aisi baat naa karte. Ehsaan jaafri ke baarein mein dhyaan se padhiye. Ek aadmi jiski society ko mob ne gher rakha jai woh khud kyun bheerh ko uksayega? Mob ne use dhoke se maara. Kaha gaya ki woh usse baat karna chahti hai aur fir chali jayegi. Par uske gate se bahar aate hi jala dala. Aur aap use provocation keh rahe hain? Ek 70 saal ka admi kya provocation karega? His society Gulbarg was 2 km away from police commissioner's office in central Ahmedabad. He called Modi and several police official repetedly for 5 hours. Yet no help arrived.

Aur ye proocation Police ke liye bahut convenient excuse hota hai. 1984 mein pehle din sirf Sikhs ki arrest hui thi, woh jinho ne apne self defense ke liye fire kiya that.

I too have some extended family members in police. Baaki police ko jab power ho wo kya kya kar sakti hai, woh sare Punjab ne 80s mein dekha hai. There are too many cases of Police abuse of powers to write down.