Again - A Marriage in Same village

[deepika]

Anju its not other's assumption but your own that people are assuming such a thing.Let me elaborate this one now.Even if they have different gotra still they are brother sister.For example in my village there are jat families from two gotras other than mine.One is Duhan and other one is Sihag(mine is Singhroha)....now as my parents are looking for a match for me so they keep in mind that the guy's gotra shudn't be either Duhan or Sihag because indirectly they are my brothersI am also from cosmopolitan village like u

Finally a comment that goes against the utopian villages...

A question for the worthy contributors to this thread- Is it a fair assumption that the couple belonging to the same caste and village will also have the same "Gaut"?

(Or may be I am from a more cosmopolitan village or I am mis-informed)
Regards

 

[deepika]

Ofcourse young generation lacks moral values.Forget about a couple having same gotra i have even heared of incidences of youngsters going out with first cousins and even with siblings(i hope you won't get shockers to read this one).Thats the finest example of how low can one go.I am sure u will agree that its something not even allowed in any of the western country.Rahi baat manne ki toh obviously you can't force someone but atleast we shouldn't disrespect the relations we have been blessed with and what we have been told by our elders regarding certain relationships since childhood.

1) Just to give more inputs to discuss it further - recently I was putting up with one Hindu guy from Chennai and another Hindu guy from Bombay. And in their families its quite natural and traditional to marry their real maternal uncle's daughter (sage mama ki ladki). As far as I know, In Haryana, Punjab n UP - hamare yaha to sage mama ki ladki ko bahan hi maante hen n shadiya bhi nhi hoti. Yes, one's cousin brother can marry one's "mama ki ladki". Maayne - ek a gaon me ya parivar me, ek a gaut me - bua ar bhatiji bayee ja sake hen. And "Hindu Marriage Act -1955" is uniformly applicable to all Hindu families in India. So, where are we different from Muslims when it comes to marriages??

2) Do we really think, in our villages "Gaon ki sabhi ladkiyo ko behan kaha aur mana jata hai"? I have seen innumerous incidents in different villages wherein out of same gaut - boys n gals are making luv n fun - irrespective of their moral values. "kisi relation ko kahne or manne me din raat ka pharak hota he". I don't see its truely observed in many a cases - there are 'n' number of incestous abuse cases around, till the time they don't come in limelight - nobody seems to care? Kisliye? Is it depletion of Moral values or lack of proper Education (be it formal education, sex education or any other form of education) or Late age marriages or INDIVIDUALITY, or westernization or any other factor?
But one thing for sure in my opinion - law should protect every citizen and should punish them as well for their wrong doings - panchayats or any other form should stand nowhere to pass the "death warrant" atleast. Panchayats or other types of autonomous governances too have their own importance but they are nobody to take any decision on life/death matters.

 

[annch]

Deepika,

It would have been fun if we had belonged to the same cosmopolitan village.

For my own better understanding, I had checked if it was a fair assumption that the couple may not have the same Gaut, which made the marriage legal as per HINDU Marriage Act stated by Sunil.
The latest news-

http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20090324/818/tnl-haryana-caste-council-rejects-hindu.html

Regards

Anju its not other's assumption but your own that people are assuming such a thing.Let me elaborate this one now.Even if they have different gotra still they are brother sister.For example in my village there are jat families from two gotras other than mine.One is Duhan and other one is Sihag(mine is Singhroha)....now as my parents are looking for a match for me so they keep in mind that the guy's gotra shudn't be either Duhan or Sihag because indirectly they are my brothersI am also from cosmopolitan village like u

 

[deepika]

Even if that was the case i hope i have fulfilled ur curiosity regarding the same issueI also wish we the same

Deepika,

It would have been fun if we had belonged to the same cosmopolitan village.

For my own better understanding, I had checked if it was a fair assumption that the couple may not have the same Gaut, which made the marriage legal as per HINDU Marriage Act stated by Sunil.
The latest news-

http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20090324/818/tnl-haryana-caste-council-rejects-hindu.html

Regards

 

[vijay]

Finally a comment that goes against the utopian villages...

