Anna/Ramdev: Why the difference?

Where is the sarcasm?? I see no sarcasm.

I meant these two things combined is a point. In my opinion working for a social cause and helping people to become independent is different to spreading yoga. Both are good service to the community but when you have to choose between two one is inclined toward the former. This combined with his political ambitions make him diff to Anna. On one hand you see an ambitious person on the other you see a selflessly working old man. This is also about perception in general.

As far as I am concerned, I just like to see the bill to be passed and most of the demands against corruption. I dont care whether Anna does it or Ramdev because I am concerend with the end result not that much by means. I would support both on this and would like both to work together on this.
 
VipinJyani said:
Where is the sarcasm?? I see no sarcasm.

I meant these two things combined is a point. In my opinion working for a social cause and helping people to become independent is different to spreading yoga. Both are good service to the community but when you have to choose between two one is inclined toward the former. This combined with his political ambitions make him diff to Anna. This is also about perception in general.

As far as I am concerned, I just like to see the bill to be passed and most of the demands against corruption. I dont care whether Anna does it or Ramdev as I am concerend with the end result not that much by means. I would support both on this and would like both to work together on this.
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I wasn't referring to this as sarcasm. Just the part I bolded in quotes in the previous post- "may not be as sharp as you...".

Anyways, let's close that chapter.
 
prashantacmet said:
Anyway, I think it was a barbarian act from government side to crush the movement like this. If ramdev had violated any law, he could have been warned first and why goverment did not allocate any time frame to end the agitation, like 12 hours or 1 day. Goverment was quite anxious to wipe out Ramdev movement, may be goverment was scared seeing such a huge gathering or gov felt that this movement can benifit BJP
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In fact by that act they have only made Ramdev stronger. There was a saying in sanskrit : vinashkale vipreete bhudhi.
 
prashantacmet said:
There is a difference in the movement that has "political aspirations" and that has not, though circulating the same agenda. Though it's not bad to have political aspirations if a particular is carrying some agenda for public welfare but a thing lies deep down in the mind of Indian people " a person with poltical aspiration can do no good for them, ultimately he will start gulping crores of money, will indulge in scam", politicians are stereotyped in India people mind as parasites who suck their blood so at this very first step, ramdev baba fell down in the eyes of people in comparison of Anna.

Secondly, the baba luxurious way of living, property worth of 1100 crores, travelling in private jet, owning an island in foreign country make people skeptical. ramdev is making money from every corner of the world. There are allegations against baba for accumulating such a huge property, politicians like diggi babu are targeting him in media for a very long time. Whether these allegations are true or not, it disturbed the people mind somehow. Anna fought for RTI, assets of anna are neglible in comparison of baba, living a simple life in a small room of a village temple, and noone raised a finger on him till date and most importantly, he did not show any political aspirations. it attracts people and they fell a bit confident about honesty of the person for the campaign.

thirdly, some of his demand are quite illogical and medium/upper class people can hardly digest his campaign against English language and foreign items. They feel ramdev wants to take india in dark ages again. Can we remain progressive after abolishing English and cutting off all relations with foreign companies.

And fourth thing, baba is being seen as a communal face and not a secular one and it gives space to some people to defame him.

Anyway, I think it was a barbarian act from government side to crush the movement like this. If ramdev had violated any law, he could have been warned first and why goverment did not allocate any time frame to end the agitation, like 12 hours or 1 day. Goverment was quite anxious to wipe out Ramdev movement, may be goverment was scared seeing such a huge gathering or gov felt that this movement can benifit BJP
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The thing about Indians' perception of politicians as crook is absolutely true. But I think for any meaningful change to happen, that perception needs to change. A "movement" now and then can only force the government to make some piecemeal changes. But for a systematic change, people have to force their elected representatives to put these issues on their agenda. It is not really as hopeless as it looks. While the middle classes rant in Delhi and Mumbai, not even 50% of them vote. But a corrupt DMK was shown the door by the poor and illiterate of Tamilnadu in record voting turnout, even after DMK tried to buy the voters through various sops.

