jat movemment very urgent to save our heritage

[rakeshsehrawat]

without even knowing anything about you i just told you the reality behind your words. Respected sir here we are not talking something personal we are talking about society.
I know i am rude but i can't help and i don't want to.samaj ki bhalai ka matlab apne dukhde ona nahi hota.
Sorry for last bitter words.

Meine Sehrawat aur Dhankhar ka jikar nahi kiya doosri baat meine sabse pehle apni umar ka jikar kiya tha.
Par ek baat yahan koi jatland member kehta tha " kisi ko akal umar ke saath aati hai kisi ko experience ke saath par kuch apwad bhi hote hain."

 

[singhvp]

Let me make my point of view loud and clear again before people start shouting or start suggesting some marriage tips for my family. I am all against this same gotra marriage. Two or three avoidable gotras ( as per their family customs but not according to any villege or KHAP RULES) should be avoided while considering a marriage relationship. Rest things are optionals and shouldn't be forced on ANYONE.

I wonder when no one is advocating marriage in same gotra here but still people are suggesting to marry their daughters in their own families, just for the sake of arguments. Stub born word seems to be redefined.

It is very interesting to observe that families living in a village since hundreds of years are still considered Aliens 'as per Khap Rules' just because they didn't located that villege initially. Historian says that Delhi was located by Tomar Jats originally. So other gotra's of Delhi are outsiders but i never saw any Tomar girl who got married to a Delhi Jat boy came across any fatwa.

Thousands of years back a few people located a place, named it a villege and started living there. Later people from other gotra joined them that makes a perfect villege. Now, who is the owner of the villege. The locator of the villege or the people living there. Do these people have different set of Rights on the villege issues ?

And if that are norms for the jat community then why it is not uniform in overall Jat dominated area. Why it is limited to a very minor area as compared to vastly polulated Overall Jat area in India. Is jat pride depends upon the norms practiced by 'jat people of few districts' ?

I never came across a villege who have some Gotra. Instead some villeges have majority of some specific gotra and that doesn't provide any authority to 'them' to make rules for the villege. If they do so than it is clearly a case of might is right. If people feel mighty by supressing their own fellow community members than be happy with the deception and keep feeling proudy as the mightest race on this planet.

Very well written.

 

[singhvp]

without even knowing anything about you i just told you the reality behind your words. Respected sir here we are not talking something personal we are talking about society.
I know i am rude but i can't help and i don't want to.samaj ki bhalai ka matlab apne dukhde ona nahi hota.
Sorry for last bitter words.

Dukhade Rona Dhankhar ke khoon mein nahin hota. We root out those who dare to give any Dukhda. What are you talking about. Have always lived with straight face and "Abhi koi mai ka laal paida nahin hua jo dukh de sake. For your information inspite of being in minority, there are 2 Panchayat members from my family out of a total 5-6. 25 Lathait hain. Yakeen nahin ho to aa ke dekh lena. Khalash karne ke takat rakhte hain. Do not misunderstand my humility as my weakness. Badi badi baat karta hai Jat culture ki. Pahale chhote bade ke lihaj karna seekh le, jo Jat Tehjeet ka hissa hai. Phir dusron ko lecture dena.

 

[rakeshsehrawat]

Dukhade Rona Dhankhar ke khoon mein nahin hota. We root out those who dare to give any Dukhda. What are you talking about. Have always lived with straight face and "Abhi koi mai ka laal paida nahin hua jo dukh de sake. For your information inspite of being in minority, there are 2 Panchayat members from my family out of a total 5-6. 25 Lathait hain. Yakeen nahin ho to aa ke dekh lena. Khalash karne ke takat rakhte hain. Do not misunderstand my humility as my weakness. Badi badi baat karta hai Jat culture ki. Pahale chhote bade ke lihaj karna seekh le, jo Jat Tehjeet ka hissa hai. Phir dusron ko lecture dena.

Sahab ji mein dar gya boda ha manas hoon kyun haad tudwao ho
Panchayat wo kya hoti hai?
Jat takkat ko bol ke batate hain ye bhi aj hi dekha
lath market mein 10 rapiye fut mile hai

 

[singhvp]

Sahab ji mein dar gya boda ha manas hoon kyun haad tudwao ho
Panchayat wo kya hoti hai?
Jat takkat ko bol ke batate hain ye bhi aj hi dekha
lath market mein 10 rapiye fut mile hai

Rakesh Bhayya,

I think we are unnecessarily wasting our time here. Let us say goodbye to each other gracefully.

