what about intercaste marriage?

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narenderkharb said:
Quote Sid ....
If your parents love you and care for you, they will be on your side, they will have your back, otherwise they are one of those people who run when sh*t hits the fan.





Sorry Priti If these are your thinking view ,I am happy with my exclusionary views with some scope for our parents let me re-post my earlier post in this regard .
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Narender,
Why would you marrying somebody of your choice just kill your parents?
Do the parents know more about the person you are planning to marry than you do? Do they have the crystal ball to look into the future? DO they have the smoking gun against this person of your choice which they can use as proof to show you that this person that you are planning to marry is the devil. Their opposition would most probably be guided by societal pressure - if they give in to that pressure and are responsible for splitting you from your loved one - then they are clearly being unfair - they care more for the society and their so-called prestige than they care about you. That was my whole point. Personally, I care for individuals - my parents, a friend .... I donot care for society. I would also expect the same from them.

Get a load of what Nietzsche has to say..........
In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule.
Friedrich Nietzsche
 
narenderkharb said:
Quote ..
reasons are historical



Please read Chachnama the story of marriage of a Jat king Sahasi and his brahman queen Suhandhi ,The single intercast marriage is the turning point of jat history from their glorious to worst days .Story is lengthy and not suitable in this section.
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If you had read my post - you might have noticed that I was not talking about a scenario in the medieval times. Personally, I donot believe these stories if they are not supported by the right amount of evidence - there has to be some detail........ so I reckon Chachnama will not make my reading list. I hope you just eat up that pageturner.
 
narenderkharb said:
Quote ..
reasons are historical



Please read Chachnama the story of marriage of a Jat king Sahasi and his brahman queen Suhandhi ,The single intercast marriage is the turning point of jat history from their glorious to worst days .Story is lengthy and not suitable in this section.
Click to expand...

narenderkharb said:
Good to know people understand that there can be Jat values too.

When any one marries outside ,certainly these values are to be halved Now intelligent people may advocate a judicious mix of various values and we can see some ready mix formulae like daughter of a jat and khatri married to a brahman to get the desired package of values.
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Seems like you are very interested in mixing and the results of mixing.

Try mixing music, colors, fruit juice, salad , bhelpuri. Dr. Frankestein, Please leave people alone, let them mix with whoever they want to
 
Poonam, Priti.......... total respect..... you girls have more balls than some of the men here.
To Narender and company.... you need to realize that the girl involved in the intercaste marriage is the one under the radar...... try thinking from their point of view - you will understand what I am trying to say.......... show some respect to women I think a real Jat would do that.

Girls stay strong ... stay rebellious... because thats who you are.
 
sidchhikara said:
Narender,
Why would you marrying somebody of your choice just kill your parents?
Do the parents know more about the person you are planning to marry than you do? Do they have the crystal ball to look into the future? DO they have the smoking gun against this person of your choice which they can use as proof to show you that this person that you are planning to marry is the devil. Their opposition would most probably be guided by societal pressure - if they give in to that pressure and are responsible for splitting you from your loved one - then they are clearly being unfair - they care more for the society and their so-called prestige than they care about you. That was my whole point. Personally, I care for individuals - my parents, a friend .... I donot care for society. I would also expect the same from them.

Get a load of what Nietzsche has to say..........
In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule.
Friedrich Nietzsche
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Siddhrth

So you will know all and those guys who had lived it won't know anything about it .

Love and life before and after marriage is not same which only your parents know as they had understood better than which you can't imagine ,like
the punjabi girl you are marrying may not like the daman or slang of your mummy ,your father may not like the pik of banarsi pann that your father in law of UP like so much or your punjabi girl may slap your brother who wants to play holi in desi style etc etc some possibilities which may or may not happen .And what is this attitude for our parents if you support my choice than ok otherwise go your own way ,Don't you trust your parents at all ,won't they like your happiness ,Don't they have this ability to take a decision for your own good .

And don't go for negative assumptions that father will brake marriage for pride sake only ,if that being case why we listen so many clan disputes where parents ignore social customs when they find a good match for their childern.All I want to say let us not be selfish and have faiths in them who learnt us to walk by holding our finger
 
sidchhikara said:
Poonam, Priti.......... total respect..... you girls have more balls than some of the men here.
To Narender and company.... you need to realize that the girl involved in the intercaste marriage is the one under the radar...... try thinking from their point of view - you will understand what I am trying to say.......... show some respect to women I think a real Jat would do that.

