piush_tomar
New member
DO or Die for Reservation
ATTENTION!!!!!!!Jaat Reservation Polling
- Thread starter daivischahal
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Short Sightedness about reservation
Recently there has been high obsessions about getting reservation for Jats. I wonder whether people are even aware of the facts, the truth about the reservation, the benefits to the jats as well as to the nation from such reservations.
I am not a guru of this topic but I would like to share my limited knowledge and my perception. Reservation was introduced to "support" the "discriminated" sections of the society. Schedule castes' were not given the fair opportunity for education and for the jobs, rather they were unfairly treated and are still looked upon the same way. We (most Jats) look down upon them. Reservation policy was adopted to undo the social injustice done to them. Such a social injustice was not in favor of Nation itself.
This said, now the reservation has become the political tool and little do people know the limited benefits that they might get from the reservation. Support for Jat reservation is no different than a political selfish issue. We are not discriminated and neither we are denied of any opportunities. I think people who dont have the tendency to work hard, want reservation and dream that they or their dear ones would get an easy ticket to elite institutions and "Govt" jobs through reservation.
I wonder why are we not trying to compete with baniyas, kayasths, punjabis, brahamins; instead we choose to fit into jam packed reservation bus which goes to limited destinations. People got to earn their own bread unless they are being treated unfairly. Jats have good representation in various parts of the society. We have had successful jat politicians, cabinet ministers, sports persons, highly successful business men, actors, defense personnels and what not? I fail to understand the reason that why shall we even demand reservation.
I would like to know the logical reasons from the proponents of jat reservations.
Recently there has been high obsessions about getting reservation for Jats. I wonder whether people are even aware of the facts, the truth about the reservation, the benefits to the jats as well as to the nation from such reservations.
I am not a guru of this topic but I would like to share my limited knowledge and my perception. Reservation was introduced to "support" the "discriminated" sections of the society. Schedule castes' were not given the fair opportunity for education and for the jobs, rather they were unfairly treated and are still looked upon the same way. We (most Jats) look down upon them. Reservation policy was adopted to undo the social injustice done to them. Such a social injustice was not in favor of Nation itself.
This said, now the reservation has become the political tool and little do people know the limited benefits that they might get from the reservation. Support for Jat reservation is no different than a political selfish issue. We are not discriminated and neither we are denied of any opportunities. I think people who dont have the tendency to work hard, want reservation and dream that they or their dear ones would get an easy ticket to elite institutions and "Govt" jobs through reservation.
I wonder why are we not trying to compete with baniyas, kayasths, punjabis, brahamins; instead we choose to fit into jam packed reservation bus which goes to limited destinations. People got to earn their own bread unless they are being treated unfairly. Jats have good representation in various parts of the society. We have had successful jat politicians, cabinet ministers, sports persons, highly successful business men, actors, defense personnels and what not? I fail to understand the reason that why shall we even demand reservation.
I would like to know the logical reasons from the proponents of jat reservations.
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piush_tomar
New member
Dear Nitin,
I am talking about UP Jat only .We have reservation at state level and now demanding reservation at central level whether its educational institution like IIT or IIM and central government jobs starting from para milatry to PSU’s.
Now as our 80 % jat population based on agriculture and because of our worse and incompetent political leadership situation became extremely worse at village level. Our agriculture land shrinking day by day because of population and Jat community becoming financially poorer. Because of poor education system people are not getting good education and so they are not even getting jobs. Jat who is living in cities can educate their children in much better way rather than Jat who is living in village.
So Reservation will be for poorer Jats not for all Jats who is coming under creamy layer.So I talking about good education at village level in UP is nnot possible even for next 20 years. So Jat Aarakshan Sangarsh samiti started this movement under Mr. Yeshpal Malik (All india President of JASS- Jat Aarakshan Sangarsh samiti).
piush_tomar
New member
Dear Nitin,
I am talking about UP Jat only .We have reservation at state level and now demanding reservation at central level whether its educational institution like IIT or IIM and central government jobs starting from para milatry to PSU’s.
Now as our 80 % jat population based on agriculture and because of our worse and incompetent political leadership situation became extremely worse at village level. Our agriculture land shrinking day by day because of population and Jat community becoming financially poorer. Because of poor education system people are not getting good education and so they are not even getting jobs. Jat who is living in cities can educate their children in much better way rather than Jat who is living in village.
So Reservation will be for poorer Jats not for all Jats who is coming under creamy layer.So I talking about good education at village level in UP is nnot possible even for next 20 years. So Jat Aarakshan Sangarsh samiti started this movement under Mr. Yeshpal Malik (All india President of JASS- Jat Aarakshan Sangarsh samiti).
