Hindus Lets Get United

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Thats exactly another of points, that I bring up in discussion on the Kashir issue. Instead of including the Kashmiris in the regular indian population, and giving them the same rights, what indians elsewhere have. Kashmiris dont need special previleges. More than anything their attitude needs to be changed. Just like the pakistanis have managed to convince them in their favor, we need to do the same.

As for the kashmiri Pandits, they need to be resettled in Kashmir, and should be able to claim back what belongs to them.
 
Do you think it belongs to Pakistan or is it a country itself?
Say Yes or No.



scotlandjat said:
Sorry to say but how on earth did people work out that Kashmir belongs to India when the FACT is Indians cant even purchase land or even stay in Kashmir.

And IF Kashmir truely does belong to India then what about the 250,000 Hindu Pundits living as REFUGEES IN INDIA.

Sorry but i honestly think its a TOTAL Joke.
 
I Thought To Avoid Commenting But Then I Must

I after talking to so many experienced people and reading through the literature available want to say the following:

1] Kashmir dispute has reached a stage where it has become a pain for India [saanp ke muh mei chhachhunder]

2] India has allowed it to reach this far due to weak political leadership and thoroughly confused foreign policy years after years.

3] Practically J&K is hardly with India [waise khush hone ke paise nahi lagte]

4] There is a huge truth in what SUMIT DAHIYA uncle is stating out here but we tend to get carried away with our false bravado...let us register as to what sense is he talking.

5] Kargil was a blunder of our own making then why blame Pakistan [ When one's izzat gets openly sold in the streets, blaming the village sarpanch will be in bad taste.

6] Indians are poor learners and have hardly any urge or incling to learn from history.

7] We are brilliant indvidually but collectively we have been a let down barring a few times in the fase of external aggressions.

8] Pakistan has proved to be smarter than India as far as the GAME OF KASHMIR is concerned.

9] Price paid by india towards Kashmir is 100 times more than what Pakistan has paid ? and we are still paying a very heavy price still

10] What ever the price INDIA has to keep its stake HIGEST in J&K in all times to come as now it is a question of the Izzat and geography.




Due respect to all worthy members.
 
Those of you suggesting that we give into pakistan sponsored terrorism have learned nothing from history and have very little understanding of Islam. If we give away Kashmir, would the muslims be satisfied. The Imam of Jama Masjid in New Delhi refuses to condemn the concept that India is Darul Harb....a concept in Islam which means that it is duty of every muslim to take back land that was once ruled by islam.

The house in kashmir has to be cleaned. We cannot bow down to muslim power in the middle east and treat it as separate from india. The soldiers who die for kashmir should be able to buy land in kashmir.

The plan would be to remove Article 370. Prepare a large resettlement area for Kashmiri pandits and soldiers families. Give business and tax incentives for the enterprising to move into Kashmir. There will be need for private security firms, so that's another venue for employment. Biharis are making bunkers for the terrorist, I am sure a lot of them would move into kashmir.

Slowly change the composition of the state to a hindu majority. Jammu and Kashmir is 33% non muslim...so it can be done.

However we seem to be moving in the opposite direction, so that will only embolden the terrorist more. There is a reason why hindus were gulam for a 1000 years, and it is cowardice, caste where one works against the other, and politicians working for petty gain (a la Mulayam Singh).

Classic case of cowardice...when Morarji Desai nixed a plan at last minute to bomb Pakistan's nuclear facility so painstakingly put in by my father with the help of Israelis. The plan went ahead again when Chaudhary Charan Singh became PM, but then Indira came to power and totally nixed the plan and removed contact with the israelis.

