1857 ad

[amans]

1857 Ad Indian rebellion is called first Indian war of independence. But the sepoys of East India company only rebelled when they found out that the cartridges they had to bite in order to load their rifles were greased with beef and pork fat. They rebelled only after that fact was known to them.
So why is this called first Indian war of independence? These sepoys were motivated by religious fervor and not by any love for their country. They can be compared to jihadis who are motivated by their religion.

 

[brahmtewatia]

1857 Ad Indian rebellion is called first Indian war of independence. But the sepoys of East India company only rebelled when they found out that the cartridges they had to bite in order to load their rifles were greased with beef and pork fat. They rebelled only after that fact was known to them.
So why is this called first Indian war of independence? These sepoys were motivated by religious fervor and not by any love for their country. They can be compared to jihadis who are motivated by their religion.

india got independence from britain... 1857 was a mutiny - a rebellion, and against britishers (<<< here is yr answer part 1)... hence it is known as 1st war of independence though historians still remain divided on whether the rebellion can properly be considered a war of Indian independence or not.

(answer part 2 >>>) though the reasons were entirely different nd surely were motivated by religious fervour, the rebellion led to the dissolution of the east india co. nd forced the british to reorganize the army, the financial system nd the indian administration. india was thereafter directly governed by the crown in the new british raj.

 

[brahmtewatia]

So why is this called first Indian war of independence? These sepoys were motivated by religious fervor and not by any love for their country. They can be compared to jihadis who are motivated by their religion.

i know whats going to be yr nxt Q.

for tht here is the answer >>> if india wud have been still ruled by east india co. or british raj. the britishers wud have called or wud be calling 'mangal pandey' nd other sepoys as bloody jihadis... see the perceptions differ.

 

[malikdeepak1]

1857 Ad Indian rebellion is called first Indian war of independence. But the sepoys of East India company only rebelled when they found out that the cartridges they had to bite in order to load their rifles were greased with beef and pork fat. They rebelled only after that fact was known to them.

Ok, but what did Laxmibai and Tantiya Tope had to do with this?? They used talwars and not guns!!

 

[akshaymalik84]

Ok, but what did Laxmibai and Tantiya Tope had to do with this?? They used talwars and not guns!!

Greased cartridges were the true cause of the rebellion,but a combination of interference by the British in local land rights and property succession, the abolition of certain religious customs, and the displacement of ancient royal houses were also major factors.

 

[malikdeepak1]

Greased cartridges were the true cause of the rebellion

May be! It was definitely started by the Indian soldiers in East India co (as per history), but the root cause can be debatable . U pointed out good reasons to support the rebel. Rajwade keval kathputli ban kar rah gaye the. They were kings only for a namesake. Aur unki territories ko toda ja rha tha. They had to rebel, else whatever they had with them wuld also had gone to britishers. It was indeed planned all over India. Had it been not started a day earlier by Mangal Pandey, who knows the story could have been entirely different!

 

[brahmtewatia]

members pls appreciate the reasoning in the op of the thread. the author does not want to debate on the reasons... his main objective apart frm questioning the mutiny as 1st war of independence is comparison btwn sepoys of the rebellion to jihadis who as per him, are both motivated by their religion.

i know whats going to be yr nxt Q.

for tht here is the answer >>> if india wud have been still ruled by east india co. or british raj. the britishers wud have called or wud be calling 'mangal pandey' nd other sepoys as bloody jihadis... see the perceptions differ.

<!-- / message --><!-- sig --><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

 

[akshaymalik84]

members pls appreciate the reasoning in the op of the thread. the author does not want to debate on the reasons... his main objective is comparison btwn sepoys of the rebellion to jihadis who as per him, are both motivated by their religion. <!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

Right Brahm, author does not want to discuss the reasons. There is a similar thread started by Ravi Chaudhary
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?t=801

For me, 1857 was a mutiny. As you said, it was a fight for the religion. British officers practiced racial segregation between Indian soliders and themselves but earlier they did not revolt. It was when the religious sentiment came in existance. Every class of rebellion had different reason to fight. So cant be called Independence war. Moreover it was not fought across whole country. Mainly focused in centre and north india.

 

[amans]

So it was a religious war in the beginning but as it progressed some petty kings/queens joined in, thinking it was the right time to get their kingdoms back from the British. Then it was not a war of independence but a religious war.

 

[brahmtewatia]

1857 Ad Indian rebellion is called first Indian war of independence. But the sepoys of East India company only rebelled when they found out that the cartridges they had to bite in order to load their rifles were greased with beef and pork fat. They rebelled only after that fact was known to them.
So why is this called first Indian war of independence? These sepoys were motivated by religious fervor and not by any love for their country. They can be compared to jihadis who are motivated by their religion.

So it was a religious war in the beginning but as it progressed some petty kings/queens joined in, thinking it was the right time to get their kingdoms back from the British. Then it was not a war of independence but a religious war.

