Those guilty of "Within Gotra" marriage should be ostrasized by JAT's... Yes or No ?

Those guilty of "Within Gotra" marriage should be ostracized... Yes or No ?

  • Total voters
    95
plz no offence to nyone


but i guess we r getting personal against one person

( plz bhaiyon-----that does mean i m on his side------n mujhe genetics ka bas A ,B C aata hai------n it is too complicated ----can not be understood thru blogs or websites------also i m also against of same gotra marriage )
 
No, we should not ostracize those people who are not following our customs/traditions its their wish We have no right to interfere in others life .
 
TILAK said:
No, we should not ostracize those people who are not following our customs/traditions its their wish We have no right to interfere in others life .
Click to expand...

we are living in a society which have very strong bond and thats why morality and other lot many aspects are still alive with in us. we have full right to inerfere in social matters, after all these matters are going to affect our life and of next generations too.
Kya aapke ghar ke samne koi kuchh galat kam karega toh aap hone denge? Think twice before answering.
 
rekha said:
plz no offence to nyone


but i guess we r getting personal against one person

( plz bhaiyon-----that does mean i m on his side------n mujhe genetics ka bas A ,B C aata hai------n it is too complicated ----can not be understood thru blogs or websites------also i m also against of same gotra marriage )
Click to expand...

jab tane genetics ka A,D aur C b na aata to itna kyu dhol bajave se...

Mrs Rekha mujhe ni pata aapko kya aata h aur kya ni,lekin ek baat suno aap,jab tak aapko khud kuch na paat ho to kuch mat likha karo...pehle uski kuch knowledge le fir yaha likh.

last me SORRY ya no offence likhne se discussion me participate ni kiya jata......agar kuch likhe ho to uski responsibility likhne wale ki hoti h.......

P.S:
Rekha ji aapne ek template bana rakhi hai jisme satart me SIR G likh do aur last me last me SORRY ya no offence likh do aur bich me kuch ni hota....so is template se hat kar kuch likho mam..aur ni likh sakte to discussion me aana he band kar do......
 
vikasJAT said:
A=SWAICH
B=SWAICH

C=SWIACH

A SWAICH h aur usme jo genes hain vo SWIACH k hain.
usne B se shadi ki jo Swaich hai jisme SWIACH k he genes hain....
unka jo bacha hoga vo h C usme 50% A k genes hain aur 50% B k genes hain.....
Ab C me total genes ek he type k hain jo ki SWIACH h......

If a person having different genes then his immune system should be strong......but if a person having same type of genes then immune system cause lots of genetic problems in next generation.

I think you understand.......otherwise go through some genetic engineering blogs or articles....
Click to expand...

Bhai, first of all thanks for talking about the issue scientifically as opposed to many others here. I understand what you are trying to say. But here's my point -

You took the example of following :

A=SWAICH and B=SWAICH hence, C=SWAICH. This is fair but in reality, since A is also a product of two different genes: A = Swaich + Gotra X, and B = Swaich + Gotra Y. And even going back a step further, The 'Swaich' in A is also a mix of Swaich + another gotra. So is the case for Y. So going back to the first Swaich who was the original Swaich, everyone in the next generation is mixed. And with every generation the % of original Swaich genes has gone down.

So if lets assume A=Swaich (the first original Swaich guy who started the clan) marries B = Deol (assuming he marries outside the gotra as is the custom), their son C = 50% Swaich, C's son D = 25% Swaich and so on.....

Now this Swaich genes will reduce probably to .005% by the time of 10th or 12th generation.

Now lets again come back to your example i.e. A=SWAICH and B=SWAICH. How much Swaich genes do each one of them carry if they are 10th or 12th generation Swaich? The ans? Very small amount to cause risk.

And that was my whole argument. If considerable number of generations have passed and two families of the same gotra do not share the common known ancestor, then the % of actual gene of their gotra will reduce manifolds. Thus reducing the risk of decreasing immunity. Let me know if I am wrong somewhere.
 
Last edited:
Sure said:
we are living in a society which have very strong bond and thats why morality and other lot many aspects are still alive with in us. we have full right to inerfere in social matters, after all these matters are going to affect our life and of next generations too.
Kya aapke ghar ke samne koi kuchh galat kam karega toh aap hone denge? Think twice before answering.
Click to expand...

The extent of interference is the crux here. One can speak and try to convince on the issue. But using violence or initiating actions like ostracizing that cause violence are wrong and no person has the right to do it in the name of society.
 
swaich said:
The extent of interference is the crux here. One can speak and try to convince on the issue. But using violence or initiating actions like ostracizing that cause violence are wrong and no person has the right to do it in the name of society.
Click to expand...