Nitindev,there are many posts on the topic & brothers have nos of points in favour & against, also your both the points have been covered by many brothers, but still, are there seperate seats earmarked for so called forward classes in jobs/admissions?, are reserved classes debared for oppen seats? Did jats got same respect in society as brahaman baiya etc? were jats educated earlier or allowed to jion good Ashrams of education or allowed to lookafter any temple? brother jats who produced weate, wre not able to eat the same, thanks to respected ch chhotu ram that today we have some land with us, otherwise this was also taken away by baniyas. What social respect we are talking even now, jat word is used as abuse or symble of uneducated.
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There is where comes old thinking[Earlier Thinking] in picture!
JATs are respected to core by other castes , this is a change one can notice even in refugees.
All want to befriend a JAT/JATNI......esp baniya girls are now seen in a JATNIs paltan.
Latest EXAMPLE is when CMship of HARYANA was given this time....there was no candidate on CASTE BASE!!!! Earlier there was always a move going on for Non-JAT CM.
IT was absent this time!
JATs are enjoying special status not just in society but in hearts of ALL.
(This is becoz their is no seen danger from JAT unnecessarily , and others feel comfortable that
one's rights are safe & secured............which will not be the case if RESERVATION DEVIL is open
esp for well established race of Jats in Haryana)
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My dear Ojus, firstly, it is not old or new thinking, but the truth of history, whether you like it or not. no body denys that jat is a race, similarly Ahire, saini, gujjars chamars, baniyas etc all are different races. Secondly, charlie who asked/allowed you to comment on my thinking, if I am an old person, my thinking, which is based on my long experience, more knowlledge &batter understanding, has to be old, but I can assure you, It is my thinking, thinking of a jat & thinking of an Indian. My dear, modern thinker, the toppic is reservation for jats, not thinking of Col Fateh Singh Kharb. Sincere advise-- no personal attack/criticism/lag pulling please.Ofcourse, your verdict about my thinking doesnot have any meaning or any effect on me or my thinking but certainly it will divert/spoil the discussion. one shouldnot forget that jat has lot of fighting spirit & fighting spirit of an ex service man, obiously becomes double, thus we should always avoide personal comments.regards.
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I want to clarify that my writing was not directed personally towards you.
In olden days , people use to call JAT an uneducated fellow ...not now..this is what i want to say.
Even described very clearly this thing that view of other races has turned positive towards JATs including Refugees who were most vocal critics of our race.
Personal attack is never ever my intention.
Dear Piyush,
If "some" Jats are suffering today then it is because of their own incompetencies, poor planning and perhaps procrastination. It is not because of any injustice or discrimination. I agree that most Jats are dependent on agriculture, but then who is stopping them from moving into new greener pastures or expanding and improving their ways of earning. My grand father was a farmer but my father was not, and in the third generation non of us are doing farming. Agricultural land is not shrinking, many jats are selling them and few are doing it for the right purpose such as opening new malls or cutting societies. The other reason of shrinking land per jat person is the increasing population, but then this doesnt happen overnight; we get plenty of time to plan the future. I am also from UP, I am very well aware of the attitude problem in local jats. They take more pride in buying new rifles and do naal, than investing in something productive.
If jat can afford a maruti then he will go for accord but even if a baniya can afford an accord then he will buy maruti.
The reservation will help fewer Jats and I am pretty sure that it will corrupt the minds of even more. Now the parents would be telling their wards that -" Son don't worry you have the reservation". Now already pampered and arrogant jat minds will put in even lesser efforts for the studies. Secondly they might only opt for a career where reservation is available and would leave out other better opportunities. Not to mention that we would not be the only ones in the OBC category, there are many other castes and benefits will be bare minimum relative to the population we have.
Shri Yaspal Malik should be spending more time time in demanding for better education at school level for all. This would assure more number of jats and other such deprived people to be better prepared for getting into good colleges and getting into good jobs. If you are talking about those poor jats, who are struggling to earn their living then I am sorry the reservation can't help them. By the time they complete their "poor" schooling, they would be least prepared to get "any" benefits from reservation. Demand should be for improving the elementary school standards and ask behenji (mayawati) to stop constructing statues and start making good schools . If we have to fight then fight for a better cause rather than seeking a back door entry.