Aman's signature: With malice toward none

aman,

excuse me for getting a bit personal with you. you raise some valid questions but they are always marred with your malice towards india. it reminds me of very popular khushwant singh's weekly columns in HT (... ahhh, love those days nd his write-ups) wch were titled 'with malice towards one and all' <<< why dont you change your signatures to this line.

bro, dont take it personally, but i'm damn serious abt it nd if i'm addressing this issue to you, i've some feelings nd some valid reasons... or else, you can also take it... 'tu kaun mein khwamkhaa'.... whatever !!!

you need to wipe out that 'old toner black dust' that envelopes yr mind-set. i'm also a big critic of india when it comes to discussing current issues nd our banana indian democracy nd the degradation of morality/ethics... but tht is momentary nd out of frustration. that does not mean i always carry truck-loads of malice nd spit venom at every given opportunity.

if you are serious abt the discussion, tell me how far you are convinced with my two explanations in post #2 nd #3 on this thread. also, tell me what is the definition of 'independence' in yr dictionary... nd nd nd what do you feel after my 'bakar bakar' in this post.

now look here... this thread of yours wud hv piled up as junk in JATland server archives, if hadn't picked it up. folks will start (have even started) taking you for granted... oh here comes aman with his never-to-end-nonsense once again. hope you understand what i mean to say. as of me, i see tht hidden intellect, somewhere in you. remember... "dwelling on the negative simply contributes to its power... decision is yours !!!

... yours, big B <input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

 

[amans]

This has nothing to do with negative or positive. I am only trying to get opinions from others as to why 1857 AD was called first war of independence when it was started by East India company sepoys(due to the fact:that their company supplied cartridges were greased with beef and pork fat). The fact that it was also a religious war is being minimized.
Before these cartridges were greased with beef and pork fat, East India company sepoys continued to serve East India Company faithfully and fought against their own countrymen gladly.

 

[rajivsp]

I would love to have a comment from respected Mr. Ravi Chaudhary on this topic. According to me 1857 was just a propaganda of Britishers nothing else ( A false fable) . There were less than 2 lakh English at that time in India and most of the Indians never got a chance to see the face of any English. Then How its possible whole India had such a feeling of revolt against English? They were not exploited by English but Zamidaars who were Indians And it was not new for exploited.

 

[ravichaudhary]

The events of 1857 conjure up different views for different people.

For the British it was a simply mutiny of some native sepoys. The mutiny was joined by some disgruntled petty rajas/ranis- Tantia Tope, Rani of Jhansi. It was put down and the rule of law was established.

To Indian nationalist it was a war of independence to overthrow the yoke of the British.

Some have tried to characterize it as a religious war. The evidence for that is quite scanty.

What did it mean to the Jats?

Dilip Singh Ahlawat in his book “ Jat Viron ka Ithihass” has pretty much a full cahpetr on the causes of this war, and what it meant to the Jats.

For one, the loss of the war, meant severe retaliation by the British. It also meant the dismemberment of the Sarv Khap of Haryana, and the banning of meetings of the Sarvv Khap Panchayat. The Sarv Khap was broken up, part being given to Punjab, part of Rajasthan, Delhi was carved out, and part to the province of Agra, which was merged into the United provinces of Agra and Oudh, now called Uttar Pradesh.


I had translated Dilip Singh Ahlawat’s chapter, and it is on the files section in the Jathistory group,

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JatHistory/files/

1857 war of Independence.

And also as a series of posts on the same website.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JatHistory/message/1126 to 1155


Readers may wish to form their own opinions.

Ravi Chaudhary

 

[mhundpuriamann]

just read vivekananda !

1857 Ad Indian rebellion is called first Indian war of independence. But the sepoys of East India company only rebelled when they found out that the cartridges they had to bite in order to load their rifles were greased with beef and pork fat. They rebelled only after that fact was known to them.
So why is this called first Indian war of independence? These sepoys were motivated by religious fervor and not by any love for their country. They can be compared to jihadis who are motivated by their religion.

to get this confusion's answer just read some literature of swami vivekanandan u will come to know automaticaly.

see brother like every individual a nation also has it's special character , religion is the core of our country. U take everything from a hindu he will not bother much and then just try touch his reliogious part , u will be responsible for the aftermath.

y do u people see the world always from the eyes of western people.

Maari jaat budhhi lagaao cheezon mein , it's a

gift nature has given u buddy

 

[drssrana2003]

1857 Ad Indian rebellion is called first Indian war of independence. But the sepoys of East India company only rebelled when they found out that the cartridges they had to bite in order to load their rifles were greased with beef and pork fat. They rebelled only after that fact was known to them.

So why is this called first Indian war of independence? These sepoys were motivated by religious fervor and not by any love for their country. They can be compared to jihadis who are motivated by their religion.

