Pakistan New Nuclear Ambition

[raj2rif]

Dear All,
Pakistan's new nuclear expansion program has military component attached to it. Once fully develped, Pak will have parity with India's program.

Pakistan capable of using plutonium based weapons would be very dangerous to the world community considering the track record of the nation with the military dictators as well as its policy of sponsoring the transborder terrorism. With the program initially being sold the the mid eastern country as "Islamice Bomb", it is time that India takes initiative to endure that this program does not go ahead. We probably have to act sooner than our comfort level may suggest. Probably we have to bring the world's attention to Pakistan or include Pakistan in the league of North Korea and Iran.

Here is the link to this news:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/07/23/AR2006072300737.html?referrer=email

 

[rkumar]

Tavathia Sahab,

We will keep hearing all these stories till US-India Nuclear deal is approved by US congress. There are lobbyists working for Pakistan also who are trying to scare congress members away from Indian deal. There are all sorts of groups working against each other. I won't give much importance to all such news even if they are true. Few facts we have to keep in mind;

1. Pakistan will always remain anti-India come what may.
2.China will always support Pakistan as a counterforce against India
3. US will play own games and maintain relations even with countries who are against each other.
4. Indians will never learn lessons from past mistakes and our politicians will keep fighting with each other over petty matters.

RK^2

 

[arihantdalal]

1. sir,according to some they still have parity with India as far as the nuclear warheads are concerned.their geographical & economic size is much less than Inida"s but they still maintain about the same no. of nuclear warheads as India.

2.they have been having trouble in miniaturizing the nuclear warheads & a plutonium based program,rather than a uranium one would help them in this regard. dont have much knowledge bout that.

3.india"s most worrying aspect right now is the increasing edge of PAF over IAF.the MRCA deal is getting no where........the LCA isnt likely to get anywhere.....& we"re coming back to buying a few MIG-29 & mirage-2000s.
but dassault has already closed its production lines for mirage series.so dont know how we can replace our rapidly declining squadrons.

4.a lot of time & money has been wasted on ARJUN MBT too.....& it too is far from being inducted.we"re just going back now to T-90S & i heard some TANK-EX.

5.the only saving grace right now is the indian navy.which has been wholly involved with DRDO & now HAL too(for naval LCA) & therefore is bearing fruits & has an edge even over the chinese.

looking forward to ur observations

 

[dahiyarules]

Anyone ever heard of the cold war?

If you heard of it, what did you learn from it?

I learnt that "arms race" leads to nowhere. USSR and USA were several time ahead of India and Pakistan. Yet no one ever nuked the other.

If a country has a weapons development program while millions in there are being denied the basic necessities of life, it has its priorities wrong.

This was exactly the reason why the Soviet Union collapsed. They spent all their resources on their weapons programs and were left with nothing for the rest of the country.

If you really want Pakistan to crumble, let it have the biggest weapons development program in the world. Do not worry. They will never use it.

If the worlds only superpower in the world doesnt have the guts to use one, what is Pakistan?

 

[devdahiya]

Bhai loggo......BANDDAR KE HAATH MEI USTTERRA SEI........NAAK TEI KISSE NA KISSE KI KATTANNI E KATTANNI.....CHAHE USSKI KHUDD KI HO....There is a saying which goes: " Fear the person[nation] most,who has nothing to loose"......it is apt for our PADDOSSI.

 

[arihantdalal]

Anyone ever heard of the cold war?

If you heard of it, what did you learn from it?

I learnt that "arms race" leads to nowhere. USSR and USA were several time ahead of India and Pakistan. Yet no one ever nuked the other.

If a country has a weapons development program while millions in there are being denied the basic necessities of life, it has its priorities wrong.

This was exactly the reason why the Soviet Union collapsed. They spent all their resources on their weapons programs and were left with nothing for the rest of the country.

If you really want Pakistan to crumble, let it have the biggest weapons development program in the world. Do not worry. They will never use it.

If the worlds only superpower in the world doesnt have the guts to use one, what is Pakistan?

1.USSR collapsed cuz COMMUNISM isnt a sound economic model vis-a-vis CAPITALISM.it is conceptually flawed.