Remember Chaudhary Charan singh August 15th 1979 address to the nation. He asked, why is Pakistan pursuing nuclear weapons so feverishly. Who would they be used against? China, Russia, Afganistan? No they would be used against India? That speech was prophetic for he also complained against the labor laws that are so affecting the Indian marketplace today. If he was in power for just six more months, we wouldn't have the mess with kashmir we have today.
 
true

vivek said:
Those of you suggesting that we give into pakistan sponsored terrorism have learned nothing from history and have very little understanding of Islam. If we give away Kashmir, would the muslims be satisfied. The Imam of Jama Masjid in New Delhi refuses to condemn the concept that India is Darul Harb....a concept in Islam which means that it is duty of every muslim to take back land that was once ruled by islam.

The house in kashmir has to be cleaned. We cannot bow down to muslim power in the middle east and treat it as separate from india. The soldiers who die for kashmir should be able to buy land in kashmir.

The plan would be to remove Article 370. Prepare a large resettlement area for Kashmiri pandits and soldiers families. Give business and tax incentives for the enterprising to move into Kashmir. There will be need for private security firms, so that's another venue for employment. Biharis are making bunkers for the terrorist, I am sure a lot of them would move into kashmir.

Slowly change the composition of the state to a hindu majority. Jammu and Kashmir is 33% non muslim...so it can be done.

However we seem to be moving in the opposite direction, so that will only embolden the terrorist more. There is a reason why hindus were gulam for a 1000 years, and it is cowardice, caste where one works against the other, and politicians working for petty gain (a la Mulayam Singh).

Classic case of cowardice...when Morarji Desai nixed a plan at last minute to bomb Pakistan's nuclear facility so painstakingly put in by my father with the help of Israelis. The plan went ahead again when Chaudhary Charan Singh became PM, but then Indira came to power and totally nixed the plan and removed contact with the israelis.

Remember Chaudhary Charan singh August 15th 1979 address to the nation. He asked, why is Pakistan pursuing nuclear weapons so feverishly. Who would they be used against? China, Russia, Afganistan? No they would be used against India? That speech was prophetic for he also complained against the labor laws that are so affecting the Indian marketplace today. If he was in power for just six more months, we wouldn't have the mess with kashmir we have today.
True vivek bro what ever u said is true i dont understand why our own brothers are talking like that they think that the problem will be solved if we give kashmir and i would like to say that why dont our people dont understand that it's the ideology of islam to spread it's not kashmir they want to change all world in to a mulsim world so if we give kashmir we give up in front of that ideology i m tired of this openmindedness dhaiya bro had opted seems he is living in too much comfort in us thats why he speak like that he dont know the way our brothers were butchered and our femalse were humiliated by these so called kashmiri terrrorist on top i dont understand how can some one call them as fighters fighters dont do cowardly acts like these insurgents are doing but i would like to say some of our brother who claim to be knowledgable seems very ignorant of the ground realities
 
People who think Kashmir is a disputed property are not Indians.

People who think that Kashmir is creating troubles for whole of India and we should give it up, are the most foolish people. They should surrender their Indian citizenship and become Bangladeshi.

And the time they will be moving to Bangladesh or Pakistan I would love to shoot them dead.


gaganjat said:
Do you think it belongs to Pakistan or is it a country itself?
Say Yes or No.
 
gaganjat said:
People who think Kashmir is a disputed property are not Indians.

People who think that Kashmir is creating troubles for whole of India and we should give it up, are the most foolish people. They should surrender their Indian citizenship and become Bangladeshi.

And the time they will be moving to Bangladesh or Pakistan I would love to shoot them dead.
WELL SAID BRO BRAVOO.
 
The reason behind preventing people from purchasing land in Kashmir is well known. It is to prevent it from paki supporters in India to make it a paki owned land.

Indians in India cant be refugees. They are still in their own country but just changed the place for security.

Mahlee if you still believe they are refugees than you are refugee too in Scotland but you dont even belong to India. You can say yourself GLOBAL REFUGEE.

Mahlee Its f*uken stupid to say its a joke.








scotlandjat said:
Sorry to say but how on earth did people work out that Kashmir belongs to India when the FACT is Indians cant even purchase land or even stay in Kashmir.

