शादी की उम्र घटाओ ?

[drkarminder]

dear rajpal sir
obeservation is must in every aspects, we cant ignore the fact that certain cast people are always against jat community. i have met many jat army officers and many of them have stated that jat officers inspite of their able duties are not given promotions in army.

now blaming ourselves for everything thats has happened is not the way of living. times for showing the politness has gone back. now there should be strong reaction from jat community in the form of awareness and development.
i know jats are showing their talent and skills in sports but we should not always stick to this statment. hundred times i hv haerd these lines that we are developing ,see we are doing good in sports. this a only one of thousand aspects in which we should improve.

i have seen goyal,aggrawal,punjabis ,there choice of profession are excellent. if u go and count in delhi traffic police u will find hundreds of jat controlling traffic or having tea beside some road in khakis and boasting of jat community. can u show me any name plate bearing jain ,agarwal ,mehta or any other than jats(few yadav or sharma).

is this the profession we are born for?. let me come very clean and clear in this, as i said strong reforms are urgent in jat community. time for showing politness and sympathy for people has gone back with our grand parents which were really respected by these people but now they are all equal, now they are the people who are pulling us in issues.

there was a time ,i have seen that lower cats(chamar) used to come to my dada ji and he used to give them bags full of wheat now the same casts are now voting against us in sarpanch or MLA elections.
now the question comes why they hate us, did we do something wrong. now i have the answer because we(jats) were the dominating people in every villege of haryana and till now we are and now these poeple want to grow and lets our dominance to finish.

this is a competitive world people tend to pull ur leg with no fault of yours. finding the people who can hinder ur way is always a part of good planning so that u can bypass them in an eazy way.
now let me give u an example :
rapes are happening in other states also and in haryana also cases are reported outside jat community. now why alsways khap and jat are the target of media.

there is only one and one thing" people are waiting us to pull in issues ans we are giving them chances".

we are loosing supporters of jat community everywhere not because we are not good community because we are not making pace with time,people no more find advatage in jat community, and loosing ineterst. evrybody salutes the rising sun but we are stuck with are old tradition and customs that are not the part/accepted in modern world.

people are loosing agricultural land in haryana,now my biggest concern(specially jats in villages) is that after sometime this money will be finished,wt we will be left with,these little jobs will nor improve our condition.

we have to make our communnity and people in demand ,this is how u go on in life,make urself capable of something otherwise we will be just a herd of aadiwasi people whom know one will notice.

 

[drrajpalsingh]

Doctor Sahib,

Who disagrees with you that time has arrived when none can ignore the need of developing his or her competencies to meet the latest standards set by the market oriented services of the day.

Yes, we must first introspect ourselves and desist from alleging other castes and communities to hide our inherent weaknesses that are largely responsible for our lack of representation at highest level. One main reason is late entry of the Jats in acquisition of Education. But gradually we are picking up and there is no place for despondency and disappointment on this count too.

Thanks

 

[upendersingh]

Restrain please! Aap Josh mein Haus kyon kho rahe ho.

Because I watched a debate on the tv in which some Mr. Rathi (from Khap side) was participating. What was he saying that made me think so. His logic for marriageable age should be 15, was that earlier girls' menses began around 15 years of age, but now it begins around 11 years of age, so it is ok to marry the girls in 15 years of age. What a logic...

 

[b.l.lakhlan]

Dr. Rajpal singh jee,

आप ने सही कहा है। हरयानवी झूठी शान के लिए अपने को बड़ा दिखने के कोशिश करते हैं। इसलिए आगे बढ्ने की बजाय दूसरे क्या करते हैं । इसमें समये खराब करते हैं।


हम हरयानवी किसी से भी कम नहीं हैं यदि अपना ध्यान दूसरों के बजाए अपने पर केन्द्रित करें

 

[dbnh]