A question for the worthy contributors to this thread- Is it a fair assumption that the couple belonging to the same caste and village will also have the same "Gaut"?

(Or may be I am from a more cosmopolitan village or I am mis-informed)
Regards

The news didn't mentioned about the gotra's of the couple so everybody is just assuming about that. They may be or may not be of same gotra.

If they belongs to the same gotra then it seems illegal according to the law ( though i am not a law expert .. people can tell better than me ). But if they are not from the same gotra then as per law there is nothing illegal in this marriage.

Special case of oppsoing this marriage can be the only one reason if the couple's mothers have the same gotra or gorta of a person's Mother is same as the Gotra of other person's Father and vice versa. If all these criterion are fulfilled then there is nothing illegal in it.

Other Gotras of the villages hardly matters. These rules are made by the Good for Nothing KHAPS and are hardly followed by anyone except in those kHAP DOMINATED areas. if you are talking about the cosmoplotian villages then what say about a bigger village where people of more than 100 gotras resides. Do they ever get married (if they follow such village gotra are bhai bahan norms) .. i have doubts. But yes generally we avoid marriage in the same village and that's only traditional custom but not a RULE.

 

[annch]

Thank you Vijay....for saving grace....(and catching the satire in my post!)
Please do check out the latest in news on how the incident has snowballed to a mandate by the Khap...
Regards

The news didn't mentioned about the gotra's of the couple so everybody is just assuming about that. They may be or may not be of same gotra.

If they belongs to the same gotra then it seems illegal according to the law ( though i am not a law expert .. people can tell better than me ). But if they are not from the same gotra then as per law there is nothing illegal in this marriage.

Special case of oppsoing this marriage can be the only one reason if the couple's mothers have the same gotra or gorta of a person's Mother is same as the Gotra of other person's Father and vice versa. If all these criterion are fulfilled then there is nothing illegal in it.

Other Gotras of the villages hardly matters. These rules are made by the Good for Nothing KHAPS and are hardly followed by anyone except in those kHAP DOMINATED areas. if you are talking about the cosmoplotian villages then what say about a bigger village where people of more than 100 gotras resides. Do they ever get married (if they follow such village gotra are bhai bahan norms) .. i have doubts. But yes generally we avoid marriage in the same village and that's only traditional custom but not a RULE.

 

[vijay]

Thank you Vijay....for saving grace....(and catching the satire in my post!)
Please do check out the latest in news on how the incident has snowballed to a mandate by the Khap...
Regards

Yes, i observed that immediately ( the satire ).

More you read about the Tughlaki decisons made by those Khaps more you would feel like living in a stane age. So it's better that just feel pity on the people who are suffering because of these Khaps, prey for them to be blessed with some sense and move ahead for your peace of mind.

 

[brahmtewatia]

i've heard from many abt various obnoxious decisions taken by our सरपंच's nd prominent चौधरी's representing khaps or whatever. i've no idea as to what they do and how much influence they have on moral as well as social decorum of a village/area. pls excuse my lack of knowledge on the issue, but in my opinion सरपंच(s) in olden days were very wise men and their decision(s) were honoured by all villagers. i met one such चौधरी, some time back... to me he didn't sounded like a wise men. in fact he was more concerned abt his चौधर nd often times during my brief interaction with him i found him more concerned giving तुर्रा to his मूछें nd adusting his खंडवा several times.

... wud appreciate if someone can throw more light on their activities in this thread or may be start another thread on the subject.

 

[vijay]

i've heard from many abt various obnoxious decisions taken by our सरपंच's nd prominent चौधरी's representing khaps or whatever. i've no idea as to what they do and how much influence they have on moral as well as social decorum of a village/area. pls excuse my lack of knowledge on the issue, but in my opinion सरपंच(s) in olden days were very wise men and their decision(s) were honoured by all villagers. i met one such चौधरी, some time back... to me he didn't sounded like a wise men. in fact he was more concerned abt his चौधर nd often times during my brief interaction with him i found him more concerned giving तुर्रा to his मूछें nd adusting his खंडवा several times.