Girls stay strong ... stay rebellious... because thats who you are.
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What was that ?.I thought you can debate graciously ,Sorry I quit.

I intervened here as the topic was importnat to our community any way best of luck.
 
narenderkharb said:
Good to know people understand that there can be Jat values too.

When any one marries outside ,certainly these values are to be halved Now intelligent people may advocate a judicious mix of various values and we can see some ready mix formulae like daughter of a jat and khatri married to a brahman to get the desired package of values.
Click to expand...

Good to know that sarcasm and disdain is a refuge for few over a rational logic.

I am as much proud Jat as you are. I segregate the issue of marriage and dont confuse it with the Jat values.

C'mon, I'm sure , just like me, you too have come across many Jats who were not very proud or dare I say embarassed (more so before Sehwag n those couple of Bollywood jat celebrities times) to disclose the fact that they belong to the community. BUT not to mention, that they do go and marry within the community. I would rather be Jat like I am than be like them.

Why would someone marry within the community:

1. Did not fall in love (with someone outside): Smooth
2. Did fall in love but failed to placate parents and relented to their wish.
3. Already predetermined to marry within the community because (a) dont want to give thier parents a hard time OR (b) strongly attached to the "Jat" factor for whatever reasons.

Now majority belongs to 1,2 and 3 (a) and only a handful belong to 3(b). Do I need to say more.

Well, IMO, I just don’t have any problem whatsoever, for any Jat man or a woman marrying whosoever as long as they are happy and their parents are happy and they respect theirs and their spouse's family/caste/culture/values. I don’t give a damn what others say.

And if you marry only for the heck of, what was that, what did ya say, yes..“ready mix formulae” then its nothing but sheer STUPIDITY.

Also, lets face another bitter fact: If you are a proud Jat (for that matter any caste) just because you are born as a jat, well, I'm sorry to say thats no good either!!

(Though I already bid adieu from this thread in my last post, but was too tempted to reply to this one. Anyway I’m done with this thread, for sure, now!)
 
narenderkharb said:
Siddhrth

So you will know all and those guys who had lived it won't know anything about it .

Love and life before and after marriage is not same which only your parents know as they had understood better than which you can't imagine ,like
the punjabi girl you are marrying may not like the daman or slang of your mummy ,your father may not like the pik of banarsi pann that your father in law of UP like so much or your punjabi girl may slap your brother who wants to play holi in desi style etc etc some possibilities which may or may not happen .And what is this attitude for our parents if you support my choice than ok otherwise go your own way ,Don't you trust your parents at all ,won't they like your happiness ,Don't they have this ability to take a decision for your own good .

And don't go for negative assumptions that father will brake marriage for pride sake only ,if that being case why we listen so many clan disputes where parents ignore social customs when they find a good match for their childern.All I want to say let us not be selfish and have faiths in them who learnt us to walk by holding our finger
Click to expand...

I think you would know more about all these idiosyncracies about the person you are wanting to marry than you parents. So, like I said in my earlier post if you are happy with people within your caste for some reason, then that is your personal decision. If you think all those things are very important, then your decision will be based on that. The decision should not be made on caste alone. If you donot trust the person you are wanting to marry to care for the things that are important to you than your love would not be strong and you maynot end up marrying anyways. Point is not to generalize things - thats what gets me. Your parents have to let go of you once you are an adult - they cannot always control you. The consequences for the good or bad decisions you make will be yours - but you will always have the satisfaction of making one. I think parents should guide you through your formative years - after that you are on your own - because all humans have free will and that is hard to suppress without consequences for the suppressor in one way or another.
 
poonam said:
Well, IMO, I just don’t have any problem whatsoever, for any Jat man or a woman marrying whosoever as long as they are happy and their parents are happy and they respect theirs and their spouse's family/caste/culture/values. I don’t give a damn what others say.

Also, lets face another bitter fact: If you are a proud Jat (for that matter any caste) just because you are born as a jat, well, I'm sorry to say thats no good either!!

(Though I already bid adieu from this thread in my last post, but was too tempted to reply to this one. Anyway I’m done with this thread, for sure, now!)
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Well if you believe in parents happiness too , I don't have any conflict ,My view point from the beginning is we must never overlook our parents and give due respect to their sacrifices and their advice cannot be thrown like a **** etc.

However I would like to correct you here if you are a proud Jat than it is because of your jat identity which you got the day you are born and is due to certain values and characters associated with your jat ancesstors.What ever other greatness we achieve that is individual having name A,B,or C.and have nothing related to jatness.