2.pakistan throughout history,has attacked whenever it has felt that they can undo India..........throughout the 4 wars....47,65,71,kargil.

3.with such neighbours as pakistan & china,india has to be on its toes.

4.% of GDP wise,india is still spending only 2.5% of its GDP on defence.thts much less than pakistan/china/US.as long as we keep it under 3.5%,we"re doing good.



5

 

[raj2rif]

Correct

Bhai loggo......BANDDAR KE HAATH MEI USTTERRA SEI........NAAK TEI KISSE NA KISSE KI KATTANNI E KATTANNI.....CHAHE USSKI KHUDD KI HO....There is a saying which goes: " Fear the person[nation] most,who has nothing to loose"......it is apt for our PADDOSSI.

Dear Dahiya Sahab,

Absolutely True. That is exactly is the problem.

 

[dahiyarules]

1.USSR collapsed cuz COMMUNISM isnt a sound economic model vis-a-vis CAPITALISM.it is conceptually flawed.

Tell me why you think that Communism isnt flawed.

Why do you think the communist blocks collapsed? Have you ever heard of a country called North Korea (the only remaining communist regimes along with Cuba). More than half the people in that country are starving to death.

I have had endless discussion with other "evil" comunists on this forum. I do not want to convert you. Keep living under your illusions.

2.pakistan throughout history,has attacked whenever it has felt that they can undo India..........throughout the 4 wars....47,65,71,kargil.

We undermind Pakistan in 1971. It was our fault.

So what if they attacke dus other times. See where they are now.

No matter how strong a nation is, it hardly makes a difference. Occupation of foreign lands isnt possible anymore. Iraq is a good example. Worlds most powerful military against insurgents is doing the "fire walk." We cannot be occupied.

3.with such neighbours as pakistan & china,india has to be on its toes. [/Quote}

We need to start minding our own business. Stop occupying territories. And we will befine.

4.% of GDP wise,india is still spending only 2.5% of its GDP on defence.thts much less than pakistan/china/US.as long as we keep it under 3.5%,we"re doing good.
5

How did you comeup with an arbitrary figure like 3.5 percent. Please elaborate.

 

[arihantdalal]

Tell me why you think that Communism isnt flawed.

Why do you think the communist blocks collapsed? Have you ever heard of a country called North Korea (the only remaining communist regimes along with Cuba). More than half the people in that country are starving to death.

I have had endless discussion with other "evil" comunists on this forum. I do not want to convert you. Keep living under your illusions.




We undermind Pakistan in 1971. It was our fault.

So what if they attacke dus other times. See where they are now.

No matter how strong a nation is, it hardly makes a difference. Occupation of foreign lands isnt possible anymore. Iraq is a good example. Worlds most powerful military against insurgents is doing the "fire walk." We cannot be occupied.

3.with such neighbours as pakistan & china,india has to be on its toes. [/Quote}

We need to start minding our own business. Stop occupying territories. And we will befine.



How did you comeup with an arbitrary figure like 3.5 percent. Please elaborate.

1.man,read properly.i said.....economics wise,the communism model IS flawed.
ur just reinforcing wat i said by pointing out the eg. of n. korea & cuba.

2.we did absolutely RIGHT by undermining pak. in 1971 or u would be looking at war from 2 fronts,eastern & western.bangladesh is causing trouble too for india,but the situation can be controlled.imagine being surrounded by pak. from 2 sides & china sitting on ur head.

3.india doesnt intend to OCCUPY foreign lands.
but,it needs to PREVENT others from occupying its own.any potential enemy should be even ALLOWED TO ENTERTAIN THE THOUGHT OF OCCUPYING INDIAN LAND.thts y one needs to keep ones gaurd up.

4.and we are minding our own business.unless u consider kashmir & 18 states where ISI is fuelling naxalism somebody else"s business.

5. india hasnt ever occupied any territory of a sovereign nation.never even acted as an agressor in any war,except maybe 1962 war with china....but not too sure bout that(and we got our badly defeated then).

6.see CIA factfile about defence spending of diff. countries,absolute numbers & % of GDP & then u"ll know India is still spending quite less on defence % of GDP wise.

www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/index.html

7.and yes......as dahiya saab pointed out correctly,india has more to lose in an event of war than pak.

