Everybody wants change but to see the change one must be the change
Unless people change, asking change is changing your expectations beyond a certain limit of change
Haryana Assembly Elections 09: Khabar, Zayza, Mahol, Halaat!!
- Thread starter samarkadian
- Start date
Everybody wants change but to see the change one must be the change
Unless people change, asking change is changing your expectations beyond a certain limit of change
badgujarsampat
Banned
Apne to apne hote hain.
I don't think its CM's decision to dissolve assembly prior to its scheduled dissolution.
No CM wants to reduce his tenure. Especially when air is clear breezing victory for certain.He is CM , he knows the political process...that HARYANVIS need atleast two terms before they act decisively (In / Out).
They are not so quick that few months can turn the story.
History supports my words as Chautalas were rulers in 1987-1991....
then only after two terms ( ending in 95 , 98)
they got back the throne!
It is pressure from 10 Janpath, Where baseless leaders are filling ears of Sonia , as such leaders becoz of inborn FEAR in them , wants to be doubly sure.
We JATs should not PROMOTE such things in our LAND OF MARTYRS. We are rulers of ourselves.
AVOID voting for CONGRESS as if we vote in favour then we are accepting SLAVERY.
CM Hooda is compelled in lure of THRONE , but WE AS JATs have no compulsion.
ALL THOSE WHO VOTE FOR CONGRESS MUST REMEMBER YOU ARE ACCEPTING TO BE RULED BY OUTSIDE FORCES.
OUTSIDE TO STATE.
BANIA BAHMANN REFUGEE are ready to be ruled by outsider as they know they need outside forces to defeat JATs. They alone cannot do it.
But being JAT we have no compulsion to accept to be ruled by others! ( Those who are not ours !! )
First these outside forces will fetch our Livelihood , our lands.
Then compel our next generation to work as slaves in form of security guard / office boy or any such!
If you don't want to think for yourself , think atleast for your future generation.
Because of slavery of outside forces we got CMs like Bhajan Lal.
Save future of your kids.
I don't think its CM's decision to dissolve assembly prior to its scheduled dissolution.
No CM wants to reduce his tenure. Especially when air is clear breezing victory for certain.He is CM , he knows the political process...that HARYANVIS need atleast two terms before they act decisively (In / Out).
They are not so quick that few months can turn the story.
History supports my words as Chautalas were rulers in 1987-1991....
then only after two terms ( ending in 95 , 98)
they got back the throne!
It is pressure from 10 Janpath, Where baseless leaders are filling ears of Sonia , as such leaders becoz of inborn FEAR in them , wants to be doubly sure.
We JATs should not PROMOTE such things in our LAND OF MARTYRS. We are rulers of ourselves.
AVOID voting for CONGRESS as if we vote in favour then we are accepting SLAVERY.
CM Hooda is compelled in lure of THRONE , but WE AS JATs have no compulsion.
ALL THOSE WHO VOTE FOR CONGRESS MUST REMEMBER YOU ARE ACCEPTING TO BE RULED BY OUTSIDE FORCES.
OUTSIDE TO STATE.
BANIA BAHMANN REFUGEE are ready to be ruled by outsider as they know they need outside forces to defeat JATs. They alone cannot do it.
But being JAT we have no compulsion to accept to be ruled by others! ( Those who are not ours !! )
First these outside forces will fetch our Livelihood , our lands.
Then compel our next generation to work as slaves in form of security guard / office boy or any such!
If you don't want to think for yourself , think atleast for your future generation.
Because of slavery of outside forces we got CMs like Bhajan Lal.
Save future of your kids.
A
anilsinghd
Guest
Sure enough its not undemocratic! I never called it so!
I talked with a person on ground for the elections and he also gave me the same argument that there are elections elsewhere in Oct and so the election commission can sync the two elections!
But when you take into consideration that is the same policy happens quite too often , lets say it happens in 10 states , then we are actually ( sorry its a bit mathematical argument) loosing money equivalent of a one full term, 5 year govt elections , are not we ?
Because we would gain very very little by scaling up the elections ( from the point of view of election commission) than loosing over ballot papers , election duties , other expenses.
My argument is over a long run of this policy!
thanks!
Vikas , frankly i dont cae about opposition , so if tomorrow opposition says that Hooda must come forward and apologise to state for blah blah and blah , would they do that ? No.
and on top of that they are in charge , they recommend this thing to the governor!
They are thrusted with responsibility of the welfare of the state!
It is for sure their responsibility!
The painful thing is that there are very few who will understand this argument though so they are virtually very safe!
meerasansanwal
New member
Sure enough its not undemocratic! I never called it so!