I don think ostracizing is violence and if it is, than the person who acted in immoral way had done this first to society.
 
Sure said:
I don think ostracizing is violence and if it is, than the person who acted in immoral way had done this first to society.
Click to expand...

It causes violence. Hardly makes it less of a crime.

About the bold part, the cause or provocation (as you are putting it) still doesn't justify the action. No one, apart from law has the right to take life or cause the loss of life. Society cant trample the right of the individual as guaranteed by law.
 
swaich said:
It causes violence. Hardly makes it less of a crime.

About the bold part, the cause or provocation (as you are putting it) still doesn't justify the action. No one, apart from law has the right to take life or cause the loss of life. Society cant trample the right of the individual as guaranteed by law.
Click to expand...


Read that in bold again, why law have that right to take someones life? who made that law which gaurntee the right of individual? I hope we made that law, the peoples/society in bigger term parliament/govt and law must be according to social views, according to customs and tradition of particular region.
 
swaich said:
Bhai, first of all thanks for talking about the issue scientifically as opposed to many others here. I understand what you are trying to say. But here's my point -

You took the example of following :

A=SWAICH and B=SWAICH hence, C=SWAICH. This is fair but in reality, since A is also a product of two different genes: A = Swaich + Gotra X, and B = Swaich + Gotra Y. And even going back a step further, The 'Swaich' in A is also a mix of Swaich + another gotra. So is the case for Y. So going back to the first Swaich who was the original Swaich, everyone in the next generation is mixed. And with every generation the % of original Swaich genes has gone down.

So if lets assume A=Swaich (the first original Swaich guy who started the clan) marries B = Deol (assuming he marries outside the gotra as is the custom), their son C = 50% Swaich, C's son D = 25% Swaich and so on.....

Now this Swaich genes will reduce probably to .005% by the time of 10th or 12th generation.

Now lets again come back to your example i.e. A=SWAICH and B=SWAICH. How much Swaich genes do each one of them carry if they are 10th or 12th generation Swaich? The ans? Very small amount to cause risk.

And that was my whole argument. If considerable number of generations have passed and two families of the same gotra do not share the common known ancestor, then the % of actual gene of their gotra will reduce manifolds. Thus reducing the risk of decreasing immunity. Let me know if I am wrong somewhere.
Click to expand...

Bhai siwach....just for a moment ..let me accept your theory...and may be your genetic theory is also correct...so just tell me one thing what is the name of your grandfather's grandfather?..I bet you don't know it...so that means you lost the name track of your ancestors..It is practically not possible to keep track of ancestors list of 8-10 generations..so your theory will fail in implementation.we will have to adopt something that is easy in implementation..GOTRA system is already there...so why to make life difficult........I think GOTRA system is still the best BET..what's say? :)
 
Legal face of Gotra marriage

kamaal haan yarron aap log science, Ph.D, social issues, genetic issues sab pe lad liye toh chalo Law ki bhi baat ho jaaye, first of Law Our Hindu law prohibit only two marriage those between sapindas and between Prohibited degree
1. Sapinda those whom we offers Pinds in Kanagat.
2. Prohibited degree means relationships like, Mother and son, Father and daughter, brother and sister. i.e means in half Blood ,full blood and Utrine blood , Full Blood means means when Both Son and daughter from same father and mother , Half blood when one from other mother but same father .and last when from same mother but by different fathers. and it also includes, Mama Bhanji i.e Father and daughter Chaha Bhatiji i.e Father and daughter. Tau and bhatiji same , Mausa and bahtiji , Mama and bhatiji and all of these son and daughters interse are Brother and sisters same in case of female also ,now the question is about same Gotra ,as per law, Gotra never means they are bound by Full ,half or Utrine blood, they are just considered as related by same community and law not prohibited community it prohibit only family, society declare them family then when a Daughter of any Jat family need help then no one came in front, when same chaha destroys other faily then Community not came in front nd always says its their family matter then why in case of marriage the word family become so big it includes whole Gotra and khap . at last cut it short being a Law expert and having knowledge of Hindu as well as other legal aspect , i can say one thing Gotra marriage is truly and fully valid in the eyes of law . Supreme court / High courts/ District courts, law at every state at every place agrees with that .
 
bhai yoo swaich jatt sikh see n jatt sikh and hindu jat ke culture mai zameeen asmaan ka farkk see..i hav seen it myself...but still eek jatt sikh kabhi apne gotra mai shaadi nahi kar sakta.....and teen gotra to bahut saare muslim jats bhi chodte hai.....kaade kaade ghaanii padai samaaaj ki doorgaati kar de hai.....swaich ke samajh mai konii aatii...thaaam chahe usnee phd karwa doo.....we should not listen to anybody's bullshit...we are proud of being a jaat and proud of our tradition set by our ancestors
 
