पी एम हो तो मोदी जैसा...........

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With limitations- he never took Pakistan into confidence(as they were claiming it were mujahiddins) to seek their support and let our troops cross LOC- which in turn caused so many causalities to our forces.

I am not saying MM is the best leader we have had but I am also not agreeing to your statement of Modi being a solution to every problem India has ever had, including this one.

SumitJattan said:
Right but he used force at right time to kick the intruders out .... so i dont consider him week .... to some extent it was a intel failure but this is broad day light breach..... and what u think MM is powerful ;)
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Not sure what u want to say ..... but they entered like the Chinese to claim the territory and I am sure no Indian wants to grab the land belongs to some other country and no sane person wants war ... but that does not meany any one can enter in our borders ... He did right by not crossing the LOC and Pakistanis are liars ..now they are awarding the soldiers of Northern LI who took part in Kargil . My concern is only to kick these chinks from Indian side .... at any cost and by any force . ... and Vajpayee launched offensive when they came to know about intrusion ... what about MM ....???? You have every right to disagree with me

desijat said:
With limitations- he never took Pakistan into confidence(as they were claiming it were mujahiddins) to seek their support and let our troops cross LOC- which in turn caused so many causalities to our forces.

I am not saying MM is the best leader we have had but I am also not agreeing to your statement of Modi being a solution to every problem India has ever had, including this one.
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SumitJattan said:
what about MM ....???? You have every right to disagree with me
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On MMS- He has shown courage in the past against China when he allowed Dalai Lama to go to Arunachal Pradesh specially at a time when US were getting teethed by China. Having said that, I feel this time we should be a bit more strong but war is not a solution.
 
desijat said:
On MMS- He has shown courage in the past against China when he allowed Dalai Lama to go to Arunachal Pradesh specially at a time when US were getting teethed by China. Having said that, I feel this time we should be a bit more strong but war is not a solution.
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Tibet is internal matter of China. MMS showed stupidity by giving Dalai Lama permission to go to a disputed territory (thanks to your Nehru). Dalai Lama is a foreigner and MMS should have given a thought about the impact on the uncomfortable relations we have with China. "This time"? Report says Chinese have ventured into our territory almost 500 times since last October(on NDTV). We can be diplomatic in solving such issues, but we have to be strong also. Bump up the defence equipments (and not like AWACS a 25 years old technology and corruption) and train your forces to make them competent. No one dares to look at a strong nation but for our puppet.
 
Do you really think ...... its courage ????????
AP is an Indian state administered by India just claimed by Chinese ...and if he has allowed some refugee to visit this place .. very courageous action .... he deserves PVC ;)

desijat said:
On MMS- He has shown courage in the past against China when he allowed Dalai Lama to go to Arunachal Pradesh specially at a time when US were getting teethed by China. Having said that, I feel this time we should be a bit more strong but war is not a solution.
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desijat said:
Even when they claim Arunachal Pradesh to be a part of Tibet, which in turn they say is China? FYI- I talked about AP, not Tibet
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You missed the point. Tibet automatically comes into picture. Dalai Lama is from Tibet and is against China taking over his country. So there is conflict between them and thats why he is living in India most of the times. By giving permission to Dalai Lama to visit a disputed territory, MMS did not show any courage. It actually further deteriorated the relations between India and China, because China is always against Dalai Lama being given shelter in India as he never agrees to what China does in Tibet.
 
Haha- it made me laugh

But if you count back to the days am talking about, I am sure the tension you can count on diplomatic channels was no less than what we have with Pak most of the times
SumitJattan said:
Do you really think ...... its courage ????????
AP is an Indian state administered by India just claimed by Chinese ...and if he has allowed some refugee to visit this place .. very courageous action .... he deserves PVC ;)
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Again i agree ... tensions are high and forces are preparing for it ... the only missing element is political courage ... Japan answered China in a great way . Its breach of sovereignty requires some harsh actions . They knew the type of flexibility shown by Indian govt ( mainly external affairs) in last couple of years few examples PM accepts our role in Balouch ( in Sharmal Sheikh) , Italian Marines fiasco , beheading of Indian soldiers and bullied by US on Iran issue ...

desijat said:
Haha- it made me laugh

But if you count back to the days am talking about, I am sure the tension you can count on diplomatic channels was no less than what we have with Pak most of the times
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I agree, we definitely need to be more strict like we were during Indira's regime but again to say 'Modi ayega, chamatkar hoyega' is a meer statement with no base but just political motivations