Fateh Bhai, Please don't expect me to dig through all those buried posts withl illogical reasoning. I fail to understand and can not testify which world you are talking about. I don't think Jats ever feel inferiority complex, on the contrary there is no other "arrogant" caste than Jats. Dont we take pride in being nicknamed as "Jat" and "Chaudhary" in our friends group in college. The colony where I had lived for the majority of life, our family was among the most respected ones and there were hardy 5% jats there.
Only the Jats of rajasthan have suffered and it might be more justified for them to have the reservation.
If "some" Jats are suffering today then it is because of their own incompetencies, poor planning and perhaps procrastination. It is not because of any injustice or discrimination. I agree that most Jats are dependent on agriculture, but then who is stopping them from moving into new greener pastures or expanding and improving their ways of earning. My grand father was a farmer but my father was not, and in the third generation non of us are doing farming. Agricultural land is not shrinking, many jats are selling them and few are doing it for the right purpose such as opening new malls or cutting societies. The other reason of shrinking land per jat person is the increasing population, but then this doesnt happen overnight; we get plenty of time to plan the future. I am also from UP, I am very well aware of the attitude problem in local jats. They take more pride in buying new rifles and do naal, than investing in something productive.
If jat can afford a maruti then he will go for accord but even if a baniya can afford an accord then he will buy maruti.
The reservation will help fewer Jats and I am pretty sure that it will corrupt the minds of even more. Now the parents would be telling their wards that -" Son don't worry you have the reservation". Now already pampered and arrogant jat minds will put in even lesser efforts for the studies. Secondly they might only opt for a career where reservation is available and would leave out other better opportunities. Not to mention that we would not be the only ones in the OBC category, there are many other castes and benefits will be bare minimum relative to the population we have.
Shri Yaspal Malik should be spending more time time in demanding for better education at school level for all. This would assure more number of jats and other such deprived people to be better prepared for getting into good colleges and getting into good jobs. If you are talking about those poor jats, who are struggling to earn their living then I am sorry the reservation can't help them. By the time they complete their "poor" schooling, they would be least prepared to get "any" benefits from reservation. Demand should be for improving the elementary school standards and ask behenji (mayawati) to stop constructing statues and start making good schools . If we have to fight then fight for a better cause rather than seeking a back door entry.
Fateh Bhai, Please don't expect me to dig through all those buried posts withl illogical reasoning. I fail to understand and can not testify which world you are talking about. I don't think Jats ever feel inferiority complex, on the contrary there is no other "arrogant" caste than Jats. Dont we take pride in being nicknamed as "Jat" and "Chaudhary" in our friends group in college. The colony where I had lived for the majority of life, our family was among the most respected ones and there were hardy 5% jats there.
Only the Jats of rajasthan have suffered and it might be more justified for them to have the reservation.
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piush_tomar
New member
Nitin,
Sir Chotu ram ne bhi kafi samajik kaam kiye jaton ke uthan ke bareey mein..par baad mein aaye hui leadership ne sab khatam kar diya.If 80 % population facing this problem than my dear friend Kuch Government ko bhi karney do hamarey liye..Hum kya sirf police me sipai aur border per gooli khaney ke liye paida huey hey..isliye yeshpal Malik doing great work for seeking the reservation for Jat.
aaj agar government se kuch maag rahe hey to yeh koi bheek nahi hey yeh hamara Haq hey.
Sir Chotu ram ne bhi kafi samajik kaam kiye jaton ke uthan ke bareey mein..par baad mein aaye hui leadership ne sab khatam kar diya.If 80 % population facing this problem than my dear friend Kuch Government ko bhi karney do hamarey liye..Hum kya sirf police me sipai aur border per gooli khaney ke liye paida huey hey..isliye yeshpal Malik doing great work for seeking the reservation for Jat.
aaj agar government se kuch maag rahe hey to yeh koi bheek nahi hey yeh hamara Haq hey.
brahmtewatia
Active member
YES nitin, it is an obsession... more then that, it is the demand of the hour.
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vivekgathwala
New member
My dear young man, trust me, I really donot expect any thing from you except your views in a respectful manner on the toppic. In your interest, you dig posts on the toppic, you may find many answers to your points. Dear, I am also from Haryana & probably know much more about Haryana & jats than many of us here, but brother we are talking about jats & not jats of Haryana only. the point which I replied was the reservation was given due to econmical & social backwardness of certain communities and I said jats should also be included because we were also backward on both the counts & I say again we were. Today we may have done wonders, we may be most respected lot but that is due to our own hard work, what has govt done to help. Take example of yadavas, are they less in any thing to jats, you name any thing, they are equally good if no batter than why govt is helping them. Donot take your personal example, please see the reality on ground, you will find a high percentage of our people & in Haryana itself, below normal economical standard. my request to all those opposing reservation is to think logically, practically, peacefully & sincerely, you get answer to all your points please. I also state that all points put forward by you people, are also correct but brother Tevitia said the reservation for jats is need of the hour. regards
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rajkphogat
Banned
Bhai do tihai bahumat bangya resevation key favour me
For Anti reservation supportes: This is shows only those jatts who uses net, otherwise thari jamanat bhi jabt hoja e.
