जिन्होंने हिंदू धर्म को त्यागा...

SALURAM said:
Jin jaton ko hindu dharam ke sath nahin rahna hain vo hindu dharam ko chodkar chala jaye..... unhe kisne bandh ke rakha hain..
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key baat nakli ..sun ye mandir masjid arr charch jo bhi h mahre(jatta ke).............mare khuryaya p rot jimne aly arr unke pilleya ki aukkat na hoti.
ya batane kay landlords ko kya sochna h. ya samjann ki.........sunuri k balak ki daal mat bol...............bagadi
 
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upendersingh said:
मैं तुम्हारे जैसे कुछ बुद्धिजीवियों की नजरों में 'अच्छा' साबित होने के लिए हिंदू धर्म को बुरा नहीं कह सकता। मुझे हिंदू होने से बहुत से
लाभ मिले हैं, इसलिए मेरा फर्ज है कि जब भी कोई आधारहीन और वाहियात तर्क देकर हिंदू धर्म को नीचा दिखाने का प्रयास करेगा तो मैं अपनी क्षमता के अनुसार अपने धर्म का बचाव करूंगा। मैं हाल-फिलहाल हिंदू धर्म की कोई बहुत बड़ी सेवा नहीं कर सकता, क्योंकि मेरी इतनी क्षमता ही नहीं है। मैं जो हाल-फिलहाल कर सकता हूं, वो बस यह है कि इस महान धर्म के बचाव में लिख सकता हूं। सो वैसा मैं कर रहा हूं। इसका कारण कोई असुरक्षा की भावना नहीं है। कारण यह है कि हिंदू धर्म के बारे में लोगों के मन में गलत विचार भरे जा रहे हैं। यदि कोई स्पष्टीकरण न दे तो झूठ भी दूसरों को सच लगने लगता है। मेरे तर्क कितने हास्यास्पद, बेतुके, बोगस और असुरक्षा से भरपूर हैं, उसके लिए मुझे किसी के भी प्रमाणपत्र की जरूरत नहीं है। दलित अगर बौद्ध धर्म अपना रहे हैं तो अपना नुकसान कर रहे हैं। भारत में हिंदू धर्म को कोसने का मतलब बुद्धिमत्ता की निशानी हो गया है। तुम भी उसी श्रेणी के तो नहीं हो? जब दूसरे मुझे (हिंदू धर्म को) तुच्छ और खुद को महान बताते हैं, तब क्यों खामोश रहते हो? जब कोई हिंदू प्रमाण सहित अपने बचाव में बोलता है तो वह इस्लामिक जेहादी नजर आने लगता है। क्या कहने। मेरे कथन न तो इस धर्म को हास्यास्पद एवं सस्ता बना सकते और न ही तुम्हारे उपरोक्त कथन इसकी छवि बिगाड़ सकते। यदि किसी में ऐसा कुछ करने की क्षमता है तो वह क्षमता तथ्यों और प्रमाणों में है। पिछले 3 हजार सालों में इस दुनिया में बस ईसा मसीह (यहूदी), पैगंबर मोहम्मद (अरबी), बुद्ध और गुरु नानक (दोनों हिंदू) ही ऐसे हुए हैं, जिन्हें व्यापक स्तर पर संसार ने दिव्य पुरुष माना है। इनमें से आधे हिंदू हैं। यानी हिंदू एक तरफ और ये सारा संसार एक तरफ। कोई करके दिखा दो मुसलमानों या सिखों में ऐसा दिव्य पुरुष पैदा। मैं तो फिर उन्हें भी श्रेष्ठ मानने लगूंगा।
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उपेंदर भाई हिंदू धर्म की ऐसी क्या हानि हो गयी की तुम्हे लंगोट कस के अपनी क्षमतानुसार यहाँ धर्म युद्ध में कूदना पड़ा ! ये विषय तुमने की आरम्भ किया है और येन केन प्रकारेण ये प्रमणित करने पर तुले हो की गैर हिंदू ओछे हैं , नीच हैं और महान होने की काबिलियत नहीं है ! जब तुम्हारे अनुसार मेरे या किसी और के कहने से हिंदू धर्म की कोई हानि नहीं है तो ये क्या विचलित स्वभाव दर्शा रहे हो ? ओह ! आखिर लाभ लिया है तो बदला चुका रहे हो ! लेकिन ये कैसा बदला और किस से ?
 