I feel the same about some of Baba's demands as you do. But if he contests elections, then he'd be forced to match his words with actions. If he never fights an election, he can claim anything without ever being accountable. BJP launched a movement to make a temple at Ayodhya. Six years they were in government, nothing changed. Only when they got the responsibility, they realised what was doable and what was not. When you don't have to fight elections, you can promise anything. But devil lies in the details. Isn't there something ironical about unelected representatives asking an elected government to do something the way they see it, because they represent people more than elected representatives do!
 
What I don't like about Ramdev is his bad-bola-pan.

Pahele bhi kae batein aachi nahi lagti thi. Lekin jis din wo Lokpal commette ka formation hua aur isne media ke samne sabse pahele appati jatai, wo mujhey chubhi. I felt that it would have been much better if he had talked to them in person and debated. Kiran Bedi herself was saying that she didnt want to be a part of the commeete. Same way Swami Agnivesh was also not there in it. But still he wanted to be in media or whatever but it was his immaturity.

Later on few days before this ramleela maidan anshan he said from Bhopal that inclusion of PM and CJI is debatable and a public debate should be there on this issue. Means JanLokpal walon ki Hawa nikal di ek terah se. Swami agnivesh ne us din bhi bade nape tulle shabdon mein kaha ki ... agar wo humein phone karke ya meeting mein kahete ye baat to jyada sammanjanak hoti. But why Ramdev will do so when he like media coverage so much.

Aap jin logon ke sath aae they unki peeth mein hi chura kyun mar rahe they. Why not keep your Black money issue intact and leave Lokpal safe rather than spoiling it by your big mouth.

I knew Kapil Sibbal and others cheated him but why? Because he feels he is the most capable and intelligent person. On one hand People in lokpal commeete chose senior advocates to deal with these shrewd politicians cum advocates. On the other hand he ditched his earlier mates and gone alone to deal with them. And this is what a sharp advocate can do with normal person. They made fool of him and not only spoiled the whole attempt but hit his credibility too.

Lastly I feel by trying to escape he did very wrong. Mar bhi jata to ke tha. Why he always say that he can die for the nation and blah blah. Sachai ye hai ki Sarkar cant dare to kill him at this moment. Everybody know this. They sent police only to beat them and spoil this anshan. His escape trial leaving behind his followers is also very bad. Instead he should have either asked his people to attack or peacefully he should have given giraftari.

After reaching Haridwar also his statements are very atpatijanak. Sarkar ab ye kar degi to desh mein vidroh ho jaega ... wo kar degi to wo ho jaega.

Overall I feel that he has not only spoiled, his own good doings but also put a question on others like Anna's movements. People may start thinking ke ye sare akhir mein khali nikalenge.

God knows what will happen in future and he may regain or mend his movement like Jat arakhshan after mayyad kand. But I feel within last few months with his actions and words he had harmed himself.
 
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riyaa said:
Points to ponder about the possible conspiracies at Ramlila Ground on 3rd-5th June 2011:

1. Baba Ramdev claims that Delhi Police wanted to murder him in an encounter i.e. even after he safely reaches his place at Haridwar. All arrangements (including a private jet) for his safe journey were made by Delhi Police.

2. Baba Ramdev also clai...ms that 5000 of his followers including ladies have been abducted by police in that scoop of 5th June 2011.

3. What would have happened in the country, if Baba Ramdev had actually been able to flee from that Ramlila Ground and then hidden himself in an untraceable place??

4. Moreover earlier Baba Ramdev has always been publicly claiming that he does not wear stitched clothes, then why did he wear those stitched female clothes to flee from Ramlila ground??

5. The real facts can come from those ladies, who were with him when he was trying to flee from Ramlila ground. Did those ladies already know that Baba Ramdev would join them at that corner of the pandal, in case police comes to arrest him??

6. Info: There are also reports in media that some anti-national elements had planned to burn the pandal at 3 am on 5th June, 2011; thereby killing many people present there.
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which mews channel you watch Riya ji..??
 
kapdal said:
It is quite interesting that so many Jatlanders mock/ridicule/oppose Baba Ramdev for his "anti-corruption movement",
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Early bird catches the worm. Hazare initiated it and got all the support. I think the story would have been the other way around if Ramdev had started this crusade against corruption. Another factor that contributes to hatred of people towards Ramdev is his opulence, maybe just jealousy.
 