I talked with a person on ground for the elections and he also gave me the same argument that there are elections elsewhere in Oct and so the election commission can sync the two elections!
But when you take into consideration that is the same policy happens quite too often , lets say it happens in 10 states , then we are actually ( sorry its a bit mathematical argument) loosing money equivalent of a one full term, 5 year govt elections , are not we ?
Because we would gain very very little by scaling up the elections ( from the point of view of election commission) than loosing over ballot papers , election duties , other expenses.
My argument is over a long run of this policy!
I think Election Commission has services of Statisticians. Had long run been the case they would have made the point already. Your apprehension may be delusional though.
It is a simple political calculation.
If i am benefiting today by elections and i have power to get it done, why wont i? Wont the same people who might criticize my decision today of a pre-poll call me stupid for not encashing a brilliant opportunity that i have today of ensuring my win?
Continuing on what you said, if everyone is so concerned about running a government for 5 years then why dont we have a Bi-Party structure where in one party gets an absolute majority and can run the govt the way they want?
Or
Why doesn't all the parties support the largest party to help EC save some money?
Everyone is out there to rule, democratically or not is a different question
If i am benefiting today by elections and i have power to get it done, why wont i? Wont the same people who might criticize my decision today of a pre-poll call me stupid for not encashing a brilliant opportunity that i have today of ensuring my win?
Continuing on what you said, if everyone is so concerned about running a government for 5 years then why dont we have a Bi-Party structure where in one party gets an absolute majority and can run the govt the way they want?
Or
Why doesn't all the parties support the largest party to help EC save some money?
Everyone is out there to rule, democratically or not is a different question
A
anilsinghd
Guest
Thank you for your time! I tried and put across a simple argument forward , I stop here irrespective.
Thanks,
anil
A
anilsinghd
Guest
Vikas , a couple of points and i guess you will appreciate:
1) I did not take a stand against Congress here , this decision of a pre poll just put forward an example of the same though!
2) Your suggestions are forward looking and i truly appreciate that. What i meant though was an appreciation of the "present".
Irrespective of a party , any one who dissolves the assembly or the parliament unless it is absolutely necessary to do so is a culprit!
Thanks,
Anil
samarkadian
Active member
Anil,
Good questions.
Other members like Vikas, Meera has tried to answer it still it is there. It is very easy to criticise politics and government from our angles. If you would involve in small process of governance you would change your opinion to another side. Raj Chalana Aasan Kam Nahi Hai.
Why did they dissolve or why someone dissolves a bit earlier?
# Possibly in hope to gain it before opposition takes up any issues. You know in election Hawa/lahar plays more than works many times. Power is seductive, irrespective of its operational field.
Now Money in elections:
Another important issue is Money spent for contesting an election for MLA. It is one crore rupess.[moderate] what do you say would it be stopped if elections are held on time? NO probably! A big No..
If election commission can be realy 'strict' about this in India, it could be an another equation for society, I am sure.
These observations show as if we Jats have no self confidence. How about if Bajan Lala Mayawati combination comes in power? Bajan Lala or his son will have to camp permanently in Lucknow and send monthly payments to her majesty. Is there any chance that Mr Chautala can form government on how own in Haryana?
By the way what interests of Haryana have been surrendered to outsiders? There was time when we in western UP used to look down at Haryana. Now its other way. We feel at least 30 years behind and no way in our life time we can catch Haryana as far as development is concerned.
Count your blessings that you have persons like present CM. Farmers of Haryana are the most lucky as they get the highest price for their produce. In UP we had Gunda raj of Mulayam and now of Mayawati... Chautala and Mayawati are two sides of same coin....both like eracting statues... only scales differ.
RK^2
Early Elections.
Haryana Assembly has been desolved becoz Hooda is looking forward for another term and for that it is right time for Elections becoz opposition is confused a little bit and they dont have the MUDDA. Even Mr.Hooda has no new MUDDAS, last time he has given the promise of SYL water and Hansi-Butana canal, where are those, he even doesnot talk of that not on single occasion why, Supreme court has given the verdict in the favour of HARYANA, central Govt is also congress dominated and Captain Amrinder Singh was also there in Punjab then why not Hooda tried to solve the Problem of Jeevan Rekha of Haryana, and now he is even not mentioning it at all. Also Mr. Hooda is using public funds towards No.1 HARYANA campaign after dessolving the Assembly, he is a only caretaker CM now and he is using Govt machinery for his own gains, public of Haryana is looking to that also.:rock
Haryana Assembly has been desolved becoz Hooda is looking forward for another term and for that it is right time for Elections becoz opposition is confused a little bit and they dont have the MUDDA. Even Mr.Hooda has no new MUDDAS, last time he has given the promise of SYL water and Hansi-Butana canal, where are those, he even doesnot talk of that not on single occasion why, Supreme court has given the verdict in the favour of HARYANA, central Govt is also congress dominated and Captain Amrinder Singh was also there in Punjab then why not Hooda tried to solve the Problem of Jeevan Rekha of Haryana, and now he is even not mentioning it at all. Also Mr. Hooda is using public funds towards No.1 HARYANA campaign after dessolving the Assembly, he is a only caretaker CM now and he is using Govt machinery for his own gains, public of Haryana is looking to that also.:rock
Last edited:
akshaymalik84
Active member
Are we talking about Election commission money or any particular Party's Money?