1857<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>
The uprising of 1857, after 150 years was celebrated, during the year 2007, at the national level as the first war of independence. Perhaps few events of Indian history have attracted so large a number of studies as the this event .Equally large is the variation in perception of the event among analysts.The bulk of British writers tend to portray it as a sepoy mutiny further enflamed by religious sentiments. Some of the studies call it a revolt fomented by some vested interests, who were adversely affected by certain policy decisions of the Company Sarkar like the ‘law of lapse’.However, many post independence studies have tried to show that the uprising was widely spread and the participation of the common masses in it in a big way makes into less than war of independence.Didn’t we have several pitched battles took place between the british forces and the Indian forces under the command of Bahadurshah, Rani Laxmibai, Raja Nahar Singh and several Nawabs of the North? .
So perceptions are bound to be in variety. But the totality of the events, though spread over a considerably short span of time makes a single tapestry which, when looked from a distance of time today, surely appear to be presenting an idea of war of independence. The idea of the possible new political dispensation, however nebulous was in place for motivating the various elements participating in the war. It does not appear fair to call the fighers of this war ‘jihadis’. The British were a trading company then, and an alien one, licensed to keep army, hire army and rule over the divided political entities on the subcontinent (ironically, the pattern is similar today).
Thanks
s.s.rana

 

[fateh]

Brothers, Firstly, It was a revolt not a war. Reason was not slavery. Also the aim of the revolt was not indipendance. Secondly, No writing on the subject available to us, is without biases. Officially the event was noted down by Britishers, some news papers did publish these news but most of the reported material was destryed by the than Govt & also you know how media reportings are done. Thirdly, You know well as to how official history is written/changed in India. Forthly, The Britishers considered the revolt as mutany, because mutany was most serious offence for the troops, otherwise the whole incident where people other than military men were involved, cannot be called mutany. Fifthly, The name to the revolt given lateron after the indipendace was the first war of indipendace only because word revolt/mutany/religious war may even have adverse effect on the thinking of multy religious population & the defence forces. Also the Indian Govt wanted to project those people who were involved in the revolt, as Hiros, thus some respectable name has to be given to the incident and that is why the name was given. Otherwise the happening was a revolt.

 

[drrajpalsingh]

The events of 1857 conjure up different views for different people.

For the British it was a simply mutiny of some native sepoys. The mutiny was joined by some disgruntled petty rajas/ranis- Tantia Tope, Rani of Jhansi. It was put down and the rule of law was established.

To Indian nationalist it was a war of independence to overthrow the yoke of the British.

Some have tried to characterize it as a religious war. The evidence for that is quite scanty.

What did it mean to the Jats?

Dilip Singh Ahlawat in his book “ Jat Viron ka Ithihass” has pretty much a full cahpetr on the causes of this war, and what it meant to the Jats.

For one, the loss of the war, meant severe retaliation by the British. It also meant the dismemberment of the Sarv Khap of Haryana, and the banning of meetings of the Sarvv Khap Panchayat. The Sarv Khap was broken up, part being given to Punjab, part of Rajasthan, Delhi was carved out, and part to the province of Agra, which was merged into the United provinces of Agra and Oudh, now called Uttar Pradesh.


I had translated Dilip Singh Ahlawat’s chapter, and it is on the files section in the Jathistory group,

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JatHistory/files/

1857 war of Independence.

And also as a series of posts on the same website.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JatHistory/message/1126 to 1155


Readers may wish to form their own opinions.

Ravi Chaudhary

Respected Ravi Ji,

You have nicely summed up the significance of 1857 A.D. for the Jats. Permit me to add here that 1857 AD events led to forfeiture of many zamindari rights of the Jats of those villages which had participated in the First War of Indian Independence. In addition to meting out severe punishment to several Jats, Raja Nahar Singh of Ballbhgarh was hanged and his kingdom merged in the British domains.

Dr. Raj Pal Singh

 

[thukrela]

View attachment 13507

भाई अमन. ..बोहोत सही बात छेड़ दी है

और काहे का war of independence ?? इक्का दुक्का एक-दो जगह तो हुआ था रिवोल्ट!
एक map डाला है, उसमे 6-7 छोटे-छोटे से ''बिन्दु'' है काले रंग मे, केवल यही हुआ था रिवोल्ट!
और इसे राष्टीय सतर की आजादी की लड़ाई कहना महज मजाक है

और अगर आजादी की लड़ाई छिड़ी भी थी, तो केवल यही तक ही सिमित क्यों रह गयी ?
शेष भारतीय princly states की देशभक्ति कहाँ थी ?

 

[drrajpalsingh]

View attachment 13507

भाई अमन. ..बोहोत सही बात छेड़ दी है

और काहे का war of independence ?? इक्का दुक्का एक-दो जगह तो हुआ था रिवोल्ट!
एक map डाला है, उसमे 6-7 छोटे-छोटे से ''बिन्दु'' है काले रंग मे, केवल यही हुआ था रिवोल्ट!
और इसे राष्टीय सतर की आजादी की लड़ाई कहना महज मजाक है

और अगर आजादी की लड़ाई छिड़ी भी थी, तो केवल यही तक ही सिमित क्यों रह गयी ?
शेष भारतीय princly states की देशभक्ति कहाँ थी ?

Dear Friend,

It would be nice of you if you could let us know names of the places where इक्का दुक्का एक-दो जगह तो हुआ था रिवोल्ट!


regards