Bye Bye. Ram Ram

 

[vedmalik]

चाचा ताऊ के छोरे छोरियाँ का भी आपस में प्यार होवे है फेर क्यूँ नहीं उनका बियाह करवा देते ?
मुसलमाना आला सिस्टम चोखा फेर इस्ते तो तीन बार कबूल कबूल कह्य आर बियाह होया तीन बार तलक कहया आर चल दफा हो ! एक का ब्योंत हो एक रखो ५० का ब्योंत हो ५० !रोज मर्द को एक औरत से प्यार होता है और ये बात सब पर लागु होती है जब विश्वामित्र नहीं थम पाया तो म्हारी के बिसात लयन दयो फेर रोज एक नयी !
मीडिया की कहानी सुनके अर चल दे हैं मुह ठाके ! उन उल्लू के पाठय का न कोए धरम न जात जिसने म्हारे समाज का कीमे नहीं बेर जिसका मतलब बस इतना है की उसकी खबर फालतू क्यूकर बिकेगी वो आज खुदा हो गए !
जाट समाज के कानूनों में परिवर्तन की कोई जरूरत नहीं है बस जरूरत सिर्फ उनको समझने की है और उनके पीछे छुपे कारणों को जानने की है !

Debate ki zarurat hi nahin hai. Everyone knows what is our custom and why killing has happened.
Abb kise ne nah samaj toh usne aawe bhi koni.

 

[vedmalik]

Everyone is saying they are against same gotra marriage as did by said couple.

Some are saying they are against killing of those two by near dear ones.

My question is why some people refute killing ?
Behan ke saath sabse napaak kaam karenga to yahin anjaam hona chahiye.

 

[brahmtewatia]

prakashit intervention !!!

Neo-Liberals are wayward confused morons and venal than counterpart conservatives when it comes to understanding of tradition, values versus life style and standards. Ironically, they are raised up in science era but totally lack that scientific rationale. Change with time doesn't mean alteration of tradition in sync with alien cultures.

Use of words like "morons" does not seem to be in good taste on the part of a person who happens to be a very responsible person in running of this portal. There is, however, no question mark on your vocabulary. Being very influential person on this site, you are, perhaps, entitled to go to any extent in using unparliamentary and filthy language.

prakashit intervention !!!

[FONT=&quot]singh sahab (v.p.) the way you were endorsing ‘mild sarcasm’ to anil on one of the threads… same way i also endorse usage of strong words in any discussion, as it gives more velocity nd momentum to make members stand up from punching their keyboards nd resort to [/FONT]रामलाल (लट्ठ[FONT=&quot]). i see nothing wrong in samar’s usage of words, so please take this as a tip as you evolve at JATland nd let's honour an individual's personal style of writing nd perspective(s).[/FONT]

more about रामलाल

jab tak रामलाल discussion me na ho, tab tak discussion be-mane rehta hai… so रामलाल must be used to make a discussion more meaningful. remember this is JATland, yahan रामलाल के बिना बात नहीं होती. we must always adhere to the services of रामलाल at the 1st available opportunity, which can be purchased from anywhere starting from rs. 10/feet… na tae duniya ale hame chamar kehan laag jyange.

its nice to see the peace btwn dhankar nd sehrawat… kal ka ke bera… aap me hi ristedari ban jya… i mean you get sehrawat in yr family and/or viceversa.

... sorry to be a bit off-topic, as i draft my comments to the ensuing discussion.

 

[cooljat]

Excerpt from a fellow Jatlander and Reporter's blog :

An enlightening read :

" आज जब मनोज और बबली के कातिलों को कोर्ट से सजा हो गई है. पॉँच को फांसी और एक को उम्र कैद मिली है तो ऐसे में मुझे हर वो पुरानी घटना याद आ रही है जो इस मामले से जुडी है.. चैनलों और अख़बारों में इस मामले को भी खाप पंचायत से जोड़ कर ये बताने की कोशिश की जा रही है की इस मामले में भी जो कुछ हुआ वो खाप ने किया जबकि इस मामले में जो भी हुआ वो सब बबली के परिवार का किया धरा है. हाँ ये सच है की उनके इस कृत्य को समाज के एक वर्ग ने अपनी मौन सहमती ज़रूर दी थी. भूमंडलीकरण के इस दौर में गाँव भी शहरों की तरज पर विकसित होने लगे हैं. वहां भी रिश्तों की मर्यादाये और वर्जनाएं टूट रही हैं. सबसे बड़ी बात ये समाज के ठेकेदार युवा वर्ग को समझाने की बजाय बन्दुक या तलवार के दम पर सीधा करने की कोशिश में लगे हैं इसका परिणाम ये की आये दिन ऐसे प्रेम प्रसंग सामने आ रहे हैं. और अब तो आरोपियों को फंसी दिए जाने का उदाहरण भी हमारे सामने है. "

http://suniyezara.blogspot.com/


Cheers
Jit

 

[sitaram]

lath market mein 10 rapiye fut mile hai

Shayad isse bhi sasta.