पिछले दिनों देश के भिन्न भिन्न भागों विशेषकर हरियाणा में बलात्कार की बहुत सी घटनाएँ घटी। स्वाभाविक है कि इन सारी घटनाओं के लिए जिम्मेदार कारणों पर मीडिया और समाज के विभिन्न वर्गों मे विचार होना ही था। कानून व्यवस्था का जिक्र आया, जातिगत विद्वेष का जिक्र आया, अनपढ़ता का जिक्र आया परंतु इनके साथ साथ एक और जिक्र आया कि लड़कियों की शादी की उम्र घटा देनी चाहिए। मजे की बात यह है कि इसने ही सबसे ज्यादा नाम भी कमाया। जिसने एक नई बहस को जन्म भी दे दिया। मीडिया खास तौर पर प्रिंट मीडिया में पहले यह खबर बनी फिर समाचारों की हेडलाईन, तदुपरान्त बहस का विषय बन गई। समाज शास्त्री बुलाये गए, राजनीतिक पार्टियों के प्रतिनिधि बुलाये गए, खापों के प्रतिनिधि बड़े चाव से बहस में आए। बोलने से ज्यादा बुलाये जाने की की खुशी उनके चेहरों से साफ पढ़ी जा सकती थी। तर्कों पर तर्क दिए गए। कुतर्कों को भी माता का माल समझकर लुटाया गया। जिस प्रकार कांग्रेस पार्टी ने कोयला घोटाले से ध्यान हटाने के लिए एफ़डीआई का पिटारा खोल दिया उसी प्रकार से हमारे तथाकथित खाप प्रतिनिधियों ने कुतर्क दिया कि हमें बच्चों की शादी की उम्र घटा देनी चाहिए। तथा यहाँ तक भी कहा गया कि हमारी एक विशेष प्रकार की नस्ल है जो जल्दी जवान हो जाती है और भी न जाने किन किन कुतर्कों को दांव पर लगाया गया । खाप के प्रतिनिधियों को टेलीविज़न की स्क्रीन पर देखकर एक बात पारे की भांति स्पष्ट थी कि हमारे खाप प्रतिनिधियों के चेहरे और सिर के बाल जितने उलझे हुए थे उनके विचार उनसे भी कहीं ज्यादा उलझे हुए थे लड़की की कम उम्र में शादी कर देनी चाहिए इस बात पर काफी ज़ोर दिया जा रहा था, समूची बहस में यही विचार सबसे हास्यास्पद भी था। पुरुषवादी मानसिकता साफ झलक रही थी। पीड़ित पक्ष को ही सुधर जाने की नसीहत दी जा रही थी । इसी बात पर मुझे एक बात याद आ रही है कि जब में जाट कॉलेज हिसार में पढ़ता था तो एक सेमिनार में प्राचार्य महोदय को बेरोजगारी पर भाषण देने के लिए कहा गया। प्राचार्य महोदय ने कहा की बेरोजगारी पर भाषण क्या देना? मोटी सी बात है देश में रोजगार नहीं है, इसीलिए बेरोजगारी है और ये तब तक रहेगी जब तक रोजगार नहीं होंगे। यूं कहकर उन्होने मानों बेरोजगारी का कार्यकाल भी बता दिया और अपने होठों पर इस प्रकार जीभ फेरी मानों बेरोजगारी मिटाने का ये नुस्खा बताकर उन्होने उपस्थित श्रोताओं पर एहसान कर दिया हो। यहाँ भी यही फार्मूला सुझाया जा रहा है कि कम उम्र में जब गाँव की सभी लड़कियां अपनी ससुराल चली जाएंगी तब युवा किस से बलात्कार करेंगे? अब प्रश्न ये है कि ये प्रतिनिधि हैं कौन? किसने इन्हें प्रतिनिधि बनाया है? ये वास्तव में प्रतिनिधि हैं तो इनके प्रतिनिधि जैसे विचार क्यों नहीं हैं? बिना विचार के प्रतिनिधि और बिना दूल्हे बारात लगभग एक जैसी ही बात है। आप को प्रधान बनने की जल्दी है बात समझ में आती है। टेलीविज़न की स्क्रीन पर दिखने की जल्दी है, ये भी समझ में आता है पर विचारों को तैयार करने में हाथी से भी ज़्यादा सुस्ती, वो भी तब जब आप खाप या कौम का प्रतिनिधित्व कर रहे हो, समझ से बाहर है।

 

[drrajpalsingh]

Because I watched a debate on the tv in which some Mr. Rathi (from Khap side) was participating. What was he saying that made me think so. His logic for marriageable age should be 15, was that earlier girls' menses began around 15 years of age, but now it begins around 11 years of age, so it is ok to marry the girls in 15 years of age. What a logic...