SumitJattan said:
Again i agree ... tensions are high and forces are preparing for it ... the only missing element is political courage ... Japan answered China in a great way . Its breach of sovereignty requires some harsh actions . They knew the type of flexibility shown by Indian govt ( mainly external affairs) in last couple of years few examples PM accepts our role in Balouch ( in Sharmal Sheikh) , Italian Marines fiasco , beheading of Indian soldiers and bullied by US on Iran issue ...
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desijat said:
I agree, we definitely need to be more strict like we were during Indira's regime but again to say 'Modi ayega, chamatkar hoyega' is a meer statement with no base but just political motivations
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Every politician has motives. Who doesn't have? Mulla Mulayam wants to be PM, Nitish wants to be PM, DeveGowda still dreams about it, and who knows our very own Hooda Saab might also be dreaming! Khawaab hai koi bhi le sakta hai. So is Modi wrong in dreaming of being a PM? bane na bane that's futuristic thing. And he aint be doing any chamatkar, if he comes, but he will be better than any puppet anyday!

By the way, the guy whose words you trusted more than anything else, has some news about him that too from Supreme Court appointed SIT. I am not claiming anything from the link, though it's a news still! :)

http://www.rediff.com/news/report/s...ess-he-is-a-manipulator-says-sit/20130501.htm
 
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I am not a big fan of Chauthi Duniya but this article is SPOT ON

http://www.chauthiduniya.com/2013/04/नरेंद्र-मोदी-के-ख़िलाफ़-क.html

Excerpts:

नरेंद्र मोदी गुजरात में क्यों चुनाव जीतते रहे हैं और क्यों चुनाव जीतते रहेंगे, इसकी वजह हैं वे मतदाता, जो मुस्लिम नहीं हैं और जिनका यही मानना है कि नरेंद्र मोदी के रहते गुजरात में मुसलमान अपने दायरे के भीतर ही रहेंगे. उन्हें उन पार्टियों से बहुत डर लगता है, जो सेक्युलर मानी जाती हैं. गुजरात के बहुसंख्यक समाज या ग़ैर मुसलमानों को लगता है कि अगर नरेंद्र मोदी हार गए और कोई दूसरा जीत गया, तो गुजरात में नरोदा पाटिया जैसे दंगे फिर शुरू हो जाएंगे और दोबारा उन्हें दंगों के माहौल में ही जीना पड़ेगा.

अब देखें कि अगर भारतीय जनता पार्टी नरेंद्र मोदी को प्रधानमंत्री पद का उम्मीदवार बनाती है, तो क्या होता है. मोदी ग्रोथ, गवर्नेंस और सेक्युलरिज्म का नारा देते हैं, तो ऐसे में भारतीय जनता पार्टी या नरेंद्र मोदी का वह कट्टर समर्थक वर्ग, जो हिंदुत्व में भरोसा करता है, भारतीय जनता पार्टी से फौरन छिटक जाएगा. मुसलमान भारतीय जनता पार्टी के साथ आएं या न आएं, लेकिन यह कट्टर हिंदू भारतीय जनता पार्टी से फौरन दूर चला जाएगा और यह नरेंद्र मोदी के लिए सबसे बड़ी परेशानी है. प्रधानमंत्री पद का कोई भी उम्मीदवार 20 प्रतिशत मुस्लिम आबादी को अनदेखा नहीं कर सकता. और अगर नरेंद्र मोदी मुसलमानों के प्रति मुलायम भाषा का इस्तेमाल करेंगे, तो उनका हश्र भी ठीक वैसा ही होगा, जैसा कि लालकृष्ण आडवाणी का जिन्ना को सेक्युलर बताने के बाद हुआ था.

मोदी के विकास की रणनीति और संघ की राम मंदिर बनाने की रणनीति में एक कॉन्ट्राडिक्शन है. और वह यह है कि भाजपा, शिवसेना और शिरोमणि अकाली दल को छोड़कर बाक़ी सभी दल मुस्लिम अपीज़मेंट के नाम पर, जिसका कि भाजपा जोर-शोर से प्रचार करती है, कांग्रेस की तरफ़ खड़े हो जाएंगे. ठीक वैसे ही, जैसे उत्तर प्रदेश के चुनाव में जब यह प्रचार भारतीय जनता पार्टी ने ज़ोर-शोर से किया कि चुनाव के बाद उसकी और मायावती की मिली-जुली सरकार बनेगी, तो ऐसी स्थिति में मुसलमानों ने एकजुट होकर अपना सारा वोट मुलायम सिंह को ही दे दिया था.