 

[rajinderkk]

Honour killings

Its soo repulsing and dreadful to hear and to read every day about honour killings in our coommunity .No right thinking person can ever support such thought or act. every civilised community member must stand up firm and condenm it with all his force. Klling of any form is irreprehensible more so of human beings that too of your own kith and kin -BEYOND COMPREHENSION . These are the thoughts of every one of us. Well its not new, these acts were takings place away from roving media eyes. I understand and equally am proud of our village culture where in a girl from same village is considered as your sister so you say.Also your gothra girls/ladies even out of ones village. I am seeking solulutions to this problem from all of you before it becomes cancerous. either you find a path or else make one . in my view we have failed to inculcate values in the genration Y.

 

[vedmalik]

Its soo repulsing and dreadful to hear and to read every day about honour killings in our coommunity .No right thinking person can ever support such thought or act. every civilised community member must stand up firm and condenm it with all his force. Klling of any form is irreprehensible more so of human beings that too of your own kith and kin -BEYOND COMPREHENSION . These are the thoughts of every one of us. Well its not new, these acts were takings place away from roving media eyes. I understand and equally am proud of our village culture where in a girl from same village is considered as your sister so you say.Also your gothra girls/ladies even out of ones village. I am seeking solulutions to this problem from all of you before it becomes cancerous. either you find a path or else make one . in my view we have failed to inculcate values in the genration Y.

Then why do you favour when an armed forces guy kills someone who has crossed border ?
On many occassions civilians too get across to other side of border.

Is crossing a border " a bigger crime " than having intimate relation with your own sister ?
Baad khet ko kha rahi hai log taali baja rahe hain.....saying cultured!

 

[vijay123]

Really?? sab aisi soch wale ho jaate to ab bhi hum yehi sochte ki dharti gol nahi hai or suraj dharti ke charon or ghoomta hai.

- Abhi kuch saal pehle Kadyan khap ka bahut rola macha tha woh ke tha?
- Kuch din pehle samaspur mei itna bada rola machh gaya er pher shaant bhi ho gaya
- Kuch din pehle ek couple ko bhai behan bana diya or pher badi panchayat ne faisla ulat bhi diya

No one is in favor of marriage with in gotra or same village but if there are one or two cases then there is no need to make it such a big issue. I am sure that even the family members wont allow such marriages and they wont let such couple stay in villages. What's the need of these khap panchayats to intervene inhumanely then? If they want to then they should try to resolve the matter in a humane way not the talibani way.

चाचा ताऊ के छोरे छोरियाँ का भी आपस में प्यार होवे है फेर क्यूँ नहीं उनका बियाह करवा देते ?
मुसलमाना आला सिस्टम चोखा फेर इस्ते तो तीन बार कबूल कबूल कह्य आर बियाह होया तीन बार तलक कहया आर चल दफा हो ! एक का ब्योंत हो एक रखो ५० का ब्योंत हो ५० !रोज मर्द को एक औरत से प्यार होता है और ये बात सब पर लागु होती है जब विश्वामित्र नहीं थम पाया तो म्हारी के बिसात लयन दयो फेर रोज एक नयी !
मीडिया की कहानी सुनके अर चल दे हैं मुह ठाके ! उन उल्लू के पाठय का न कोए धरम न जात जिसने म्हारे समाज का कीमे नहीं बेर जिसका मतलब बस इतना है की उसकी खबर फालतू क्यूकर बिकेगी वो आज खुदा हो गए !
जाट समाज के कानूनों में परिवर्तन की कोई जरूरत नहीं है बस जरूरत सिर्फ उनको समझने की है और उनके पीछे छुपे कारणों को जानने की है !