And IF Kashmir truely does belong to India then what about the 250,000 Hindu Pundits living as REFUGEES IN INDIA.

Sorry but i honestly think its a TOTAL Joke.
 
I am seeing all the ingredients being mixed now at international level to annihilate Pakistan once for all...The way things are moving, day is not too far when there won't be any Pakistan on the face of Earth... Pakistan can not take Kashmir for another 1000 years.....

RK^2
 
rkumar said:
I am seeing all the ingredients being mixed now at international level to annihilate Pakistan once for all...The way things are moving, day is not too far when there won't be any Pakistan on the face of Earth... Pakistan can not take Kashmir for another 1000 years.....

RK^2
Very well said uncle there would be no pakistan on the world map very soon.
 
rkumar said:
I am seeing all the ingredients being mixed now at international level to annihilate Pakistan once for all...The way things are moving, day is not too far when there won't be any Pakistan on the face of Earth... Pakistan can not take Kashmir for another 1000 years.....

RK^2

Tau baat to theek kah se tu. Amerika ke hum phoopa konya lagen the ke mahre prime minister ke washington me itni khattar karte wo. kuch khichdi to jaroor paak re se.

Karan
 
gaganjat said:
The reason behind preventing people from purchasing land in Kashmir is well known. It is to prevent it from paki supporters in India to make it a paki owned land.

Indians in India cant be refugees. They are still in their own country but just changed the place for security.

Mahlee if you still believe they are refugees than you are refugee too in Scotland but you dont even belong to India. You can say yourself GLOBAL REFUGEE.

Mahlee Its f*uken stupid to say its a joke.

Ok you seem to have missed my point Gaganjat.

Gaganjat i think personally it is a Joke how an Indian Citizen like yourself and many other members on this website are not allowed to buy land in Jammu & Kashmir. Now IF J&K is part and parcel of India why cant an Indian Citizen buy land or even property.

You also mentioned that it is to stop Pro Pakistani from buying land in J&K then could RAW etc not do the same in Azad Kashmir???

For instance i was born and bred here in Scotland i can buy land and even property in England,Wales and Northern Ireland because it is all part and parcel of Britain. There is no dispute.

And as for the Kashmir Pundit am sorry to say they are Refugees in their own India and i'll tell you another thing these ILLEGAL Bangladeshi coming in the truck loads into India are treated much better than the Kashmiri Pundits.
 
gaganjat said:
People who think Kashmir is a disputed property are not Indians.

People who think that Kashmir is creating troubles for whole of India and we should give it up, are the most foolish people. They should surrender their Indian citizenship and become Bangladeshi.

And the time they will be moving to Bangladesh or Pakistan I would love to shoot them dead.
this is like real Indian Jat.
 
gaganjat said:
People who think Kashmir is a disputed property are not Indians.

People who think that Kashmir is creating troubles for whole of India and we should give it up, are the most foolish people. They should surrender their Indian citizenship and become Bangladeshi.

And the time they will be moving to Bangladesh or Pakistan I would love to shoot them dead.
Hey Guys !

I remember how three years ago I used to think the same way, just like most of us.

Then, my opinon was that we have to keep fghting for Kashmir. we are putting up a good show. And Kashmir will forever belong to us.

Now, I still think that Kashmir belongs to us. We have shed enough blood and paid enough price to deserve to have kashmir to be a part of India.

But my opinon has changed in respect that is our strategy on Kashmir working. If we keep the same strategy for years to ocme, is anything going to change. Neither Pakisan has stopped fighting us for Kashmir, nor have we blinked so far. The fight is going on, and we are still at square one.

Now wha I have so far been suggesting is a change in strategy. By this I am not saying give up Kashmir to Pakistan or anyone else. Just like pakistan has managed to convince the Kashmiris to be on thier side, we have to convince the Kashmirirs to cme back to our side. Kashmir has to be integrated into India, just like Punjab was done recently, or lets say Madhya pradesh has been for all these years. Once no one can figure out any distinction between Kashmir or any other Indian provinces, no one would be crying for Kashmir anymore.