Agreed that Mr. Rathi's views are not acceptable to many of us; but under the provocation of such type of unpalatable views to call all the elders of the society 'foolish people' is neither desirable nor acceptable to anyone.

Kindly comment on what he said and try to give a logical reply.

Rest assured you are free to say as per your interpretation of the right of freedom of expression !

Keep it up please.

 

[drrajpalsingh]

पिछले दिनों देश के भिन्न भिन्न भागों विशेषकर हरियाणा में बलात्कार की बहुत सी घटनाएँ घटी। स्वाभाविक है कि इन सारी घटनाओं के लिए जिम्मेदार कारणों पर मीडिया और समाज के विभिन्न वर्गों मे विचार होना ही था। कानून व्यवस्था का जिक्र आया, जातिगत विद्वेष का जिक्र आया, अनपढ़ता का जिक्र आया परंतु इनके साथ साथ एक और जिक्र आया कि लड़कियों की शादी की उम्र घटा देनी चाहिए। मजे की बात यह है कि इसने ही सबसे ज्यादा नाम भी कमाया। जिसने एक नई बहस को जन्म भी दे दिया। मीडिया खास तौर पर प्रिंट मीडिया में पहले यह खबर बनी फिर समाचारों की हेडलाईन, तदुपरान्त बहस का विषय बन गई। समाज शास्त्री बुलाये गए, राजनीतिक पार्टियों के प्रतिनिधि बुलाये गए, खापों के प्रतिनिधि बड़े चाव से बहस में आए। बोलने से ज्यादा बुलाये जाने की की खुशी उनके चेहरों से साफ पढ़ी जा सकती थी। तर्कों पर तर्क दिए गए। कुतर्कों को भी माता का माल समझकर लुटाया गया। जिस प्रकार कांग्रेस पार्टी ने कोयला घोटाले से ध्यान हटाने के लिए एफ़डीआई का पिटारा खोल दिया उसी प्रकार से हमारे तथाकथित खाप प्रतिनिधियों ने कुतर्क दिया कि हमें बच्चों की शादी की उम्र घटा देनी चाहिए। तथा यहाँ तक भी कहा गया कि हमारी एक विशेष प्रकार की नस्ल है जो जल्दी जवान हो जाती है और भी न जाने किन किन कुतर्कों को दांव पर लगाया गया । खाप के प्रतिनिधियों को टेलीविज़न की स्क्रीन पर देखकर एक बात पारे की भांति स्पष्ट थी कि हमारे खाप प्रतिनिधियों के चेहरे और सिर के बाल जितने उलझे हुए थे उनके विचार उनसे भी कहीं ज्यादा उलझे हुए थे लड़की की कम उम्र में शादी कर देनी चाहिए इस बात पर काफी ज़ोर दिया जा रहा था, समूची बहस में यही विचार सबसे हास्यास्पद भी था। पुरुषवादी मानसिकता साफ झलक रही थी। पीड़ित पक्ष को ही सुधर जाने की नसीहत दी जा रही थी । इसी बात पर मुझे एक बात याद आ रही है कि जब में जाट कॉलेज हिसार में पढ़ता था तो एक सेमिनार में प्राचार्य महोदय को बेरोजगारी पर भाषण देने के लिए कहा गया। प्राचार्य महोदय ने कहा की बेरोजगारी पर भाषण क्या देना? मोटी सी बात है देश में रोजगार नहीं है, इसीलिए बेरोजगारी है और ये तब तक रहेगी जब तक रोजगार नहीं होंगे। यूं कहकर उन्होने मानों बेरोजगारी का कार्यकाल भी बता दिया और अपने होठों पर इस प्रकार जीभ फेरी मानों बेरोजगारी मिटाने का ये नुस्खा बताकर उन्होने उपस्थित श्रोताओं पर एहसान कर दिया हो। यहाँ भी यही फार्मूला सुझाया जा रहा है कि कम उम्र में जब गाँव की सभी लड़कियां अपनी ससुराल चली जाएंगी तब युवा किस से बलात्कार करेंगे? अब प्रश्न ये है कि ये प्रतिनिधि हैं कौन? किसने इन्हें प्रतिनिधि बनाया है? ये वास्तव में प्रतिनिधि हैं तो इनके प्रतिनिधि जैसे विचार क्यों नहीं हैं? बिना विचार के प्रतिनिधि और बिना दूल्हे बारात लगभग एक जैसी ही बात है। आप को प्रधान बनने की जल्दी है बात समझ में आती है। टेलीविज़न की स्क्रीन पर दिखने की जल्दी है, ये भी समझ में आता है पर विचारों को तैयार करने में हाथी से भी ज़्यादा सुस्ती, वो भी तब जब आप खाप या कौम का प्रतिनिधित्व कर रहे हो, समझ से बाहर है।