जब प्रधानमंत्री पद का सवाल आएगा, तब एक बार फिर भारतीय जनता पार्टी को इतिहास याद करना चाहिए. जब लालकृष्ण आडवाणी को प्रधानमंत्री बनाने की बात आई, तो राजनाथ सिंह ने अपना दावा किया कि मैं प्रधानमंत्री क्यों नहीं बन सकता. अभी राजनाथ सिंह नरेंद्र मोदी को साथ लेकर चल रहे हैं और शायद इसीलिए हर समारोह में नरेंद्र मोदी राजनाथ सिंह को माला पहनाते देखे जा रहे हैं. इन दोनों को देखकर ऐसा लगता है, मानो राम-लक्ष्मण का मिलन हो रहा हो, लेकिन जब प्रधानमंत्री पद की दावेदारी में गोलियां चलेंगी, तो राजनाथ सिंह आगे खड़े होंगे या वह नरेंद्र मोदी को आगे खड़ा कर देंगे, ताकि नरेंद्र मोदी धराशायी हो जाएं, इसे कौन जानता है?

नरेंद्र मोदी चूंकि समझदार या चालाक राजनीतिज्ञ हैं, इसलिए उन्हें मालूम है कि अगर भारतीय जनता पार्टी को 160 या 175 सीटें मिलती हैं और उसके सहयोगी कहते हैं कि वे नरेंद्र मोदी को प्रधानमंत्री के रूप में नहीं चाहते, तब उस समय भारतीय जनता पार्टी के सांसदों की आवाज़ बहुत प्रमुख होगी और यह ज़ाहिर-सी बात है कि जिसके पास ज़्यादा सांसद होंगे, वह बाजी मार लेगा. दरअसल, यही सोचकर नरेंद्र मोदी ने अभी से शतरंज की बिसात पर अमित शाह के रूप में एक वजीर बैठा दिया है, जो चारों तरफ़ मार कर सकता है. अब नरेंद्र मोदी इस बात का ध्यान रखेंगे कि राजनाथ सिंह, आडवाणी जी, अरुण जेटली और सुषमा स्वराज के समर्थकों को कितनी टिकटें मिलती हैं. उनके समर्थकों को अपनी ओर तोड़ना और जो न टूटें, उन्हें टिकट न देना अमित शाह का मुख्य काम होगा.

राजनाथ सिंह का यह प्रयास अभी तक बिना दरार के चलता दिखाई दे रहा है, लेकिन ओवर डोमिनेटिंग पर्सनेलिटी को अपने साथ रखकर बहुत दिनों तक नहीं चला जा सकता. नरेंद्र मोदी ओवर डोमिनेटिंग हैं. वह राजनाथ सिंह को भी डोमिनेट कर रहे हैं और गडकरी को भी. अरुण जेटली एवं सुषमा स्वराज इस श्रेणी में कहीं आते ही नहीं और लालकृष्ण आडवाणी अपनी इज्जत को लेकर चुप हैं. क्या यह ऐसे ही चलता रहेगा या ओवर डोमिनेटिंग पर्सनेलिटी के अंतर्विरोध जल्दी सामने आएंगे. अगर ये अंतर्विरोध सामने आए, तो भारतीय जनता पार्टी का पावर गेम ही बदल जाएगा

संघ के कुछ वरिष्ठ नेता भारतीय जनता पार्टी पर तल्ख हैं. उनका कहना है कि आगे आने वाले कुछ महीनों में महंगाई मुद्दा नहीं रह जाएगी. उदाहरण के रूप में वे बताते हैं कि पेट्रोल सस्ता हुआ है, चांदी भी सस्ती हो गई है. अगर पेट्रोल पांच रुपये और नीचे आ गया, जो कि उनका मानना है कि अगले दो महीनों में आ जाएगा, तो महंगाई कोई मुद्दा नहीं रहेगी. भारतीय जनता पार्टी के मुख्यमंत्रियों को यह समझ में नहीं आया कि कांग्रेस द्वारा पेट्रोल के दाम बढ़ाने के फैसले के ख़िलाफ़ अगर वे अपने राज्य का टैक्स घटा देते और उनके यहां पेट्रोल सस्ता बिकता, तो लोगों से वे कह सकते थे कि हम आपके हित में खड़े हैं, भले ही सरकार को दूसरे साधनों से पैसा कमाना पड़े, लेकिन पेट्रोल एवं डीजल की मूल्य बढ़ोत्तरी का प्रभाव जनता पर नहीं पड़ेगा. हालांकि, भारतीय जनता पार्टी के किसी भी मुख्यमंत्री ने ऐसा नहीं किया.