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ye ek ho sake s par jab tak mahre me is upendr berge surdas rahenge itne to ......
 
upendersingh said:
So, if one is Hindu, he can not be secular. And if one is secular, he can not be a Hindu. Great. Sir Chhoturam's birth name was Ramrichpal. When he changed it to Chhoturam, still it had 'ram'. What does it indicate? Read about how much faith he had in Gita. Read also about Jawaharmal how devotee Hindu he was. I will try to put some links later.
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राम न कद कही थी की वो हिन्दू हैं ???? उपेंद्र यो ज्ञान और दे दे :)
 
upendersingh said:
Friend, either you are wrong or this JatLand and rest of world is wrong. Read it :

जून सन् 1768 में जवाहरसिंह किसी घातक धोखे से मार डाले गये। ‘ब्रजेन्द्र-वंश भास्कर’ में उस घातक का नाम सुजात मेव लिखा है। ‘इमाद’ का लेखक लिखता है कि महाराज जबरसिंह ने केवल अजां देने पर एक मनुष्य की जिह्वा निकलवा ली थी। आगरे की मस्जिद को बाजार कर दिया था और उसमें अनाज की दुकानें खुलवा दी थीं। कोई भी कसाई मांस नहीं बेच सकता था। इससे सम्भावना होती है कि किसी तास्सुबी मुसलमान ने उन पर हमला करके मार डाला होगा।
महाराज जवाहरसिंह की मृत्यु के लिए इतना ही कहना पर्याप्त होगा कि जाटों का सितारा, हिन्दु-धर्म का रक्षक, जिसकी अभी भारी आवश्कता थी, असमय में ही विलुप्त हो गया। उनके निधन से जाट-साम्राज्य की गाड़ी तो रुक गई.

Link
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Neither I am in the wrong nor for that matter the Jat Land [the link is open for updating and editing and contains extracts from the book written in 1930's and the Jatland does not forbid anyone from inserting new research based matter.]

If you are ready to update yourself read the following book :

Read, Rise of the Jat Power, Chapter Heritage Maintained deals with Maharaja Jawahar Singh, (1988), Delhi.
 
elders of sansanwal called him jat jawaharmal not maharaja jawaharmal.( puskarbath refrance.).............and this is the real respect that they gives him.
 
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upendersingh said:
So, if one is Hindu, he can not be secular. And if one is secular, he can not be a Hindu. Great. Sir Chhoturam's birth name was Ramrichpal. When he changed it to Chhoturam, still it had 'ram'. What does it indicate? Read about how much faith he had in Gita. Read also about Jawaharmal how devotee Hindu he was. I will try to put some links later.
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HINDU DHARMA sAYS; ''SARAV DHARAM SAMBHAVA''

Paying tribute to the qualities of head and heart of Shri Rama Chandra, the Maryada Purushotam, Allama Mohd. Iqbal has said :

"Hai Ram ke wajood pe Hindustan ko naaz,
Ahl-e-najar samajhate hain unko immam-e-Hind.

.................

Talwar ka dhani tha, shujat mein fard tha,
Pakeezgi mein, josh-e-mahabat mein fard tha.''

i.e.

India is mighty proud of Rama's sacred name,
Discerning minds respect his word as the voice of God.
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Rama was a warrior great, uniquely brave at heart,
A reservoir of love, abounding, pure in word and deed.

Yah sahi mayane mein Ganga-Jamuni Sanskriti ka asar hai jo hume Mahapurushon ki lekhan aur vyaktitava se sikhne ko milta hai.

Allama Iqbal ne hi likha hai Tarana-e-Hindi :

Saare jahan se achha Hindustan hamaara,
Hum bulbalen hain iski, yeh gulistan hamara
--------
Mazhab nahin sikhata aaps mein ber rakhna,
Hindi hain hum, watan hai Hindustan hamaara.

Aur bhi udaharn dekhne hon to Gurbani padhiye jismein Sikh dharam ke baani Guru Nanak Dev ji kahate hain :

SAB MAANUSH KEE EK ZAAT..
 
swaich said:
From NCAER research - Hindus are divided into OBCs, Dalits and forward castes. Even if one only compares with forward castes, Jains, Sikhs and Christians are ahead in per capita income.

Adivasi and Dalit households have the lowest annual incomes: Rs 20,000 and Rs 22,800, respectively.

The Other Backward Classes (OBCs) and Muslim households are slightly better off , with incomes of Rs 26,091 and Rs 28,500, respectively.

