Kapil Dev in second inning

[raj2rif]

Territorial Army: A brief Account

I think a link about Territorial Army has already been posted on this thread and it might be a good idea to read that to get a little insight about TA Units.

My interaction with the TA units has been limited, to the extent, that I did send my soldiers to TA units on postings, I did employ the TA units in my operation plans for they came under our Command during the active operations, and also had a privilege to conduct their annual training once, apart from studying about it for passing my promotion examinations and at courses of instruction.

I shall list out what I remember from that and if I do make a mistake in academic part of it, kindly pardon my fading memory.

Organization:

Essentially, TA units have two type of people posted to it. First, is the core group that comprises of the regular serving officers. This includes the commanding officer, and key appointments in the unit. There are few Junior Commissioned Officers and Non Commissioned Officers as well.

The second group is of volunteer civilians. They get enlisted in the TA Units responsible for a particular geographical area. Like my Regimental TA unit was 105 Inf Bn TA. Since my regt. was “The Rajputana Rifles”, most people in this unit except the civilian officers came from that particular geographical region.

What Training they Get:

TA units get enlisted for about two months a year, when they assemble and train. During this period they get their salary as well. When the brigade as a Brigade Major, I was pleasantly surprised to see that we had to conduct an exercise for 105 Inf Bn TA, at that time commanded by an officer of my Regiment for whom I had great regards. One of the company commander in that unit was “Deputy Defense Minster” in Mr. Rajeev Gandhi’s cabinet, a politician from “Princely” family. I will talk about it later. Don’t guess his name was then Major K P Singh Dev.

Employment:

During Peace Time: During peacetime these units are used to supplement the army units in Aid to Civil Authorities, or on some government project. The green revolution around Bikaner Gang Canal in Rajasthan is the doing of a TA Bn. I am sure in other part of the county also such Bns must have done some outstanding work.

During War: During war these Bn can be used for rear area security duties, or even could be asked to hold key installations. During war refugee problem could be quite substantial specially, in our country where we do have a single road to be used both by military units moving towards border and refugees coming back from the border to safer areas. Once an area has been captured, maintaining the infrastructure, essential services, and helping in maintaining the law and order could be some other tasks that can be given to this organization.

I can keep writing about it, but I guess that much should be enough for the time being. In the next post I will talk about the main issue raised in this thread i.e. about Mr. Kapil Dev being given the honorary rank of Lt Col.

 

[raj2rif]

TA Units

Continuing from my previous post.

Firstly a word about Mr. K P Singh Dev. Before I met Mr. Dev, I did have a poor opinion about every politician. Since at that time my office was the only one that had the STD telephone facility, Mr. Dev had to come to my office almost daily for 10-15 minutes to make a call to the PM. Even though he was the Dy Def Minister, he always took permission to enter my office and always addressed me by Sir. He lived in a tent during the entire exercise like any other company commander of that Bn. He was extremely respectful to all other officers of his bn as well as other officers whom he interacted with during the social functions.

During one the parties, some discussion took place on foreign affairs, and I was impressed about his knowledge on the subject. Truly, it was a great experience to interact with him for that short duration of time. Actually, I had just been posted when this exercise was going on, and had a very little time to interact more. He being the Dy Defense Minster, every senior officer in the area wanted to visit us. I am pretty sure, if it were not for him, not many would have paid attention to the TA Bn Exercise.

Another officer that you may like to know in TA Bn was Mr. Kapil Mohan of Mohan Meakins. There were many other officers in TA Bn who had been businessman, teachers or in different professions. Essentially, the army looks for the leadership skills and the management skills that these people are having.

The honorary rank to Mr. Kapil Dev will inspire young people to join the army; I am not sure about that. In fact I can say that it would not make any difference to any one. Actually, in a couple of weeks the people (we included) will forget about it.

I find it interesting to get Mr. Kapil Dev as honorary Lt Col because, he has at least one quality: he has been a proven leader. So I think it is a good pick.

And to those who feel bad about it, my question is what about some of the celebrities and politicians getting honorary Ph.D and Masters degree from the universities?

I think Kapil Dev had done extremely well in his profession and made all us feel proud of his achievement. Rewarding him with the honorary Lt. Col. is not a bad idea at all. If called upon to duty, I am sure he will turn out to be much better than many others who serve in TA Units.

 

[skadian123]

Any other such instance in the past? Direct Hon. Lt.Col.

Dear Col. Tavathia Sir,

It was very informative to read your experience with the TA and also the info on where the TA stands in the scheme of things.

As far as my memory jogs, I don't recollect having come across any instance where any distinguished person has been commissioned directly in the rank of honorary Lt.Col. Though there might have been instances in the past also where distinguished persons would have been directly commissioned in a rank higher than what a normal aspirant would get commissioned in. It would be really nice and informative further, if from your valuable experience with the TA, you can let us know of any similar instance.