राजनाथ सिंह के बारे में संघ का कहना है कि वह जिस सीढ़ी पर गए, उन्होंने उस सीढ़ी को ही समाप्त कर दिया. उत्तर प्रदेश के मुख्यमंत्री बने, पार्टी हार गई. केंद्र में मंत्री बने, केंद्र में पार्टी हार गई. एक गाज़ियाबाद सीट के लिए उन्होंने कम से कम आठ सीटें हरवा दीं और अजित सिंह को गाज़ियाबाद जीतने के लिए बहुत सारी सीटें तोह़फे में दे दीं, जिसका भारतीय जनता पार्टी में काफी विरोध भी हुआ.
 
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desijat said:
True and let me guess what his first action will be, to order massacre to all those who resemble chinese to take revenge on China?
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Desi,

Stop stereotyping. When Modi was in China he raised border issues with top Chinese leaders(Even before this issue). When it comes to international strategies and interest of a nation, you have to stop being a "Soft Country". Nation's interest run on Holier-than thou approach not on requests.
 
desijat said:
I am not a big fan of Chauthi Duniya but this article is SPOT ON

.
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To me, this article is completely biased. No where does the author try even once to keep a balanced viewpoint. He wrote in the tone as Digvijay speaks.
Who doesn't use tactics to gain more votes? Name one MP/MLA please. Any idea how Mr Bhupinder Hooda became CM for a second term? Hint : He is a "khiladi".

OK, even if this link is SPOT ON, what about the link I gave in my post above? You evaded that link knowingly. :)
 
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malikdeepak1 said:
To me, this article is completely biased. No where does the author try even once to keep a balanced viewpoint. He wrote in the tone as Digvijay speaks.
Who doesn't use tactics to gain more votes? Name one MP/MLA please. Any idea how Mr Bhupinder Hooda became CM for a second term? Hint : He is a "khiladi".

OK, even if this link is SPOT ON, what about the link I gave in my post above? You evaded that link knowingly. :)
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On your link- good for him. I did not evade it but I dont think required any analysis.

On the analysis- I find it to be quite true and factual. I am the biggest critique of this publication and this article is not giving any opinion and putting possible scenarios which by the way hold waters.
 
desijat said:
On your link- good for him. I did not evade it but I dont think required any analysis.

Why? It caught the lie of Sanjiv Bhat thats why? And you made claims that an Officer of IPS cadre is saying these things, hence it holds substance! Ya Supreme Court par bhi Modi ne dabaav bana diya tha? :victorious:

On the analysis- I find it to be quite true and factual. I am the biggest critique of this publication and this article is not giving any opinion and putting possible scenarios which by the way hold waters.
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Scenarios are with every politician. I can make n number of scenarios as how and why congress wants Raul baba to be PM. So you will say SPOT ON there also? or your loyalties will pounce upon your integrity? Politics me khel khelne padte hai. Aise hi koi upar nahi jane deta. Jo baat is chothiduniya ke article me likhi hai ki sirf non-muslims ne Modi ko vote kiya, that is complete non-sense. Thode din pahle credible NDTV ke analysis ne ye prove kiya tha ki 33 me se 20+ muslim seats par Modi jeeta hai. You can make out some sense of it only if you want to.
 
Desi you are probably are right here, looks like that was the calculation of pakis, but Vajpayee proved them wrong, we all know it now...

desijat said:
So you are implying that a foriegn country bases its acts on the basis of a leader? That implies Vajpayee was one of the weakest leader we have had that Kargil happened?
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i dont think Vajpayee did anything out of the blue or extraordinary in Kargil.

The real reason for Kargil was not that Pakistan evaluated Vajpayee weak but because Mushsharaff had other plans in his mind and that is why not even their PM knew about it until last minute. The plan indeed was superb but they went wrong in implementation. Had it been an open attack by Army the results and causalities for India could have been worst.

And if I were to get numbers for a 5 year term by any government, NDA govt proved to be weakest against terror.

rsdalal said:
Desi you are probably are right here, looks like that was the calculation of pakis, but Vajpayee proved them wrong, we all know it now...
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desijat said:
I am not sure which road you are talking about but can just a road be a yardstick for development? or are roads the only yardstick of development? I am sure no economist or the planning commission of India would agree with you bro
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Ok,,lets talk about the Chandigarh -Delhi National Highway..!! it is in the same condition from almost 6-7 years..!! (hope you know it buddy..)
and yes roads is definitely one of the parameters to measure growth...!!there are others too.
 
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