Well if we are talking about EC money then The Secretariat of the Commission has an independent budget, which is finalised directly in consultation between the Commission and the Finance Ministry of the Union Government. The latter generally accepts the recommendations of the Commission for its budgets.
The major expenditure on actual conduct of elections is, however, reflected in the budgets of the concerned constituent unit of the Union - State and Union Territory. If elections are being held only for the Parliament, the expenditure is borne entirely by the Union Government while for the elections being held only for the State Legislature, the expenditure is borne entirely by the concerned State. In case of simultaneous elections to the Parliament and State Legislature, the expenditure is shared equally between the Union and the State Governments.
So dissolving assembly earlier(if parliament and assembly election are to be happend separately) than normal time won't effect EC expenditure that much.
It may effect the party expenditure as the ruling party will always take the advantage of current mood/Lehar in the state. If the mood is in favour of ruling party then they will spend less and vice versa.
Well if we are talking about EC money then The Secretariat of the Commission has an independent budget, which is finalised directly in consultation between the Commission and the Finance Ministry of the Union Government. The latter generally accepts the recommendations of the Commission for its budgets.
The major expenditure on actual conduct of elections is, however, reflected in the budgets of the concerned constituent unit of the Union - State and Union Territory. If elections are being held only for the Parliament, the expenditure is borne entirely by the Union Government while for the elections being held only for the State Legislature, the expenditure is borne entirely by the concerned State. In case of simultaneous elections to the Parliament and State Legislature, the expenditure is shared equally between the Union and the State Governments.
So dissolving assembly earlier(if parliament and assembly election are to be happend separately) than normal time won't effect EC expenditure that much.
It may effect the party expenditure as the ruling party will always take the advantage of current mood/Lehar in the state. If the mood is in favour of ruling party then they will spend less and vice versa.
Last edited:
akshaymalik84
Active member
TO get rid of the growing influence and vulgar show of money during elections, the EC has made many suggestions in this regard. The Commission has fixed legal limits on the amount of money which a candidate can spend during the election campaign. These limits have been revised from time to time. During 2004 elections, the ceiling limits for Lok Sabha seats varied between Rs 10,00,000 to Rs 25,00,000. For Assembly seats, the highest limit was Rs 10,00,000 and the lowest limit was Rs 5,00,000. The EC, by appointing expenditure observers keeps an eye on the individual accounts of election expenditure made by a candidate during election campaign.The contestants are also required to give details of expenditure within 30 days of the declaration of the election results. However, political parties do not adhere to the financial Lakashman Rekha (limits) as huge amounts are spent by parties under the garb of their supporters.
Its very difficult to maintain and control the expenditure with just over 300 members of Election commission which too is influenced by the political parties.
Its very difficult to maintain and control the expenditure with just over 300 members of Election commission which too is influenced by the political parties.
anilsangwan
Active member
Thoda sambhalkar aur soch samajh kar likho uncle ji.......
Chautala only erected statues of his father (needless to mention "A great Jat Leader")--- that too when later was no more. You may compare development of Chautala or Goondagardi during his time with that in UP now...... but please bear in mind that Tau Devilal's statues can not be compared with that of your CM Mayawati. Jats can not think of such comparision...
btw Ch Chautala has not erected statues of self till now !!!! If you wish to criticise Mayawati or Chautala saab... write whatever you want....but no unnecessary dragging the matter of Tau Devilal's statues . Hope you understand.
Chautala only erected statues of his father (needless to mention "A great Jat Leader")--- that too when later was no more. You may compare development of Chautala or Goondagardi during his time with that in UP now...... but please bear in mind that Tau Devilal's statues can not be compared with that of your CM Mayawati. Jats can not think of such comparision...
btw Ch Chautala has not erected statues of self till now !!!! If you wish to criticise Mayawati or Chautala saab... write whatever you want....but no unnecessary dragging the matter of Tau Devilal's statues . Hope you understand.