VPannu said:
Early bird catches the worm. Hazare initiated it and got all the support. I think the story would have been the other way around if Ramdev had started this crusade against corruption. QUOTE]

Ramdev also had shown political inclinations. He has stated that we would contest elections. His fastings are therefore seen in that light.

Whereas Anna Hazare has made no such announcements. He is being equated with Gandhi jee.

Regards,

Urmila.
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dosto: main toh ek baat samjhta hoon. State key khilaaf uthi aawaazon ko Ram-lila maidaan ki tarah Rondd diya jaata hai..Indira Gandhi ney bhi jab Gau-hatya rokney ka kanoon bananey ka vaada kar key pradhan mantri ki kursi kabjaai thi..toh yogi aur hindu dharam guru sansad key bahar iss kaanoon ko bananey ki maang kar rahey thee toh unn par goliyaan chalwaai thi..its very obvious that State can never allow any voice to be heard to the masses which is against it,which is quite natural and has been seen by our nation time and again...
one more thing:::We all agree that media is under control of the State??Yes?? i think yes.Then if Anna is leading any movement which is against the State/corruption then he should not get the limelight in media..but what is happening is vice:Anna has been in limelight for long now. I believe Anna is a man planted by the con-gress only and they are just trying to fool the nation once again like they have been doing for last 60 years now..but its high time my friends..intellectuals who can really think what others can not should come forward and speak their heart..
Baba Ramdev had been firm and truthful till the last moment..3 center ministers tried to manage him but he declined and started his satyagraha..for which he paid the price:
Anna should not even be compared to baba guys..woh mei nhi janta k kiss cheej par han bika hua hai aur unhi key isharey par bakri ki tarah mimiyata hai. baba ney dahaad maari thi jisko Shasan ki bandook ney thanda kar diya..i think now we should not discuss it any further abt the difference btwn thm.
Jai Bharat!!
 
ek baat aur...mri kissi baat sey agar aap sehmat nhi hain toh ek baat sey toh pkka hogey ki black money ka issue toh thik tha baba ka??why did not Anna sit on fast for this issue??why ?
 
ratheetheraist said:
dosto: main toh ek baat samjhta hoon. State key khilaaf uthi aawaazon ko Ram-lila maidaan ki tarah Rondd diya jaata hai..
Jai Bharat!!
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bilkul sahi kaha ....haryana me bhi kisaan aandolano me kisaano ke saath hamesha aisa hua hain ...chahe wo Bhajan lal ke raaj me kaadmaa goli kaand ho , Bansi lal ke raaj me mandhiyali goli kaand ho ya Omprakash chautala ke raaj me Kandela goli kaand ho ...pahle to kisaano ki aawaj uthaate hain fir raaj aate hi unhi bechare kisaano par goli chalwate hain unke haq ki aawaj ko rondd diya jata hain ....
 
First thing against Ram Dev is that he is BABA, dHARAM gURUS ARE HIS ASSOCIATES and public knows that biggest enemy of society are contructors of religion. Public also knows that these so called babas are not only corrupt but have all weaknesses, He is also master in casteism & favouritism, A totally uneducated, inexperience and very greedy, a lier, a coward of hiest order, his total aim is to earn money and capture some position, please pardon me for talking bit small-- he is 100% against jats, most jat enemies like mulayam, Baba of asthal bohor, dr yadav MLA of Bahror etc are his close friends. Niether he keeps his words nor he has control over his mouth, Even his normal behaviour on stage is unacceptable. To cut short my dear brothers I agree that this govt is totally corrupt and incapable, requires removal and other politicians are also not very suitable but be positive some people do come forward to help the country and certainly time has not gone so bad that animals should be given chair of power to rule. Anna is equally uneducated, his advisures are corrupt, politicians with black spots but he is bit experience in such movements, had been a soldier and bit honest in his work.
 
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