Political fate of Jat Leaders

vpsingh said:
Rinku, as far as I recollect, Indian Marxists used to call Chaudhary Charan Singh a representative of “Kulaks” which is a Russian word for wealthy peasants as he was the biggest stumbling block for them in their efforts to make inroads in the peasant stronghold, especially in northern part of India. Because Ch Charan Singh was the undisputed leader of the farming community irrespective of caste and size of holdings, no left movement could ever gather momentum in northern India except for a few pocket boroughs of Punjab and Rajasthan. Now, if a Marxist journalist has some appreciation for Chaudhary Charan Singh, it is a testimony to the fact that he was really a great leader in his own right. Except Ch. Chhotu Ram, no other Jat leader has ever enjoyed such immense respect and popularity, among people across caste spectrum.[/QUOTE

Bhaisahab i was not expecting this from you when you are well aware and somebody who is seen the world and india. I never denied that he was a great leader or he didnot got the respect, his aura was such that in haryana also we have a university named after him n it feels good about it( apni kom badi bholi hai ek baar sath pakad le to chhodti nahi lekin ye jinke neta banate hain wahi inke liye kuch nahi karte) and rally that he organized was one the biggest but do you really think he did that much as much love he got or his family got and still getting from people? He was a great a economist without a doubt. LETS NOT PICK UP A LINE AND DIGRESS THIS, I REALLY WAN TO KNOW THE ANSWER TO MY QUESTION THAT I HAVE ASKED BE IT YOU OR ANYONE ELSE, N I LL BE VERY HAPPY,IF I LL GET ANSWER TO WHAT I HAVE ASKED.

NOW ABOUT YOUR KULAK,
Kulak is used for rich farmer who are into profit driven and market oriented and also into lending money. It is pejorative term used in english media. this is about kulak that you were saying. Kulak use to exploit there serf and thralls. so should i consider it right? N now i dont want to discuss Marxism ( not in this thread atleast)
Now again coming back to the topic
We were discussing about political fate and i wrote about everyone from rajsthan, punjab, haryana n UP then who so much cribbing Ch Charan Singh??? If somebody think he was god or something else let him think that ways why to impose that on others? this thread was never meant for discussing only on Ch Charan Singh, why they want to hear only good about him? They say all jats cant come together this is the reason they can not see above one thing they have in there mind? Jaton mein to kahawat hai ki takkar wala unt pahle karrata hai, inn gel waye ban ri sai.inn sabke jis taranh ghore k bandh kar ek direction mein dekhan tai vaisa hi kuch kiya hua hai.

N how you have brought Ch Chhoturam in the discussion some people say Charan singh was well above him because he was just jat kisan leader and Charan singh was kisan leader as said earlier.
In my last 3 post i have raised few question out of which me yet to get any answers.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
rinkusheoran said:
Why do you see no head or tail , Use your head you will see both
I always thought that you are a intellectual person with a flexible mindset but my dear friend with your tunnel vision and adamant thinking made me wrong. Tune to balak aur jhote aale kar rakhi sai ki aad gaye to manna hi nahi. I was expecting hard evidences not just the perception which you n his follower always give.
Me also not a person who will vote for any hooda or chautla or ajit without looking at there deeds or what there ancestors have done beside looting us. App ki ye baaton se wahi sahmat ho sakta hai ya pasanad karega jisse jaankari na ho, ya blindly kisiko bina kisi tathay k usse follow karne lag jaye , so could you please provide more details on this if you have any.

Just picking a article that too from Mr byre who was marxist( how relevant that ideology) in a journal you are saying all these things.

Zamindara Abolition Act (1952…),The Consolidation of Holdings Act of 1953 when these two act were passed which you people think that really he was the one who crafted these. let me just explain you something

The tide was already against the Zamindari system after independence, it was eliminated all over India. Land consolidation bills were also passed all over India, at the same time.So he was simply carrying out his master's orders. His status was not that big at that time that he would have done at his will.The process was already well on its way.
For those not familiar, the Zamindari system was simply a tax collection system where some"zamindar's" were given contracts to collect tax revenue from a number of villages( ebb aade pakistan/congress ne discuss mat kar usne fer kadde kar langey, vaise just small FYI- jitne baniye/baman bureaucracy/ministry/administration mein gandhi aur nehru ne ghusaye agar usse aadhe bhi aapke kisan neta ne kiye hote to kaam chal jata..ab iska data chahiye to bta dena vo bhi de dunga..till 1990 we had around 2500 IAS n out of these100 from brahman n baniyas ebb ye mat kahiye ki vo apni mehnat tain aaye kyunki kisan tse mehnati to koi nhai hai, unko moka nhai mila huamrae kuch khudgarj netaon ki wajah se, ghani detail chaiye ho to RTI laga liye mil jaga ).Then Ch Charan Singh was simply going with the flow n that too with orders from his master.