Last edited:
If you read my post carefully, I said that " only scales differ". Is it not true that Chautala eracted large number of statues of Ch Devilal all over Haryana in Devilal parks exactly like what Mayawati is doing of Kansi Ram parks and Ambedkar parks. Only difference is that she is adding her own statues also and constructing on a grander scale.
RK^2
anilsangwan
Active member
I read your post carefully and then only replied uncle ji !....
Yes, he did. But then it can not happen that for present govt you compare Development of UP Vs Development of Hry and for former CM, you compare Statues of his great father with Statues of UP CM......I feel pity on your comparision idea!
If there can be statues of Gandhi, JL Nehru, Indira and Rajiv ----- why not that of Kanshi Ram or Ch Devilal ?? Do you think Tau Devilal was a smaller leader infront of them? Didnt he do something for his state?
Haan lekin Mayawati ka khud ki statues lagaana galat hai ...... !!! Lekin when you compare... why not compare Mayawati's statues with that of Mahatma Gandhi OR with that of Nehru ( and see how much money was spent in those statues)..Why Mayawati Vs Chaudhary Devilal?? ---- kis level ka comparision kiya yeh ???
Anyways you carry on with your theory. Done from my side !!!
Yes, he did. But then it can not happen that for present govt you compare Development of UP Vs Development of Hry and for former CM, you compare Statues of his great father with Statues of UP CM......I feel pity on your comparision idea!
If there can be statues of Gandhi, JL Nehru, Indira and Rajiv ----- why not that of Kanshi Ram or Ch Devilal ?? Do you think Tau Devilal was a smaller leader infront of them? Didnt he do something for his state?
Haan lekin Mayawati ka khud ki statues lagaana galat hai ...... !!! Lekin when you compare... why not compare Mayawati's statues with that of Mahatma Gandhi OR with that of Nehru ( and see how much money was spent in those statues)..Why Mayawati Vs Chaudhary Devilal?? ---- kis level ka comparision kiya yeh ???
Anyways you carry on with your theory. Done from my side !!!
Last edited:
rakeshsehrawat
New member
There is a park near mr. Hooda's House it was known as D-Park chautala eracted statue of Mr. M.K.Gandhi. Our CM now made a park of 48 acres in Rohtak IMT with statue of his father. Named as sanvidhan sathal. There is a park in delhi Chaudhary Charan Singh udyan. The parks made all over haryana were made at places which were ignored and looked like garbage dump. If CM have objection he can change name i don't think parks were registered to some person's name and he can use that for personal purpose.
Mein jab chota tha to kayee chauraho par murtiyan lagi hui thee rohtak mein baad mein wo murtiyan doosre netao se badal di gayee. Agar meri yaddasht sahi hai to rohtak court ke pass ambedkar ki murti hoti thee ab Netaji Subash Chander Bose ki murti hai. Abhi Devilal ki murtiyan nayee hain purani hokar tutne lagengi to kisi aur ki murti us jagah aa jayegi. Lekin is baat se koi inkar nahi kar sakta ki Devilal ji jato ke bahut bade neta the. Agar ye murtiyan chaudhary choturam ji ki murti ki jagah lagai jati to aapka gussa jayaj hota. Logo ko park milne se bahut fayde hain bus dekhne ka nazariya chahiye.
A
anilsinghd
Guest
Thank you Samar for catching the intended point!
I am not oblivious to the the reasons behind the early elections and other information like combined ele ctions etc.
What i put forward was a simple fact that if you keep repeating this over and over again , the "term" of the government will never be fulfilled and it will always be a 4 and a half year and then it is nonsense to call the full term as 5 years.
What i am talking here ( Akshay this is in response to your question) is not the party money or EC money ( I am guessing they will remain the same ) but the taxpayer money!
Do not thin k on the line that ki 6 mahine baad hone they , ab ho gaye to kya farak padta hai ...!
Think on the line that if this is repeated many a time , 6 months * N repetitions can be big enough for a one full term.
So long run it is painful and ofcourse we never have elections postponed for 6 months even after full 5year so there is no cancellation of above evil!
The point I raised was not party or state specific but in general and we need to give a tight slap on the fa ce of politicians/party who advocate and practice such a policy!
akshaymalik84
Active member
Yes, Anil I missed your point here.
But then again, Democracy is all about manipulation. And Rulers manipulate everything thing to gain power. I see no harm in that.
As far as common man is concerned, then there is a saying "
There are two primary choices in life;
to accept conditions as they exist,
or accept the responsibility for changing them"
And almost all of us accept the conditions as they exist.