 

[hoodarajesh]

जिस गाम मैं कोई एक खाप बड़ी सै वो अपने लड़के किसी गोत मै ब्याह लें सें चाहे उस गोत के कई घर उनके गाम मैं हों . पर अगर दुसरे भाई जो मिनोरिटी में हैं वो उन बड़ी खाप की कोई लड़की ब्याह के दुसरे/दूर के गाम तैं ले आवें तो तालिबानी फरमान जरी कर दे सें बड़ी खाप के चोधरी. यह कहाँ तक न्यायसंगत है. क्या हम सब अपनी अपनी खाप मैं जाकर बस जाएँ और नई सीमा रेखाएं खीच लें. क्या ये bullying जायज है ?

वि पि सिंह जी पहले कोई गोत्र आके गाँव बसाता था .
उस गाँव का खेडा उसके गोत्र के नाम हो जाता था .
वो गाँव उसी गोत्र का खेडा कहलाता था . बाद में फेर
आये गए आते रहते थे . उनके गोत्र का कोई महत्व नही
रहता था . रही बात करनाल आले केस की तै जिसकी बहन --
बेटी गाँव के लड़के की तो छोडो किसी दुसरे गाँव या गोत्र आले
गेल्या भाजे गी तो एसे ही चमड़ी उधेडी जाएगी . बहुत ही आछा करा
उनको मारकर . रही बात उनकी फासी की तो यो काम फासी देवन
का अंग्रेजा नै बहुत करा फेर भी तो देश आजाद हुआ . इस केस में
लड़के वाले निक्कम्मे जाट निकले उनको अपना लड़का खुद ही मारना
चाहिए था . नै की जिन्होंने मारा उनके खिलाफ केस लड़ना .

 

[singhvp]

वि पि सिंह जी पहले कोई गोत्र आके गाँव बसाता था .
उस गाँव का खेडा उसके गोत्र के नाम हो जाता था .
वो गाँव उसी गोत्र का खेडा कहलाता था . बाद में फेर
आये गए आते रहते थे . उनके गोत्र का कोई महत्व नही
रहता था . रही बात करनाल आले केस की तै जिसकी बहन --
बेटी गाँव के लड़के की तो छोडो किसी दुसरे गाँव या गोत्र आले
गेल्या भाजे गी तो एसे ही चमड़ी उधेडी जाएगी . बहुत ही आछा करा
उनको मारकर . रही बात उनकी फासी की तो यो काम फासी देवन
का अंग्रेजा नै बहुत करा फेर भी तो देश आजाद हुआ . इस केस में
लड़के वाले निक्कम्मे जाट निकले उनको अपना लड़का खुद ही मारना
चाहिए था . नै की जिन्होंने मारा उनके खिलाफ केस लड़ना .

Hooda Sahab, Apki bat theek hai. Pahle esi manyata thi. Par ek bat batao izzat to sab got ke bhaian ki barabar hoti hai. Isme majority, minority or kaun pahle basya tha aur kaun bad mein aya tha yeh important nahin hona chahiye. Sab ki izzat honi chahiye agar jat bhaichara banana hai to. Ek bat aur main saaf kar doon ki mujhe personally kabhi kisi dusre got se kabhi koi paresani nahin hui ajtak. Touchwood, Hamare gaon me complete bhaichara hai sab got walon ka aur aaj tak koi esa mamla kabhi hua nahin. Na hi ajtak koi murder hua kisi mamle ko lekar. Par kuch kisse peechhe Rohtak District mein padhe the is tarah ke. Isliye jikar kar diya tha.

Baki Same Got marriage ko to koi bhi member theet nahin bata raha jahan tak mera khyal hai. Haan Killing wale mamle par matbhed jaroor hain. Social boycot bhi ek remedy hai ese case mein. Baaki to community mein majority jo phaisla karti hai wo manana padta hai. Kyonki samaj ka boycot karke to jeena muskil ho jata hai. Lekin theek kya hai aur galat kya hai ye to pecheeda or muskil sawal hai. Dekho baki members kya kya pritikriya dete hain. Lekin iska substitute social boycot ho sakta hai.

 

[hemanthooda]

Dear All,

I was reading views expressed by fellow Jatlanders.I pleased to find out that majority of us (including myself) agree on 2 points -
a)Marriage b/w same gotra people should not happen & we should respect the 3 gotra match rule.
b)If some one marries in same gotra then killling them is not a solution.They should be discarded by the society.

Nice to find out that we cuber world Jats are in sync with our values, customs & traditions.

JAT EKTA JINDABAD.

regards

 

[singhvp]

prakashit intervention !!!