His hanging on to the Congress tails got him a berth in the anti jat Pant government, a few crumbs, when he could get no further, and his use was over, he deserted.In other words, it could argued that he was on the' make' - simply looking for the trappings of power.When he obtained power, he did not know what to do with it, for he had no vision to start with, except to get some trappings of power. No doubt he was very honest person n politician but at the same time he was arrogant as well.

He may have conned the ignorant peasantry into thinking he was doing much for them, but he was out of touch with them, their hopes, their toils, and aspirations, and despite his long years in politics from 1928 on( as law minister and as chief minister and as Prime minister)- he did not even get one primary school created in his home district, let alone an institution for higher learning or a road, or drinking water or primary basic heath facilities.

Charan Singh’s budget of 1979..usse jyada kahi bada kaam ( 60k karja maanf karke)congress ne aaj kar diya jo kisan hitaishi nahi hai jiski tarif bhi tu kuch jyada hi kar aha hai?
Aur jab itna bada kisan( yaad rahe 70% se adhik kisan jat hain-they both are synonym) neta tha to fir Land cieling act kyun lagu hone diya, jisse sabse jyada nuksan kisan ko hi hua n agar hua to kisi industry cieling act kyun lagu nahi hua sirk kisan ki kamai k jariye bhi cieling kyun baki aur pe kyun nahi?

गिरवी जमीनों की मुफ्त वापसी एक्ट - 1938,कृषि उत्पाद मंडी अधिनियम - 1938,व्यवसाय श्रमिक अधिनियम - 1940,कर्जा माफी अधिनियम - 1934,साहूकार पंजीकरण एक्ट - 1938,---- Jo aapne bataya usse jyada act to punjab mein bahut pahle pass ho gaye the jo sirf aur sirf kisono k liye tha

Again coming back , would you like to give some evidences or you dont have anything other than what you have already wrote
What is it exactly that Charan Singh did do for the Jats, or for the common people???The question still stands
Any schools , education, infrastructure, taking the community in a new direction ???.The question still stands
How did his becoming a political leader help anyone- except himself ??The question still stands

Please do give hard evidences instead of your perception( which i already know)


Ps- main mera homework kadde tain ye badhiya karta aaya n tu bhi homwork karan laag jaga uss din tain to inn rajnitiyon kipicha chhod dega n maine aapse merese discussion k liye nyota nahi diya tha.
Click to expand...
I am a mediocre mind and you are an intellectual one?...Hmm....... In one post you say baghpat is poorest distt and chaudhary sahab did not do anything, out of 100, only 10% are real jats in UP who stopped water flow in Muradnagar. When someone raised his hand, Contrary to that you say I have respect for chaudhary sahab and no grudge against people of any region. You can not hold on your own views and you ask for hard evidences? I gave you references and still you ask for evidences? Should I create a virtual set up of what happened back in 50 years and then show you brief "chal-chitra". You are being adamant or me?tunnel vision..hahahha...I understand how wide and transparent your vision is?.. What kind of hard evidences can pacify you? Erecting only Jat dharamshalas, colleges, schools can make a Jat great?
By the way, "agriculture product market bill" 1938..who produced this bill in assembly?
 
Last edited:
I did not expect it from an intellectual one.
"Jamindars were only tax collectors"..any sane person will not accept this.
"He was following his master orders" and you are following orders of whom?
If we accept HIM like God why you are intriguing?

"In February 1937 he was elected to the Legislative Assembly of Uttar Pradesh at the age of 34. In 1938 he introduced an Agricultural Produce Market Bill in the Assembly. The Bill was intended to safeguard the interests of the farmers against the greediness of the traders. The Bill was adopted by most of the States in India, Punjab being the first state to do so in 1940. In 1952, he became the Revenue Minister of state of Uttar Pradesh, the most populous state in independent India. He was dedicated to introducing and implementing the provisions of the Zamindari Abolition and Land Reform Act of which he was the major architect. It has been argued by leading political scientists that success of Indian Democracy lies in successful implementation of this reform. "...........................
 
Last edited:
Originally written by prashantacmet;
I did not expect it from an intellectual one.
"Jamindars were only tax collectors"..any sane person will not accept this.
"He was following his master orders" and you are following orders of whom?
If we accept HIM like God why you are intriguing?
Click to expand...
Prashant, I hope your comment is not addressed to me. It has created some confusion as Rinku's post quoted by you contained my comments also. Please clarify.
 