I think I made my point very clear.

As for the refrendum, I strongly feel, that as long as we are afraid of having in Kashmir, we get our answer on the issue, clear and straight forward, we havent achieved anything in Kashmir. We may have managed to hold on to the piece of Land, but we havent managed to win over the kashmiri people's hearts, which in my mind is more important than having the land. The day we feel confident enough to hold a refrendum in Kashmir, we can say that our policies and strategies on Kashmir are working, and we have succesfully integrated Kashmir into India. Till our heart says no to refrendum, we are failing in Kashmir.

As for violence, and erasing paksitan from the map, I am compltely against any violence. The leaders sit in their nuke proof bunkers in Delhi and Islamabad,as our men bit the bullets. I htink those who start the wars, shold be the ones who actually fight them. Never underestimate your enemy. Pakistn isnt any less lethal now. we have to be more smart with our strateiges, than be a bonehead.

as for someone shooting me, because I strive for liberty freedom and peace, go ahead and do it. I rather die defending liberty, than taking it away from someone.

Guys wake up. Realise the fact that Kashmiris are humans too. Ordinary civillians are are being disenfrenchized o their civil liberties. They ae living under constant fear of being attacked either by the millitants or our own security forces. And if you some sense of civility and compassion left within you, you cannot tollerate or justify their suffering either. Lets put it this way. The entire country s suffering becase of Kashmir. And something has to be done ASAP about it.
 
Well Said Uncle Ji

dahiyarules said:
Hey Guys !

I remember how three years ago I used to think the same way, just like most of us.

Then, my opinon was that we have to keep fghting for Kashmir. we are putting up a good show. And Kashmir will forever belong to us.

Now, I still think that Kashmir belongs to us. We have shed enough blood and paid enough price to deserve to have kashmir to be a part of India.

But my opinon has changed in respect that is our strategy on Kashmir working. If we keep the same strategy for years to ocme, is anything going to change. Neither Pakisan has stopped fighting us for Kashmir, nor have we blinked so far. The fight is going on, and we are still at square one.

Now wha I have so far been suggesting is a change in strategy. By this I am not saying give up Kashmir to Pakistan or anyone else. Just like pakistan has managed to convince the Kashmiris to be on thier side, we have to convince the Kashmirirs to cme back to our side. Kashmir has to be integrated into India, just like Punjab was done recently, or lets say Madhya pradesh has been for all these years. Once no one can figure out any distinction between Kashmir or any other Indian provinces, no one would be crying for Kashmir anymore.

I think I made my point very clear.

As for the refrendum, I strongly feel, that as long as we are afraid of having in Kashmir, we get our answer on the issue, clear and straight forward, we havent achieved anything in Kashmir. We may have managed to hold on to the piece of Land, but we havent managed to win over the kashmiri people's hearts, which in my mind is more important than having the land. The day we feel confident enough to hold a refrendum in Kashmir, we can say that our policies and strategies on Kashmir are working, and we have succesfully integrated Kashmir into India. Till our heart says no to refrendum, we are failing in Kashmir.

As for violence, and erasing paksitan from the map, I am compltely against any violence. The leaders sit in their nuke proof bunkers in Delhi and Islamabad,as our men bit the bullets. I htink those who start the wars, shold be the ones who actually fight them. Never underestimate your enemy. Pakistn isnt any less lethal now. we have to be more smart with our strateiges, than be a bonehead.

as for someone shooting me, because I strive for liberty freedom and peace, go ahead and do it. I rather die defending liberty, than taking it away from someone.

Guys wake up. Realise the fact that Kashmiris are humans too. Ordinary civillians are are being disenfrenchized o their civil liberties. They ae living under constant fear of being attacked either by the millitants or our own security forces. And if you some sense of civility and compassion left within you, you cannot tollerate or justify their suffering either. Lets put it this way. The entire country s suffering becase of Kashmir. And something has to be done ASAP about it.