It is true that TA encourages people from all walks of life including lawyers, doctors, politicians and even film stars to join, though at the rank of Lieutenant. In fact, there is a provision that after putting in some years of service and depending on the stature or post that TA officer is holding in his civil role, he can be promoted out of turn to an equivalent rank.

 

[raj2rif]

I would not say for sure

Dear Mr. Kadian,

I think, Mr. Kapil Mohan was also having an honorary rank. Actually, honorary rank is quite different than the actual rank. An honrary rank could be one higher than the actual rank.

I am not sure what is the motive behind in giving honorary rank to Mr. Kapil Dev, but it really does not matter much. I would say if called upon for duty he is likely to perfom well, considering his experience over the years and the opportunities he had got to interact with intellectuals at different levels.

Honstly, while you are in service, it at times becomes difficult to get out of your daily routine and think about as to who has got honorary rank and who has not.

May be I was little less blessed, for I did not make any civilian friends during my service, while many of my own unit officers did. I also have a very poor knowledge about the various senior officers as to what they did, what their hobbies were, what they liked and what they did not like.

Actually, on assuming the Command of my battalion, after 9 months that I was in command, my Brigade Commander Called me and told me, that I am the only commanding officer in the entire station who had not called him on.

I personally, feel that there is nothing wrong in giving an honorary rank to a person of exceptional achievements. After all it is a ceremonial position.

 

[skadian123]

Thanks for shedding light

Dear Sir,

Thanks once again for throwing further light on the non-active/reserve arm of the army - TA.

Though it's right that ranks held by officials who get commissioned in the TA are ceremonial/honorary, I have my reservations on this issue. It would have been better had Kapil Dev been commissioned in the rank of Lieutenant and subsequently been promoted out of turn to Lt.Col. considering his stature in civil domain. It was interesting to read about Brig. K.P. Singh Deo (then a Major) as to how he conducted himself in the truest traditions of the armed forces which proves the point that a person should be given some time to understand and start from the grassroots level of the organisation.

Moreover, seeing the penchant of the politicians to mould organisations/institutions as per their convenience, I doubt that this particular instance might be used as a precedent to get the underserving lot into uniform and that too directly in ranks of Col. and above.

 

[ygulia]

These are my comments on the ongoing topic(Post#3):
"
People have not got the point here regarding the honorary appointment of Kapil Dev as Lt. Col. in TA. He has been projected as a brand ambassador to encourage younger generation to join armed forces. Some people are in the habit of criticizing any thing come in their way like the opposition parties do in parliament."
Moderators say these comments offended some members and hence attracts infraction. They did not explain how it occurs.For me it appears pure dictatorship. What do you say?
Thanks.

 

[brahmtewatia]

this is what i hav to say !

These are my comments on the ongoing topic(Post#3):

People have not got the point here regarding the honorary appointment of Kapil Dev as Lt. Col. in TA. He has been projected as a brand ambassador to encourage younger generation to join armed forces. Some people are in the habit of criticizing any thing come in their way like the opposition parties do in parliament.

Moderators say these comments offended some members and hence attracts infraction. They did not explain how it occurs.For me it appears pure dictatorship.
What do you say?
Thanks.

yogi, i'm replying in this post cos u asked for it in yr. abv. post... (nothing personal abt. it... just my opinion)
before i start pls. refer post # 13... here's the link : http://www.jatland.com/forums/showpost.php?p=182489&postcount=13

i've observed 2 type of tendencies on JATland:

1). tendencies tht concur to others point of view w/o any valid thought/reasoning of their own.
2). tendencies tht oppose to others point of view w/o any valid thought/reasoning of their own... i mean "just for the heck of it"

yr. post # 3 is of latter type of tendency. if u observe carefully u'll notice tht yr. post no. on this thread is # 3, so obviously it implies that you are opposing to post no. # 2 with more or less no valid reason(s). post no. # 2 (in my opinion) is very valid post answering the title thread nd has very firm ground of reasoning. on the contrary yr. post is baseless... just opposing nd in contradiction to what has been said in post # 2... hence this infraction to you.

now cuming to infraction, i personally feel tht yr. crime wasn't of tht serious nature, so as to call for an infraction... so here i'm with u... i guess u shud hv been spared with a warning

 

[skadian123]

Criticism or no criticism - I have miles to go before I sleep

Thanks Brahmji,

Criticism or no criticism - I have miles to go before I sleep

Whose woods these are I think I know.
His house is in the village, though;
He will not see me stopping here
To watch his woods fill up with snow.


My little horse must think it queer
To stop without a farmhouse near
Between the woods and frozen lake
The darkest evening of the year.

He gives his harness bells a shake
To ask if there's some mistake.
The only other sound's the sweep
Of easy wind and downy flake.

The woods are lovely, dark and deep,
But I have promises to keep,
And miles to go before I sleep,
And miles to go before I sleep.