Last edited:
Prashant tere jaise ne iss parivar ki rajniit 4-5 jilon tak simat kar di hai aur aagey dekhna, inki bhavisvani kar dusron ki cchod.
Baki tu jo kar sake sai vo manne bahut achi tarah dekh liya n chinta na kar tanne 2012 main jarura milunga tere neta k chunav mein agar india mein hua to:rock
 
Last edited:
prashantacmet said:
I am a mediocre mind and you are an intellectual one?...Hmm....... In one post you say baghpat is poorest distt and chaudhary sahab did not do anything, out of 100, only 10% are real jats in UP who stopped water flow in Muradnagar. When someone raised his hand, Contrary to that you say I have respect for chaudhary sahab and no grudge against people of any region. You can not hold on your own views and you ask for hard evidences? I gave you references and still you ask for evidences? Should I create a virtual set up of what happened back in 50 years and then show you brief "chal-chitra". You are being adamant or me?tunnel vision..hahahha...I understand how wide and transparent your vision is?.. What kind of hard evidences can pacify you? Erecting only Jat dharamshalas, colleges, schools can make a Jat great?
By the way, "agriculture product market bill" 1938..who produced this bill in assembly?
Click to expand...

baki tu apne barein mein better bata sakt ahai main kon hota hun deny karne wala.
Kyun koi chaudhary Sahab k kaam pe sawl kare to vo unki ijjat nahi karta kya and usse pure area k against grudge hai usse???? sari post dobara padh le ek baar mein samajh nahi aata to.
n tere soch maine tabhi dekh li thi jab maine sabke barein mein likha lkein chaudhary charan singh k naam par tu mendhak ki tarah uchla?

aur rahi baat jaton ki to

"jat fauj ka itihass jato ka itihass nad jaton ka itihass bharat ka itihass hai " inka bhala to saredesh ka bhalla, lekin tu nahi samjhega isse jaise tera neta nahi samajh paye.

ek taraf bolta hai ki inta kuch de diya ya chal-chitra dun kya lekin fir bhi ek ek karke kuch kuch na batane ki kosis kar raha hai ...kya yaar consolidate kar kyunki dhire dhire log ab accountability mangane lag gaye aagey kaam aayegi de dena apne netao ko

Baki khuda maan chahe kimme aur maan lekin likhane wale to likhenegy tu uss baat ki dikkat band kar de pahel fir kisne na dikkat na hogi chahe tu kimme maan
n sab teri dhal ya teri neta ki dhal koni ki kisse k order se kuch kare ya yahan likhe , kuch log apni soch rakhte hain n kisi mansik gulami ka sikar nahi hote.
 
Last edited:
@rinku #post 81

Your unanswered questions will be history or be deleted by the censor-No such discussions on JATLAND. Jhooti leek peeti jao sab razee.AAp bhee itihaas key paanau mein aaja vogey.
Kya Birbal ney sadaa Haa mein haa milayee.Gustakhi maaf huzur aur kah deta thaa apnee baat kintu yahan praja tantar mein ulta hai pyare
 
Last edited:
narendersingh said:
rinkusheoran said:
Your unanswered questions will be history or be deleted by the censor-No such discussions on JATLAND. Jhooti leek peeti jao sab razee.AAp bhee itihaas key paanau mein aaja vogey.
Kya Birbal ney sadaa Haa mein haa milayee.Gustakhi maaf huzur aur kah deta thaa apnee baat kintu yahan praja tantar mein ulta hai pyare
Click to expand...

Narender ji, please edit the portion (Rinku's post) as quoted by you. You may delete first paragraph which contains my comments wrongly merged with rinku's post otherwise it will create the impression that you are quoting me. I know you are addressing your comment to Rinku but just to make it more clear it would be better if you edit the quoted portion.
Click to expand...
 
Members please make such requests in PM or in visitor message and do the needful, such expressions get extended in all replies and when that are deleted, members feel bad :)

Post No-33/61/64/65/69 comprise of sarcastic comments, how many posts can be ignored....please encourage a healthy discussion :)
prashantacmet said:
VP singh ji..it is for rinku ..sorry for confusion..I have edited the post :)
Click to expand...
 
sunitahooda said:
Members please make such requests in PM or in visitor message and do the needful, such expressions get extended in all replies and when that are deleted, members feel bad :)

Post No-33/61/64/65/69 comprise of sarcastic comments, how many posts can be ignored....please encourage a healthy discussion :)
Click to expand...
Absolutely. I think it is being too much now. There seems no end of this discussion. I am resisting myself from posting further on this topic. Long live peace on the website :)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top