"One has to practice liberty before Advocating it"........[LINCOLN]........Indian mindset is still not ready to practice Liberty and hence J&K Burns and will continue till such time we do not learn the above lesson. Selfish lots end up becoming Slaves of their habits.
 
dahiyarules said:
Hey Guys !

I remember how three years ago I used to think the same way, just like most of us.


Guys wake up. Realise the fact that Kashmiris are humans too. Ordinary civillians are are being disenfrenchized o their civil liberties. They ae living under constant fear of being attacked either by the millitants or our own security forces. And if you some sense of civility and compassion left within you, you cannot tollerate or justify their suffering either. Lets put it this way. The entire country s suffering becase of Kashmir. And something has to be done ASAP about it.

My brother it's time for u to wake up what do u think you are dealing with first of all these so called kashmiris u taking favour of are mostly either part islamic terrorist groups or they give support them by giving them food shelter and many time financialy.secondly what kind of a jat you are if some one want to take anything from u with force u will give it yeah.and what this **** about u use to think 3 years back like us people you want to say that we are three year backward than ur thinking common dont give us that bullshit as far as i think just becoz ur own life is well settled you had start thinking a preachers way common u say u belong from a army background i dont think so coz u dont have pain of those young widows who's husbands has died right after a week of their marriage in a bloodshed in kashmir dealing with ur favourate islamic terrorist.How many time do i have to tell u it's not kashmir these bastards want, did'nt u saw the the so called map of mughalistan and if u give them kashmir (own so called liberal ideas of ur's)than ready to give them the whole india (may be they want u and ur family to work for them)coz when it comes to islam which itself says spread ur religion spread ur territory. so you should wake up coz we knows the fact it's u who need to wake up and dont tell us that u knows couple of pakistani's who says things of brotherhood all of them are pure bastards i can bet i know more pakistanise than u here in london all of them talk well in front of u but all of them are pure son of bitches backstabbers.so my brother try to be a bit realistic living in america doesnot means that we should forget our soilders who had died for kashmir does'nt matter what happens now if we step back we will be no where so understand it's not kashmir issue it's the matter of existence.
JUST ABOVE THEM(JAT)
 
Hey Amit !

I respect everyones opinion. Nones livnig in the stone age, while other live in the ice age and so on. We all live in the same times, and we all have differing opinions.

I think of all those who have lost their loved ones in the Kashmir conflict, including me. And thats why I am giving it a hard thought on how to bring a conclusion to this situation, becuase I do not want more women being widowed a week after gettng married. Because, we we keep on carrying on the same strategy, we are going to have more women who get widowed wihin a week of getting married. Because, the ground reality is, theres a proxy war going on ,adn people are dying every day.

As for the muslims and Pakistanis, I dont have great faith at them either. I know that they are ideologically rotten assholes. I know a bunch of em either, but just cant help getting negative vibes from them.

I am looking at Kashmiris, who have been manipulated to think that their best interest is in a unified Kashmir, integrated with Pakistan. And this has been by nobody else, but the Pakistanis themselves, by the help of their intelligence agencies, and other organizations that prop the propoganda in kashmir. Now as long as the Kashmirirs keep having similar feelings, its going to e very bad for India. This would motivat hem to blow up our trains and buses, just like they are doing elsewhere. So more than having a military campaign, the need of the minute is to inflict a psychological warfare on the Kashmiris, to change their mind as to whats in their best interest. And theres no doubt that they would be on the gaining end, if they stay with india, provided all the liberties we get back at home.

Domestic trouble start when people in the family start trusting the outsiders more han they trust the ones in their homes. Thats exaclty whats happening at the moment. All insurgencies in INdia derive their support from outsde governments.
 