I too quitted as the discussion started being personal but had to respond you via this last post of mine in thread.
 
narenderkharb said:
Well if you believe in parents happiness too , I don't have any conflict ,My view point from the beginning is we must never overlook our parents and give due respect to their sacrifices and their advice cannot be thrown like a **** etc.

However I would like to correct you here if you are a proud Jat than it is because of your jat identity which you got the day you are born and is due to certain values and characters associated with your jat ancesstors.What ever other greatness we achieve that is individual having name A,B,or C.and have nothing related to jatness.

I too quitted as the discussion started being personal but had to respond you via this last post of mine in thread.
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Well, I feel you should be proud of something you achieve as an individual. Being born as Jat was not your decision. That was your parents decision - so they can be proud that they produced a Jat baby and that would make perfect sense. As an analogy....I am proud because I was born with 11 fingers - one more!! ... yea!!

Just my opinion - I know lot of ppl here might disagree.
 
No....... it was due to uncontrolled activities..;)...... No one was wting for u curiously . U stunned everyone...........
sidchhikara said:
Well, I feel you should be proud of something you achieve as an individual. Being born as Jat was not your decision. That was your parents decision - so they can be proud that they produced a Jat baby and that would make perfect sense. As an analogy....I am proud because I was born with 11 fingers - one more!! ... yea!!

Just my opinion - I know lot of ppl here might disagree.
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great...

Life is changing.........
individuality is peremeating our society.......
good for individuals but a bit disastrous for relationships..........

........
some times I find myself the richest person...
because have seen the different phases of life............
Army, Govt. College(Degree,jhagde, politics), Engineering College(MNREC),Village ,Farming,Disputes for lands, massacres for (ego,land, woman),Corporate Culture(TCS,American Express), Business(The true reality of being a Dheeru bhi Ambani), Stock Market(Sub broker), Financial Market (Insurance BA, silver2),Art(Calligraphy, Miniature), Music(Guitar)......pata nahin kahan kahan..dhakke khaye hain..hahahh
and now heading for GMAT........chhoti si life mein bahut kuch dekha..just 26....
Here everybody is emphasising on his/her own justifications.....achhi baat hai....
but kya marriage itna jaroori hai ...why can't we have relationships without marriages......the intercaste problems galore vanish in a spur of moment
if change is so necessary....why shoudn't this one......

some will raise moral issues.....(ek baar dhanda (business) karo sab smhaj mein aa jayega.....)
some may point societal problems......precisely...the society we live in....our psyche is framed in the same fashion....
the thing that i want to highlight is....we think like this because we are like this...(simply the Anthropic principle)
A lion can never think of showing mercy on a deer...now we can't call a lion a culprit one....(this may not be relevant) but oozing out the smell of my thought.....
just get out of your mind and start thinking ...if you can..you can understand the ground reality of the topic being discussed here........

thoda heavy ho gaya hai I believe............
joke suno.....

ek baar apne raande ..ek fauji te takra ge jo america ho ki aa rya tha....
fauji ne batai..re ada haando so...america mein to ek aadmi ki ghani ghani bahu sein......
ya baat sun ki raandyan ne program fit karya aur bus ki poorani ticket bhi tha li........itne mein fauji bolya...re bawlyo bera se...america saat samundar paar ..se......
to bera se...raande ke bole....(guessss...)

RAANDE:: RE FAUJI BAHU khatar to haaam tir ki bhi jaa sakaan saan....

hahahahha

chill gys...life is too small for things to happen.....

Rakesh Kumar Grewal
 
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Bhai Grewal.......theek kahi..... Modern Jats/Jatnis must follow this trend.........kahi bhi.. kissi bi bhi gail kollam- kolla ho lyo............................

greatjat said:
Life is changing.........
individuality is peremeating our society.......
good for individuals but a bit disastrous for relationships..........