The hasty comments of some of the Khap leaders before media on the vexed issue have indeed damaged their reputation and it is hoped that they will in future use more restrain while expressing themselves!

However, this error of judgement on their part does not mean that the historic khap system has lost its relevance today. If the leadership of Khaps succeeds in rising to the occasion in right earnest they can play very important role as watch dog of the social and cultural ethos of our fast changing both polity and society.

 

[drkarminder]

Doctor Sahib,



Yes, we must first introspect ourselves and desist from alleging other castes and communities to hide our inherent weaknesses that are largely responsible for our lack of representation at highest level. One main reason is late entry of the Jats in acquisition of Education. But gradually we are picking up and there is no place for despondency and disappointment on this count too.

Thanks

totally in agreement with ur view dr.sahab.
one thing that i wanted to mention that female gender of jat community have shown tremendous improvement in every field let it be any.
i really appreciate jat community positive efforts in girl child education and giving them liberty in their choice of field.
increasing number of female jat professionals in every field shows the positive aspect of our community.

 

[drkarminder]

khap demand status of lok adalat
http://news.google.co.in/news/url?c...=section&did=-7694346303818898357&sid=en_in-n

 

[singhvp]

An article by well known social scientist and author from Haryana, Mr. D.R. Chaudhary on the issue under discussion, which he posted on Facebook.

"Some khap leaders in Haryana have suggested a novel solution to deal with the problem. Lower the age of marriage and the problem would disappear. The suggestion is bizarre, to say the least. A six year old girl was gang-raped in Gurgaon recently. Should the girls aged six be married off?
A good number of the girls raped so far are teen agers There are instances of married women raped by married men. In Kaithal district a five-month old pregnant women was raped by two men. In the Hissar rape case four of the rapists are married. Early marriage involves the risk of early child birth which causes death of many such mothers according to the Human Rights Watch.
The khap panchayats claim to be custodians of social morality. On the slightest deviation from the marital norms set by them, they have been organizing social boycott of families and often creating mass frenzy resulting into cases of honour killings. Why don’t they apply the same standard to
deal with rapists in the state? By following their logic, they should have banned the entry of the rapists in their respective villages and approached their families to disown them, failing which such families should have been ostracized.
The argument of lowering the marriageable age on the ground of girls reaching biological age at 15 or 16 tends to put the blame on the fortunate girls for their rape. On reaching the biological age they are supposed to invite the male for fornication which later on is passed off as rape. One Congress leader has lent weight to this argument by suggesting that 90 per cent of rapes in the state are consensual.

This worldview is in tune with the recent decision of some khap panchayats in Western U.P. prohibiting girls from using mobile, wearing jeans and going to market alone etc. Lowering the marriage –age would deprive the girls of higher education and jobs. This is what the khaps want to make the girls galley slaves in the four walls of their houses."