The forward castes and other minorities (Jains, Sikhs, and Christians) have the highest median annual incomes: Rs 48,000 and Rs 52,500, respectively.
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Brother, I went through this NCAER research. As it was about 8 year old research, based upon the survey of some 2 lac+ people of various states of India, so it can not be taken seriously. During these about 8 years a lot of things have changed. It may be possible that abovementioned minorities' incomes might have gone higher in comparison with other communities at present, but the opposite is also possible. You can't imagine how rapidly people in Delhi are getting richer day by day as this city hasn't seen any natural calamity for a long time. Who ran tea shops some years back they are buying brand new Volkswagens, Hondas and Toyotas now, getting their old houses built into a 4 storey building in a very short frame of time. Have a look please;
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Five States have overtaken Punjab in terms of per capita income by 2009-10. Both Maharashtra and Haryana now have significantly higher per capita NSDP, though that is not really so surprising since they were both relatively high-income States even in the 1980s and they both overtook Punjab at the turn of the century.
But there are other surprises, particularly Tamil Nadu and Kerala. In 1980-81, per capita income in Punjab was 56 per cent higher than in Tamil Nadu and 27 per cent higher than in Kerala — quite substantial differences. The advantage of Punjab remained through most of the period, really until the middle of the 2000s. However, in the latter half of the 2000s, faster growth in both of these States meant that they now have higher per capita incomes, with the difference in the 6-8 per cent range.
This is not really due to income stagnation in Punjab, since Chart 5 indicates that even in Punjab there was an acceleration of growth from around 2005-06. Rather, it was because growth in these other States was even faster from the early part of the last decade.
Link
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And let's assume this NCAER survey is still right, still you haven't got what I wanted to convey. How many non Hindus have done well on world level? If they haven't, then it means their religion fails to inspire them, fails to give them such a atmosphere they can do well at top most level. That's what I meant.
 
RavinderSura said:
राम न कद कही थी की वो हिन्दू हैं ???? उपेंद्र यो ज्ञान और दे दे :)
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According to Hindu epicRamayana, Rama, the seventh avatar of the god Vishnu, prayed to Shiva here at Rameswaram to absolve any sins that he might have committed during his war against the demon-king Ravana in Sri Lanka. According to the Puranas (Hindu scriptures), upon the advice of sages, Rama along with his wife Sita and his brother Lakshmana, installed and worshipped the lingam (an iconic symbol of Shiva) here to expiate the sin of Brahmahatya incurred while killing of theBrahmin Ravana.

 Link
 
arai Upender; kyu bola ho rehya sai..Tere pai kisse RSS aale ka tagda prabhav padd rehya sai..

Jaat kadd tai itne Hindu hoge!
 
upendersingh said:
According to Hindu epicRamayana, Rama, the seventh avatar of the god Vishnu, prayed to Shiva here at Rameswaram to absolve any sins that he might have committed during his war against the demon-king Ravana in Sri Lanka. According to the Puranas (Hindu scriptures), upon the advice of sages, Rama along with his wife Sita and his brother Lakshmana, installed and worshipped the lingam (an iconic symbol of Shiva) here to expiate the sin of Brahmahatya incurred while killing of theBrahmin Ravana.

 Link
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Epic 'Epic' hota hai Hindu ya anya kisi ka ekadhikaar us pe nahin Hota.

Kyon Ponga Panditvaad ko badhawa de rahe ho Bhai,

Swami Dayanand Saraswati rachit Satyaratha Prakash padho aur
is tarah ke bharam jaal se bahir niklo;

Avashaya Kalyan hoga.

Kabirdaas ne kucchh is prakar kaha hai:

Pahan puje Hari Mile to main pujoon Pahad;

Tate ghar ki chaki bhali, pees khaye sansar.
 
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upendersingh said:
Brother, I went through this NCAER research. As it was about 8 year old research, based upon the survey of some 2 lac+ people of various states of India, so it can not be taken seriously. During these about 8 years a lot of things have changed. It may be possible that abovementioned minorities' incomes might have gone higher in comparison with other communities at present, but the opposite is also possible. You can't imagine how rapidly people in Delhi are getting richer day by day as this city hasn't seen any natural calamity for a long time. Who ran tea shops some years back they are buying brand new Volkswagens, Hondas and Toyotas now, getting their old houses built into a 4 storey building in a very short frame of time. Have a look please;
.........................................................................................................................................................................