This article should put doubts about kashmir at rest

http://www.saag.org/papers8/paper710.html
....
The true presumptive basis for any strategic Indian thinking on Pakistan are:

1. Solving Kashmir will NOT bring peace to the Indian sub-continent – Kashmir is not the main issue, Pakistan is

2. Pakistan’s in stability is due to its moth-eaten and unreliable institutions, as well as due to the diffusion of jihadi terrorist thinking throughout all aspects of Pakistani society – not due to its trumped up animosity with India

3. Solving Kashmir, Indian generosity or propping up the Pakistani economy will not reform Pakistani institutions or cleanse Pakistani society of jihadi radicalism

4. A Kashmir solution that Pakistan will sign on to, does not have any immediate benefits for India – neither terrorism not nuclear threats will stop

5. A Pakistan, capable of civilized behavior with its neighbors will go a long way in ridding the world of the scourge of terrorism
...
 
kashmir problem

Those who like to take a liberal view because they live in relative peace and safety, just think, will Kashmir problem exist if it was a Buddhist or Hindu state as it once used to be ?

Moplah Rebellion, Part II: Hindus massacred on Maraad Beach

http://www.rediff.com/news/2003/may/09rajeev.htm

The reported facts about the incident in Maraad, Kozhikode, Kerala, are as follows.
  • A group of Hindu fishermen sitting on the beach near a temple is attacked suddenly, without provocation or warning, by a mob of Muslims armed with swords. After a chaotic ten minutes, nine people are dead or bleeding to death on the beach. Many are seriously wounded. The attackers vanish into the night.
  • A cache of swords and other sharp weapons, including blood-stained ones, as well as powerful country bombs is recovered from a mosque in the vicinity.
  • Various politicians make soothing noises, 66 persons have been arrested in connection with the crime. A judicial inquiry has been instituted.
  • The dead are: Gopalan, Chandran, Santosh, Madhavan, Asghar, Dasan, Pushparaj, Krishnan, and Prajeesh. One of them had been married for just five days.
I am basing this analysis on reports in the Malayalam media (eg: www.keralakaumudi.com). I find the local media to be far more accurate and less prejudiced than the English language media in most cases.
Consider the circumstances: the attack happened on a Friday, and it was directed at those sitting near a Hindu temple. First, almost all Muslim-initiated riots in India take place on Fridays, after the faithful have heard sermons in the local mosque.
Second, killing Hindus near a Hindu temple is guaranteed to be offensive; if there is any chance of a communal riot developing, this is an excellent way of triggering it.
This was a mini-Godhra: a murderous attack on Hindus. I have no idea who was behind it, perhaps Pakistanis, or perhaps it was merely local Moplah Muslims. After all, the Moplahs of Malabar did not need any Pakistani inspiration when they launched into the terrible riots of 1921 (the Moplah Rebellion) when they, without provocation, murdered, raped, and forcibly converted thousands of Hindus, just because distant Turkey had abolished the Caliphate.
What was the objective this time? Possibly to create a communal riot along the lines of what happened in Gujarat in the wake of the Godhra massacre. Perhaps to emphasise that in Muslim-dominated Malabar, as in Bangladesh and Kashmir, it is just fine to murder Hindus. The perpetrators -- whoever they are -- are confident that there will be no consequences.
What is likely to happen? Not much. Frightened Hindus will move some place safer, and one more piece of real estate will become dar-ul Islam, land of Muslims. This has been happening in other parts of Malabar, for example Muslim-majority Malappuram district, where Hindus are leaving for less dangerous places. Yes, the famed Nehruvian Stalinist 'secularism' in action, yet again.
Hindus in Kerala have declined in numbers, and this is what happens to non-Muslims when the Muslim population reaches a critical mass: decimation. When Semitic religions hold sway, they brutalise minorities. We have the examples of Muslim intolerance in Jammu & Kashmir and Christian intolerance in the Northeast. Hindus have a simple choice: convert, die or flee. And Kerala's Hindus are running out of places to flee to. We may end up in squalid refugee camps like the Pandits.
 
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