Vinod100keen said:
kamaal haan yarron aap log science, Ph.D, social issues, genetic issues sab pe lad liye toh chalo Law ki bhi baat ho jaaye, first of Law Our Hindu law prohibit only two marriage those between sapindas and between Prohibited degree
1. Sapinda those whom we offers Pinds in Kanagat.
2. Prohibited degree means relationships like, Mother and son, Father and daughter, brother and sister. i.e means in half Blood ,full blood and Utrine blood , Full Blood means means when Both Son and daughter from same father and mother , Half blood when one from other mother but same father .and last when from same mother but by different fathers. and it also includes, Mama Bhanji i.e Father and daughter Chaha Bhatiji i.e Father and daughter. Tau and bhatiji same , Mausa and bahtiji , Mama and bhatiji and all of these son and daughters interse are Brother and sisters same in case of female also ,now the question is about same Gotra ,as per law, Gotra never means they are bound by Full ,half or Utrine blood, they are just considered as related by same community and law not prohibited community it prohibit only family, society declare them family then when a Daughter of any Jat family need help then no one came in front, when same chaha destroys other faily then Community not came in front nd always says its their family matter then why in case of marriage the word family become so big it includes whole Gotra and khap . at last cut it short being a Law expert and having knowledge of Hindu as well as other legal aspect , i can say one thing Gotra marriage is truly and fully valid in the eyes of law . Supreme court / High courts/ District courts, law at every state at every place agrees with that .
Click to expand...

Bhai sahb, yahan pe log genetic pe tabhi aaye kyunki woh is mudde par law ko mante hi nahin. Agar mante hote to yeh discussion kab ka khatam ho chuka hota.
 
Sure said:
Read that in bold again, why law have that right to take someones life? who made that law which gaurntee the right of individual? I hope we made that law, the peoples/society in bigger term parliament/govt and law must be according to social views, according to customs and tradition of particular region.
Click to expand...

Are you trying to say that sometimes a society's norms are above the law of the land?

I think laws of a country like ours was made after a careful consideration of society itself. Those people were probably more learned than me or you or anybody else on this forum for that matter.
 
cutejaatsandeep said:
bhai yoo swaich jatt sikh see n jatt sikh and hindu jat ke culture mai zameeen asmaan ka farkk see..i hav seen it myself...but still eek jatt sikh kabhi apne gotra mai shaadi nahi kar sakta.....and teen gotra to bahut saare muslim jats bhi chodte hai.....kaade kaade ghaanii padai samaaaj ki doorgaati kar de hai.....swaich ke samajh mai konii aatii...thaaam chahe usnee phd karwa doo.....we should not listen to anybody's bullshit...we are proud of being a jaat and proud of our tradition set by our ancestors
Click to expand...

Bhai bahut customs common hai...jatt sikhs aur hindu sikhs mein. Jatt sikhs too avoid marrying in the same gotras as Hindu jatts. But these things are becoming less and less strict nowadays. And people do not mind it the way it is in Hindu Jatts. Rest assured, nobody will ostracize or kill somebody or say the community's honor is at stake if a couple marries in the same gotra.
 
prashantacmet said:
Bhai siwach....just for a moment ..let me accept your theory...and may be your genetic theory is also correct...so just tell me one thing what is the name of your grandfather's grandfather?..I bet you don't know it...so that means you lost the name track of your ancestors..It is practically not possible to keep track of ancestors list of 8-10 generations..so your theory will fail in implementation.we will have to adopt something that is easy in implementation..GOTRA system is already there...so why to make life difficult........I think GOTRA system is still the best BET..what's say? :)
Click to expand...

Good point. :) Reversing your own logic around, you might marry someone from the different gotra but it might be that you had a common ancestor some generations back. So there is no guarantee either which way.

And if you think a little more, since all gotras have common origins and all Jatts have strictly married within the community, we are the most genetically homogenous community. We are all mixed (increasing the risk of genetic problems) as we have married within the community for hundreds of years.
 
swaich said:
Good point. :) Reversing your own logic around, you might marry someone from the different gotra but it might be that you had a common ancestor some generations back. So there is no guarantee either which way.

And if you think a little more, since all gotras have common origins and all Jatts have strictly married within the community, we are the most genetically homogenous community. We are all mixed (increasing the risk of genetic problems) as we have married within the community for hundreds of years.
Click to expand...


I think both the protagonists and antagonists of the same gotra marriages have used all the ashtars and shastras in their armoury; so time has arrived to take rest, if you please. Cease fire, re-equip with latest arguments supported by reference material and we can meet again !!!



Thanks
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top