Five States have overtaken Punjab in terms of per capita income by 2009-10. Both Maharashtra and Haryana now have significantly higher per capita NSDP, though that is not really so surprising since they were both relatively high-income States even in the 1980s and they both overtook Punjab at the turn of the century.
But there are other surprises, particularly Tamil Nadu and Kerala. In 1980-81, per capita income in Punjab was 56 per cent higher than in Tamil Nadu and 27 per cent higher than in Kerala — quite substantial differences. The advantage of Punjab remained through most of the period, really until the middle of the 2000s. However, in the latter half of the 2000s, faster growth in both of these States meant that they now have higher per capita incomes, with the difference in the 6-8 per cent range.
This is not really due to income stagnation in Punjab, since Chart 5 indicates that even in Punjab there was an acceleration of growth from around 2005-06. Rather, it was because growth in these other States was even faster from the early part of the last decade.
Link
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Agreed, the research is 8 years old. But it does show non-Hindu groups ahead on income levels.

Also agreed, things might have changed in the last 8 years, but the gap may have increased even further.

And let's assume this NCAER survey is still right, still you haven't got what I wanted to convey. How many non Hindus have done well on world level? If they haven't, then it means their religion fails to inspire them, fails to give them such a atmosphere they can do well at top most level. That's what I meant.
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Since you place so much influence on religion being a key determinant of progress, please explain how Hinduism has provided an atmosphere for people to do well at the top most level as you put it. And do share how other religions haven't and its effect on the people who follow it.
 
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Agree or not Jats are Hindu (Sikh Jat is exception). Because we follow Hindu customs, rituals, traditions,celebrate all the Hindu festivals and even do worship (occasionally) of Hanuman and Shiva. Jats are however not religious Hindu and hardly do regular worship and chant bhajan or like that but still we are very much Hindu.

On the other hand if you observe and do analysis you'll find Hinduism more tolerant, liberal and easy going compare to other religions. Even Hindus are more secular, peace loving and easy going compare to other devotees and in fact you'll often see hindus visiting Gurudwara, Masjid, Church etc.

It's kinda strange n' absurd to see few great intellects here are trying to compare devoted Hindus as extremists .. it reminds me of Dumb a$$ Rahul Gandhi who once said we have more threat from 'Saffron' terrorism then Muslims extremists!

Come on guys, stop being over Gyaani! Even 'Ram Ram' comes from Hinduism !



 
cooljat said:
.

Agree or not Jats are Hindu (Sikh Jat is exception). Because we follow Hindu customs, rituals, traditions,celebrate all the Hindu festivals and even do worship (occasionally) of Hanuman and Shiva. Jats are however not religious Hindu and hardly do regular worship and chant bhajan or like that but still we are very much Hindu.

On the other hand if you observe and do analysis you'll find Hinduism more tolerant, liberal and easy going compare to other religions. Even Hindus are more secular, peace loving and easy going compare to other devotees and in fact you'll often see hindus visiting Gurudwara, Masjid, Church etc.

It's kinda strange n' absurd to see few great intellects here are trying to compare devoted Hindus as extremists .. it reminds me of Dumb a$$ Rahul Gandhi who once said we have more threat from 'Saffron' terrorism then Muslims extremists!

Come on guys, stop being over Gyaani! Even 'Ram Ram' comes from Hinduism !
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You would probably see if Sagotra Marriage Issues is not solved under Hindu Marriage Act, Haryanavi Jats would desert Hinduism sooner than later.
 
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cooljat said:
.

Agree or not Jats are Hindu (Sikh Jat is exception). Because we follow Hindu customs, rituals, traditions,celebrate all the Hindu festivals and even do worship (occasionally) of Hanuman and Shiva. Jats are however not religious Hindu and hardly do regular worship and chant bhajan or like that but still we are very much Hindu.

On the other hand if you observe and do analysis you'll find Hinduism more tolerant, liberal and easy going compare to other religions. Even Hindus are more secular, peace loving and easy going compare to other devotees and in fact you'll often see hindus visiting Gurudwara, Masjid, Church etc.

It's kinda strange n' absurd to see few great intellects here are trying to compare devoted Hindus as extremists .. it reminds me of Dumb a$$ Rahul Gandhi who once said we have more threat from 'Saffron' terrorism then Muslims extremists!

Come on guys, stop being over Gyaani! Even 'Ram Ram' comes from Hinduism !
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I think the main intent of Upender bhai was to show that Hinduism as a religion is better than others and everyone who left its fold to join another religion has suffered. I am sure you'll agree that its futile to prove such a thing.
 
You are absolutely right; rather it is not only futile exercise but also useless and far fetched idea !

No religion is good or bad, but from time to time, its adherents make it so.
 
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