 

[rkumar]

Here are the links to two articles by some one called Chan Akya (though sounds like Chanakya but the person seems to be Chinese);

1. http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/HG25Aa02.html
2. http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/HG26Aa01.html

In his articles he has tried to paint a scenario of World War III, which has almost begun between Islam and western world. Author has drawn some conclusions about the sides India and China are likely to take in this conflict. Sounds very interesting analysis.

RK^2

 

[rohittewatia]

Abhih bhi pakistan kih recovery naheen huii hai earthquake sey...abhih funds key liye baithe haiin....aur plutonium reactor ki taiyyari hai....



I wonder whether this fund money is not being used for the same plans????

 

[arihantdalal]

Abhih bhi pakistan kih recovery naheen huii hai earthquake sey...abhih funds key liye baithe haiin....aur plutonium reactor ki taiyyari hai....



I wonder whether this fund money is not being used for the same plans????

US has i think 3 airforce bases on pak. soil....for which it pays yearly lease greater than 500 million dollars.
the US also pays a huge amount every year as soft loans as pak. is considered to be a frontline partner in war on terror.

some time back,US wrote off 3 billion US$ that pak. owed in loans.

pak. is also a major non-NATO ally,& all the weapons it buys are in 10-20 year soft loans.

where do u think all this money goes???

thts right........in their defence.

 

[raj2rif]

Good Articles

Here are the links to two articles by some one called Chan Akya (though sounds like Chanakya but the person seems to be Chinese);

1. http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/HG25Aa02.html
2. http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/HG26Aa01.html

In his articles he has tried to paint a scenario of World War III, which has almost begun between Islam and western world. Author has drawn some conclusions about the sides India and China are likely to take in this conflict. Sounds very interesting analysis.

RK^2

Dr. Sahab,
I think the articles are well analyzed. With its larger islamic population, and unwillingness to strike a balance between national needs and political compulsions, India is more likely to be abystander during any eventuality of confrontation between Islam and the West.
China on the other hand does not need to take sides at this time. It has good relations with Mid East, while have created enought dependency of West on its goods.
Unless the West realizes to strike a more close ties with India, in the fields of manufacturing the daily use goods, it will be difficult for them to twist the Chineese arms.
Let us see, what are the options with India, and the West?

 

[kharub]

World War III

Very good analysis by the Chan Akya Chap .....

My analysis is as following :

Even if India does not take an active part in case of the war, it will be a very turbulent time for the country. There will be domestic confrontation and conflict among the Hindus & Muslims ..... this will be on the scale of the riots that India witnessed during and after the partition in 1947.

Any such situation will criple the country socially, economically and in terms of the infrastructure and governance.
It will however provide a golden opprtunity to settle all communal and other major conflict issues in the country once and for all , if there are leaders willing to take hard decisions to find the final solution.

So a world war however harmful and destructive, may provide India an opportunity to fix all the internal issues.
The enemies like Pakistan, Bangladesh will be so badly devastated due to their direct confrontation with the west, that they will no longer be able to adversely affect Indian domestic enviornment or pose any sort of threat or challange to India.

The competitors i.e the West will be significantly weakened and depleted even in case of a victory. India if the political elite can take hard decisions during that time of internal turbulance, will emerge as a Phoenix from the ashes, to re-establish herself as the fore-front of civilisation and prosperity.


For China however it will not be so bad, if it chooses to ally itself with the West.
The islamic world does not have the fire-power to threaten or hurt the nucleus of Chinese civilisation and economy , i.e. its Eastern Coast (beijing, Shangahi, Guanghou ).
Any Chinese involvement will be limited as they have no interest or any benefit from the weakning and destruction of the Islamic world. They will only take side to avoid the fury of the West.
China will choose to side with the west beause it has more to loose if it is against the west, as the west has the capability and if China opposes it, the willingness to destroy China.
China might also choose to remain neutral and laugh while its biggest threats are clearing themselves out (Islamic militancy is also a cause of concern for the Chinese, their north-western provices have a history if Islamic militancy).

It will give a new lease of life to the Chinese Communist Party and strenthen their loosening grip on power.

Post conflict China will have a more stronger position than India.

But in long term India will be more stable.

The centre of the world once again will be China and India.