[FONT=&quot]singh sahab (v.p.) the way you were endorsing ‘mild sarcasm’ to anil on one of the threads… same way i also endorse usage of strong words in any discussion, as it gives more velocity nd momentum to make members stand up from punching their keyboards nd resort to [/FONT]रामलाल (लट्ठ[FONT=&quot]). i see nothing wrong in samar’s usage of words, so please take this as a tip as you evolve at JATland nd let's honour an individual's personal style of writing nd perspective(s).[/FONT]

more about रामलाल

jab tak रामलाल discussion me na ho, tab tak discussion be-mane rehta hai… so रामलाल must be used to make a discussion more meaningful. remember this is JATland, yahan रामलाल के बिना बात नहीं होती. we must always adhere to the services of रामलाल at the 1st available opportunity, which can be purchased from anywhere starting from rs. 10/feet… na tae duniya ale hame chamar kehan laag jyange.

its nice to see the peace btwn dhankar nd sehrawat… kal ka ke bera… aap me hi ristedari ban jya… i mean you get sehrawat in yr family and/or viceversa.

... sorry to be a bit off-topic, as i draft my comments to the ensuing discussion.

Braham. Samar Singh Kadiyan is not an ordinary member. I have great respect for him and consider him as a think tank on this portal. I have no problem with his sarcasm. But you know the meaning of moron very well. I would again say, a person of Samar's stature should not use this. I do not want him to belittle himself by use of such words. My expectations from him are very high. There will not be any exaggeration, if I call him a living legend, among Jats and I mean it. Don't think it a joke.

I know Samar has the intellect to take it in right perspective. I do not react to each and everyone. If he differs with me, I will immediately flash my apologies.

 

[vijay123]

There is law to tackle criminals and that include those who have incest relationship too (incluing someone marrying in their gotras). No one has right to kill anybody. That is the difference between talibanism and democracy. Do you also advocate killing of newborn girls too? That too is a big problem in Haryana and why dont people like you and khaps punish those who kill newborn girls. I welcome this judgement and going forward you will see more sanity in judgements passed by khaps.

Then why do you favour when an armed forces guy kills someone who has crossed border ?
On many occassions civilians too get across to other side of border.

Is crossing a border " a bigger crime " than having intimate relation with your own sister ?
Baad khet ko kha rahi hai log taali baja rahe hain.....saying cultured!

 

[jitender.singh]

I am wondering where as a community we are heading to. Whatever I saw is that the community is being represented by so called Panchayats, which in my opinion are neither democratic, nor representative. No wonder they will behave like the way they are structured.
I see nobody pushing for social changes in the community with time and only see people trying to say that we need to preserve the traditions that our ancestors followed. What nobody noticed was that they lived in very different world than we are living in. Additionally, they had crafted the traditions according to the requirements of their times, which I think may or may not be relevant to our times. The current examples of Khap Panchayats using the arguments of preserving the traditions to provoke people to kill even their dear ones is an evidence of the same mindset of trying to prove that the traditions should not change with time. Nobody tries to find the real reasons behind the evolution of certain tradition and adjust the tradition with current context. This is where we might be heading to a direct conflict with the law of the land.
I see these incidents as indicators to review our social setup, so that as a society we are respected as important part of the country's social fabric and not be branded exclusive Taliban-style society, which some of the newspapers seem to be branding us.

 

[jitender.singh]

Then why do you favour when an armed forces guy kills someone who has crossed border ?
On many occassions civilians too get across to other side of border.

Is crossing a border " a bigger crime " than having intimate relation with your own sister ?
Baad khet ko kha rahi hai log taali baja rahe hain.....saying cultured!

The current context is not all about supporting what you have tried to convey in your current reply. Still I want to answer you regrarding your query: Yes, both are crimes as per Indian Law. And you can not compare both of these, because the first one is of different domain and second one is of different domain. It is like you are trying to compare apples with oranges.

Further the current context is not with respect to what law treats as your sister, but it is with respect to what your community treats as your sister (correct me if I am wrong, because for sure since the boy and the girl got married they do not treat themselves brother and sister and as per law of land in no case they were legally brother and sister). So now the question is how the community should deal with such a scenario? And most importantly, how the society should give a verdict on such issues, through the undemocratic and erratic panchayats, or through a systematic feedback from community?

In my opinion the support of current panchayats is doing more harm than good for the community. This system has saw all of us being branded Indian Talibans by the Indian media and I know that they have valid reasons of saying so.