... wud appreciate if someone can throw more light on their activities in this thread or may be start another thread on the subject.

That's exactly what they ( Read Khap Heads/Sarpanches) do and apart from these they try their best to influence the local political leaders, Police Officers, Administrative Officers etc with their status. But showing their own importance and imposing their decision on others are their favorite pastime.

 

[anilsangwan]

These Sarpanches are mostly uneducated people in most of the villages. Even if they are educated, they always try to behave like uneducated mass ones because they have to retain their vote bank.

These so called local "Judges" (as these Panchayatis assume themselves to be) have no right to issue death warrents. Such kind of Surpanches should be jailed for 20 years or better for life term. Only examplary and hard decisions can change the prevailing bad practicises in the society.

 

[satyenderdeswal]

Dear Anil,

For the same reason (Highlighted in red) such kind of hard decisions are required in our society.
If somebody is polluting enviornment and not getting punishment , then other gets motivated to follow there action due to lack of fear...

These Sarpanches are mostly uneducated people in most of the villages. Even if they are educated, they always try to behave like uneducated mass ones because they have to retain their vote bank.

These so called local "Judges" (as these Panchayatis assume themselves to be) have no right to issue death warrents. Such kind of Surpanches should be jailed for 20 years or better for life term. Only examplary and hard decisions can change the prevailing bad practicises in the society.[/quote]

 

[anilsangwan]

Gaam mein nyu kahya karein..... "Jo jama thaalli sei... jiss ne koi kaam nahi....woh e panchayati huya kare" ...

And believe me...it is a fact that these Panchayati's never take good decisions. Their decisions are always taken keeping in mind that "it should be accepted by the weaker party"..... Sabb apne aap ne badaa panchayati dikhaawann k chakkar mein uss aadmi ne dabaaya karein jo bechara laachar ho ...er unki baat maan le...... Thaadaa aadmi jo unn ki taant mein lathh maarey... uss k khilaaf koi Panchayati na bolya kare...

 

[sunitahooda]

तुर्रा is realated to खंडवा & ताव दिया जाता है मूछों को

i've heard from many abt various obnoxious decisions taken by our सरपंच's nd prominent चौधरी's representing khaps or whatever. i've no idea as to what they do and how much influence they have on moral as well as social decorum of a village/area. pls excuse my lack of knowledge on the issue, but in my opinion सरपंच(s) in olden days were very wise men and their decision(s) were honoured by all villagers. i met one such चौधरी, some time back... to me he didn't sounded like a wise men. in fact he was more concerned abt his चौधर nd often times during my brief interaction with him i found him more concerned giving तुर्रा to his मूछें nd adusting his खंडवा several times.

... wud appreciate if someone can throw more light on their activities in this thread or may be start another thread on the subject.

 

[rakeshsehrawat]

ळोगो के बहुत ही उम्दा किस्म के भासन के बहुत ही अछ्छा लगा

क्या यहा कोई ऎसा है जो उस लड्की की जगह अपनी बहन को रख के फ़ैन्सला देगा कि क्या जो फ़ैन्सला लिया गया वो सही है या गलत?
जब गाव एक हो गया तो गोत्र अलग होने से क्या फ़रक पड्ता है?
रही बात पन्चायत की बुराई करने की तो जब ये पन्चयात आरक्शन के लिये धूप मे जलती है तब क्यो उनकी बुराई नही करते ?
हर सिक्के के दो पेहलू होते है पन्चायात मे लिये गये फ़ैन्सले ९०% सही होते है और ऐसे होते है जिन्हे कोई कोर्ट नही दे सकता उन फ़ैन्सलो को चुनोती देने की हिम्मत भी किसी मे नही है!
एक सच्चे मन से देखा जाये तो ये गलत है ! हम यहा आते है और अपने आप को जाट केहल्वाने मे गर्व मेहसूस करते है तो हमे हमारे जाट समाज के बनाये गये कनूनो को मानना चाहिये ! ऎसे फ़ैन्सले लिये गये थे तभी भारत मे पन्चायती राज को मनयता मिलि ! और एक नीच करम करनेवाले के पक्श मे बोलने की बजये ये देख्नना चाहिये की ऐसे करम कि उन्हे कडी सजा मिले ताकि आज जो आग उन्होने लगाई है कल आपका घर ना जला दे!