........
some times I find myself the richest person...
because have seen the different phases of life............
Army, Govt. College(Degree,jhagde, politics), Engineering College(MNREC),Village ,Farming,Disputes for lands, massacres for (ego,land, woman),Corporate Culture(TCS,American Express), Business(The true reality of being a Dheeru bhi Ambani), Stock Market(Sub broker), Financial Market (Insurance BA, silver2),Art(Calligraphy, Miniature), Music(Guitar)......pata nahin kahan kahan..dhakke khaye hain..hahahh
and now heading for GMAT........chhoti si life mein bahut kuch dekha..just 26....
Here everybody is emphasising on his/her own justifications.....achhi baat hai....
but kya marriage itna jaroori hai ...why can't we have relationships without marriages......the intercaste problems galore vanish in a spur of moment
if change is so necessary....why shoudn't this one......

some will raise moral issues.....(ek baar dhanda (business) karo sab smhaj mein aa jayega.....)
some may point societal problems......precisely...the society we live in....our psyche is framed in the same fashion....
the thing that i want to highlight is....we think like this because we are like this...(simply the Anthropic principle)
A lion can never think of showing mercy on a deer...now we can't call a lion a culprit one....(this may not be relevant) but oozing out the smell of my thought.....
just get out of your mind and start thinking ...if you can..you can understand the ground reality of the topic being discussed here........

thoda heavy ho gaya hai I believe............
joke suno.....

ek baar apne raande ..ek fauji te takra ge jo america ho ki aa rya tha....
fauji ne batai..re ada haando so...america mein to ek aadmi ki ghani ghani bahu sein......
ya baat sun ki raandyan ne program fit karya aur bus ki poorani ticket bhi tha li........itne mein fauji bolya...re bawlyo bera se...america saat samundar paar ..se......
to bera se...raande ke bole....(guessss...)

RAANDE:: RE FAUJI BAHU khatar to haaam tir ki bhi jaa sakaan saan....

hahahahha

chill gys...life is too small for things to happen.....

Rakesh Kumar Grewal
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Ristedaar/ Gaam-aale/ Padausee etc. Ke kahenge?

Narender bhai and others who support his views:

I believe the single most important reason for jats to remain backward is the fear of the reaction of others. "Ristedaar kya kahege, Gaamaale kya kahenge, padossi kya kahenge etc." This kind of sentiments are extressed not only in relation to marriage or to be precise love/ intercaste marriage but onything unconventional. And doing so, invariably we suppress the inner feeling of our loved one and of self too.
Also many a times relatives or friends oppose this for unnecessary false pride.
I remember a true incident. Few years ago a distant relative called me from Bahamas, to enquie about a Punjabi boy in relation to her sister-in law. The Punjabi boy and jat girl did their PG from Dehli University and loved each other and wanted to marry. The girls mother a widow agreed after initial hesitatation but her uncles wouldn't budge. Their objection was just false pride and baseless apprehentions. They would say," Kisse ne uthan baithan joga chhodegi ke nahi" . You know who were the uthan baithanya, "Saaradeen taas pitaniyan, paatpaad, aur sanj ne talli hoke gharran jaane waale.

Finally the courageous mother and daughter got support from the more informed relatives .

And most important is individual liberty and equality of genders. All of you must have seen is that there is hardly any problem when a Jat boy marries a non jat girl but the sky falls on earth if a jat girl dares to do so.

My sincere advise to all those who are at cross roads is, " Listen to your heart".jhoothi shaan, jhoodi chaudher" would lead you no where.

My humble request to the members who write something silly to make their presence felt. It may be reasonable to make your point forcefully but shouldn't be at the cost of somebody ego.I mean we shouldn't hurt self esteem of anybody to win an argument.

Three Cheers to you all brave jatnis, keep supporting what you believe in.

Finally Narenderbhai, Could you please list me some parameters or Jat values you keep refering ,which make a proud jat or true jat or great jat?



Cheers!
 
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Why All This Debate......???

Don't you all think it's a very individual, or family matter to decide whether marry intra or intercaste....!!!
I do not feel that it's an issue where need to bring social reforms and hence to argue so much.
 
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prashantacmet said:
As time has changed & the present environment is totally different now. Intercaste marriages are so common . I need to know the opinion of ONLINE jats about intercase marriage. It is a fact that JATs are deeply rooted to their customs & traditions. but the circumstances can change the thinking...........
I am really excited to get know the opinion of the JATs about this. Please
tell your views about intercaste marriage.


Prashant chaudhary
_--------------------
JAI BHAGWAN JAT BALWAN
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Dear Prashant,

The Laws of Nature say that if two people from different gene pools marry there offspring will be more advantaged compared to from the same gene pool as the offspring has got different traits from different pools which increase its chances of survival. This caste system is quite rubbish which has divided the Hindu society like anything making India an ideal place for Foreign Invaders. Now also we are divided like anything even in a Village.
It is time for us to unite forgeting caste but thinking the country to make Hindustan a real superpower.
 
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