 

[jaisingh318]

अब प्रश्न ये है कि ये प्रतिनिधि हैं कौन? किसने इन्हें प्रतिनिधि बनाया है? ये वास्तव में प्रतिनिधि हैं तो इनके प्रतिनिधि जैसे विचार क्यों नहीं हैं? बिना विचार के प्रतिनिधि और बिना दूल्हे बारात लगभग एक जैसी ही बात है। आप को प्रधान बनने की जल्दी है बात समझ में आती है। टेलीविज़न की स्क्रीन पर दिखने की जल्दी है, ये भी समझ में आता है पर विचारों को तैयार करने में हाथी से भी ज़्यादा सुस्ती, वो भी तब जब आप खाप या कौम का प्रतिनिधित्व कर रहे हो, समझ से बाहर है।

apka iss sawal ka jawab bhoot hi jarrori h. ......kyki iss type kay log khap jaise holy institute ko barbaad karne par tule hua h. koen hota h sube khamkha ka majak
udwa diya koam ka apni rajniti kay chakkar may. kisne banya tha yo sarv khap spoksperson ......khud ban rahya se......... iss dall kya ka to hooka pani band hona chahiye.

 

[drrajpalsingh]

The Khap Mahapanchyat headed by Nafe Singh Nain held on 13th October at Sonepat did not take any decision on lowering the age of Girls for marriage. They held the electronic and print media responsible for targeting the Khaps working style. They clearly said that the role of Khap Panchyats was to preserve culture and promote brotherhood in society.

While debating on rape cases, the representatives said these cases were happening with the girls of every caste and to discuss on this issue, a separate meeting of the Sarv Khap Mahapanchyat would be convened.


For full details and photographs log in www.tribuneindia.com dated 14 October, 2012, p.4.

 

[swaich]

An article by well known social scientist and author from Haryana, Mr. D.R. Chaudhary on the issue under discussion, which he posted on Facebook.

"Some khap leaders in Haryana have suggested a novel solution to deal with the problem. Lower the age of marriage and the problem would disappear. The suggestion is bizarre, to say the least. A six year old girl was gang-raped in Gurgaon recently. Should the girls aged six be married off?
A good number of the girls raped so far are teen agers There are instances of married women raped by married men. In Kaithal district a five-month old pregnant women was raped by two men. In the Hissar rape case four of the rapists are married. Early marriage involves the risk of early child birth which causes death of many such mothers according to the Human Rights Watch.
The khap panchayats claim to be custodians of social morality. On the slightest deviation from the marital norms set by them, they have been organizing social boycott of families and often creating mass frenzy resulting into cases of honour killings. Why don’t they apply the same standard to
deal with rapists in the state? By following their logic, they should have banned the entry of the rapists in their respective villages and approached their families to disown them, failing which such families should have been ostracized.
The argument of lowering the marriageable age on the ground of girls reaching biological age at 15 or 16 tends to put the blame on the fortunate girls for their rape. On reaching the biological age they are supposed to invite the male for fornication which later on is passed off as rape. One Congress leader has lent weight to this argument by suggesting that 90 per cent of rapes in the state are consensual.

This worldview is in tune with the recent decision of some khap panchayats in Western U.P. prohibiting girls from using mobile, wearing jeans and going to market alone etc. Lowering the marriage –age would deprive the girls of higher education and jobs. This is what the khaps want to make the girls galley slaves in the four walls of their houses."

That hit the nail right on the head.

I cant help but wonder that all these so called solutions are hard on the females themselves. They face assault and rape, but the biggest punishment is meted out to them. With so many restrictions and problems associated with girls, there's hardly any hope for rectifying the skewed sex-ratios.

 

[jaisingh318]

For full details and photographs log in www.tribuneindia.com dated 14 October, 2012, p.4.

sir ji .....iss detail mey to sube singh kisi samain khap ka pardhan batya h. ye samian khap kha per h iss per bhi apni rai dena.

 

[drrajpalsingh]

sir ji .....iss detail mey to sube singh kisi samain khap ka pardhan batya h. ye samian khap kha per h iss per bhi apni rai dena.

Friend,

Ch. Subesingh is reported to be spokes person of the Khap Mahapanchyat held at Sonepat on 13th October.

Perhaps Samain is the Hqs of the Khap he reprsents but I am not sure about it.

 

[deshi-jat]

For whatever reasons, this DR Chaudhary & Jagmati Sangwan always spill venom against Jat

An article by well known social scientist and author from Haryana, Mr. D.R. Chaudhary on the issue under discussion, which he posted on Facebook.