 

[satyenderdeswal]

Rakesh...

Thanx for ur nice views...
I am totally agree with you in this matter...

ळोगो के बहुत ही उम्दा किस्म के भासन के बहुत ही अछ्छा लगा

क्या यहा कोई ऎसा है जो उस लड्की की जगह अपनी बहन को रख के फ़ैन्सला देगा कि क्या जो फ़ैन्सला लिया गया वो सही है या गलत?
जब गाव एक हो गया तो गोत्र अलग होने से क्या फ़रक पड्ता है?
रही बात पन्चायत की बुराई करने की तो जब ये पन्चयात आरक्शन के लिये धूप मे जलती है तब क्यो उनकी बुराई नही करते ?
हर सिक्के के दो पेहलू होते है पन्चायात मे लिये गये फ़ैन्सले ९०% सही होते है और ऐसे होते है जिन्हे कोई कोर्ट नही दे सकता उन फ़ैन्सलो को चुनोती देने की हिम्मत भी किसी मे नही है!
एक सच्चे मन से देखा जाये तो ये गलत है ! हम यहा आते है और अपने आप को जाट केहल्वाने मे गर्व मेहसूस करते है तो हमे हमारे जाट समाज के बनाये गये कनूनो को मानना चाहिये ! ऎसे फ़ैन्सले लिये गये थे तभी भारत मे पन्चायती राज को मनयता मिलि ! और एक नीच करम करनेवाले के पक्श मे बोलने की बजये ये देख्नना चाहिये की ऐसे करम कि उन्हे कडी सजा मिले ताकि आज जो आग उन्होने लगाई है कल आपका घर ना जला दे!

 

[anilsangwan]

Rakesh bhai teri baaton mein dumm hai.... Marriages in same village should be avoided.

Lekin iska matlab yeh nahi ki Sarpanch jo faisla karega wohi sahi hai..!!

No Panchayat is above law......Not even Indian Parliament. Iss desh ki Nyayapaalika sarvopari hai..

If any Surpanch is issuing death warrants..he is taking law and order in his hands. Kal ko yeh MLAs and MPs will start issuing death warrants.... and after some time koi Sheriyat jaisa law aa jaayega jaisa Pakistan ki swat ghaatti mein aa gaya hai.....Fir kya karega India... So let us accept the fact that only Law should be punishing the guilty.

ळोगो के बहुत ही उम्दा किस्म के भासन के बहुत ही अछ्छा लगा

क्या यहा कोई ऎसा है जो उस लड्की की जगह अपनी बहन को रख के फ़ैन्सला देगा कि क्या जो फ़ैन्सला लिया गया वो सही है या गलत?
जब गाव एक हो गया तो गोत्र अलग होने से क्या फ़रक पड्ता है?
रही बात पन्चायत की बुराई करने की तो जब ये पन्चयात आरक्शन के लिये धूप मे जलती है तब क्यो उनकी बुराई नही करते ?
हर सिक्के के दो पेहलू होते है पन्चायात मे लिये गये फ़ैन्सले ९०% सही होते है और ऐसे होते है जिन्हे कोई कोर्ट नही दे सकता उन फ़ैन्सलो को चुनोती देने की हिम्मत भी किसी मे नही है!
एक सच्चे मन से देखा जाये तो ये गलत है ! हम यहा आते है और अपने आप को जाट केहल्वाने मे गर्व मेहसूस करते है तो हमे हमारे जाट समाज के बनाये गये कनूनो को मानना चाहिये ! ऎसे फ़ैन्सले लिये गये थे तभी भारत मे पन्चायती राज को मनयता मिलि ! और एक नीच करम करनेवाले के पक्श मे बोलने की बजये ये देख्नना चाहिये की ऐसे करम कि उन्हे कडी सजा मिले ताकि आज जो आग उन्होने लगाई है कल आपका घर ना जला दे!