"Some khap leaders in Haryana have suggested a novel solution to deal with the problem. Lower the age of marriage and the problem would disappear. The suggestion is bizarre, to say the least. A six year old girl was gang-raped in Gurgaon recently. Should the girls aged six be married off?
A good number of the girls raped so far are teen agers There are instances of married women raped by married men. In Kaithal district a five-month old pregnant women was raped by two men. In the Hissar rape case four of the rapists are married. Early marriage involves the risk of early child birth which causes death of many such mothers according to the Human Rights Watch.
The khap panchayats claim to be custodians of social morality. On the slightest deviation from the marital norms set by them, they have been organizing social boycott of families and often creating mass frenzy resulting into cases of honour killings. Why don’t they apply the same standard to
deal with rapists in the state? By following their logic, they should have banned the entry of the rapists in their respective villages and approached their families to disown them, failing which such families should have been ostracized.
The argument of lowering the marriageable age on the ground of girls reaching biological age at 15 or 16 tends to put the blame on the fortunate girls for their rape. On reaching the biological age they are supposed to invite the male for fornication which later on is passed off as rape. One Congress leader has lent weight to this argument by suggesting that 90 per cent of rapes in the state are consensual.

This worldview is in tune with the recent decision of some khap panchayats in Western U.P. prohibiting girls from using mobile, wearing jeans and going to market alone etc. Lowering the marriage –age would deprive the girls of higher education and jobs. This is what the khaps want to make the girls galley slaves in the four walls of their houses."

 

[anilsangwan]

For whatever reasons, this DR Chaudhary & Jagmati Sangwan always spill venom against Jat

ठीक कही भाई..... ये दोनु सें "कुत्याँ के && - ना लीपन के. न पोतन के" !

 

[vicky84]

Ek ya Ranjna Kumari.. Full of negativity..


Ek baat aur sai bhai...Ya media bhi Khap pai sher hoyi reh sai...


Mullayan mai bhi to 15 saal mai shaadi ka pravdhaan sai.. Aar mulley bhi tai burkha pehrawain sain aurtaan tai(Baaki main iske paksh mei nahi hoon).. Ya media kaade unpai sherr na hoti !!!!

ठीक कही भाई..... ये दोनु सें "कुत्याँ के && - ना लीपन के. न पोतन के" !

 

[deshi-jat]

भाई इस मीडिया का एकै इलाज़ सै, जो चैनल और अख़बार बिरादरी के खिलाफ बोलै या लिखै, उसके दफ्तर पै 100-50 माणस जा कै दौ-चार डाळा-भाटा बागा आवै. दिल्ली मै इन सब के दफ्तर सै. और इन केबल ऑपरेटरों तै भी कह देवे, ये चैनल दिखाए तो फेर वे भी ना बख्शे जावेंगे

मराठो के खिलाफ कोई चैनेल बम्बई तै बोल के दिखा दयो. और यो केजरीवाल देख ल्यो सरकार के नाक मै दम करे रखे सै, 10-15 माणस साथ ले कै. मीडिया न्यू पंचायत करे या सफाई पेश करण तै ना मानै ..मीडिया कै तो चस्का लाग रह्य, सै जाटों के बारे मै अनाप-सनाप बातों को सनसनीखेज़ खबर बता कै, अपणी trp बढ़ाण का

ek ya ranjna kumari.. Full of negativity..


Ek baat aur sai bhai...ya media bhi khap pai sher hoyi reh sai...


Mullayan mai bhi to 15 saal mai shaadi ka pravdhaan sai.. Aar mulley bhi tai burkha pehrawain sain aurtaan tai(baaki main iske paksh mei nahi hoon).. Ya media kaade unpai sherr na hoti !!!!

 

[singhvp]

For whatever reasons, this DR Chaudhary & Jagmati Sangwan always spill venom against Jat

Decency of the debate demands that we should see the content not the face of writer. No one can claim to be 100% right always. If I do not find one of your posts according to my taste, I should not dismiss you for ever. Criticism will have its impact only if it is objective and free from bias. Otherwise, it will increase only the volume not the value. Excessive use of derogatory adjectives by some of our members (not you) has only diluted the credibility of this portal, otherwise Jatland could have become the most effective tool for rebuttal of adverse publicity against our community. Alas! our own community people have done irreparable loss to the community.