 

[anilsangwan]

But let Courts take that hard decision brother... Not any illetrate Sarpanch who represents a very small crowd ...

Dear Anil,

For the same reason (Highlighted in red) such kind of hard decisions are required in our society.
[/quote]

 

[satyenderdeswal]

Yes you are right as per the SYSTEM...
But these type of attack on our culture is beyond the court and laws...
Here they will not punish the culprits, but will support them.....

But let Courts take that hard decision brother... Not any illetrate Sarpanch who represents a very small crowd ...

Dear Anil,

For the same reason (Highlighted in red) such kind of hard decisions are required in our society.
[/quote]

 

[yudhvirmor]

ळोगो के बहुत ही उम्दा किस्म के भासन के बहुत ही अछ्छा लगा

क्या यहा कोई ऎसा है जो उस लड्की की जगह अपनी बहन को रख के फ़ैन्सला देगा कि क्या जो फ़ैन्सला लिया गया वो सही है या गलत?
जब गाव एक हो गया तो गोत्र अलग होने से क्या फ़रक पड्ता है?
रही बात पन्चायत की बुराई करने की तो जब ये पन्चयात आरक्शन के लिये धूप मे जलती है तब क्यो उनकी बुराई नही करते ?
हर सिक्के के दो पेहलू होते है पन्चायात मे लिये गये फ़ैन्सले ९०% सही होते है और ऐसे होते है जिन्हे कोई कोर्ट नही दे सकता उन फ़ैन्सलो को चुनोती देने की हिम्मत भी किसी मे नही है!
एक सच्चे मन से देखा जाये तो ये गलत है ! हम यहा आते है और अपने आप को जाट केहल्वाने मे गर्व मेहसूस करते है तो हमे हमारे जाट समाज के बनाये गये कनूनो को मानना चाहिये ! ऎसे फ़ैन्सले लिये गये थे तभी भारत मे पन्चायती राज को मनयता मिलि ! और एक नीच करम करनेवाले के पक्श मे बोलने की बजये ये देख्नना चाहिये की ऐसे करम कि उन्हे कडी सजा मिले ताकि आज जो आग उन्होने लगाई है कल आपका घर ना जला दे!

I agree... I think if we follow the model of US, half of haryana will be in jails and ppl will be more hard core cirminals..Panchyat plays important role in rural india.. I agree that they are also human beings are very good chances that they can be corrupt..

Aur agar woh corrupt hain toh konsa CM aur PM imandar hain...

 

[sunitahooda]

Leel jo-jo bahar desh jaa rey sain wey ghane liberal paak rey sain. Iss tai ghana kimme likh dyungi to chiraddki lagegi arr nyu kahngey akk PERSONAL attack kare sai....asal mai jis ney theek bataya sai wey sab USA/UK mai baithey sain arr agar mai galat nahi hoon to SHADISHUDA bhi hain, warna shayad apne hi gaam mai byah kar kai misaal kayam kar detey Par pata nahi kyu mujhe lagta to nahi ke woh aisa kartey kyunki LIKHNEY MEIN LAGTA HI KYA HAiI....after all its about using FANCY WORDS only like the opposing members did?

But let Courts take that hard decision brother... Not any illetrate Sarpanch who represents a very small crowd ...

Dear Anil,

For the same reason (Highlighted in red) such kind of hard decisions are required in our society.
[/quote]