For Anti reservation supportes: This is shows only those jatts who uses net, otherwise thari jamanat bhi jabt hoja e.
Yadavs even equal to JATs ?? No one will buy your point FATEH ji.
Can you tell me why other caste esp Refugees are not demanding ...'need of hour'
That unfortunate tribe has had not even meals of one time!
See Future plz
Don't Drag youth in darkness.
Economic backwardness is removed by accepting market by these Refugees.....are Kisan of UP ready for it! How many of them(refugee)are into jobs ?
& yes how many in such jobs which are in divided on RESERVATION base ?
Accept the fact that JOBs is not the only way to improve economic cond'n. You said you are in business.
That to be after JOB.
Can you tell me why other caste esp Refugees are not demanding ...'need of hour'
That unfortunate tribe has had not even meals of one time!
See Future plz
Don't Drag youth in darkness.
Economic backwardness is removed by accepting market by these Refugees.....are Kisan of UP ready for it! How many of them(refugee)are into jobs ?
& yes how many in such jobs which are in divided on RESERVATION base ?
Accept the fact that JOBs is not the only way to improve economic cond'n. You said you are in business.
That to be after JOB.
mhundpuriamann
New member
baat mein damm hai !
baat mein damm tho hai bhai ojus ! par ye bhi soch na ki agar reservation mill jaye tho kya buraee hai , if a single guy out of 100 gets the job because of this reservation tho achha hi hai naa !
samjtaa nhee hai baat ko
!
baat mein damm tho hai bhai ojus ! par ye bhi soch na ki agar reservation mill jaye tho kya buraee hai , if a single guy out of 100 gets the job because of this reservation tho achha hi hai naa !
samjtaa nhee hai baat ko
! My dear, refuses were also given reservation for 10 years, secondly, I am not advocating against hard work & business.Also, refuses are not tribe, you may consult any historian please. Yadavas are ahead of you in all respect today, we shouldnot be under wrong impression.They are batter in education, services, politics, sports, business, land holdings, name any field, you will find they are ahead of us, most important of all, they are much more united than jats, I hope, you understand the strength of unity which cannot come without education. Further mr who so you are, I am not draging our youth in to darkness. my dear, expressing views & bringing facts infront of educated brothers like you, is not at all draging into darkness & why should I DO THAT, WILL I BE BENIFITTED IN ANY WAY BY DOING SO. DEAR WELWISHER OF THE COMMUNITY, IF STILL YOU FEEL THAT MY VIEWS ARE REALLY HARMFUL FOR OUR YOUGTH, I SHALL STOP EXPRESSING MY VIEWS, PLEASE DO LET ME KNOW. FRIEND, HOPE YOU UNDERSTAND THE MEANING OF YOUR STATEMENT, YOU HAVE INFACT ABUSED ME INDIRECTLY. God may give you good sense in 2010.
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Reservation for jats will only be GOLDEN OPPURTUNITIES FOR BRAHMIS, BANIYA , REFUGEES.........
In central government funded higher education institutions, 22.5% of available seats are reserved for Scheduled Caste (Dalit) and Scheduled Tribe (Adivasi) students (15% for SCs, 7.5% for STs). This reservation percentage has been raised to 49.5%, by including an additional 27% reservation for OBCs .
Now I am going to make the analysis of situation, if jat will fall under reservation in OBC category.Haryana with 50% forward classes (as per central govt. data).If jats with 36 % population in haryana will fall into OBC category:-
1. That means only 14 % population will left out in forward classes. In this situation, no doubt, jats will be eligible for 77% seats, but then jats will put minds in competition preparation keeping the OBC in target not General category that is human nature also.( UPSC or every competition merit list are evidence that reserved categories candidates clustered at bottom of list).
2. Post reservation Brahmins, baniyas, refugees etc. will enjoy benefits with less competition in General category as result of exclusion of 36 % jats from General category.( In present situation only jats are giving the tough competitions to Brahmins, baniyas , refugee etc. in every field & day by day jats are marching towards Everest.)
3. Under 27% quota for OBC, we jats with majority in this category will give throat cutting competition to our own jat community as no one other in OBC category have guts to face jat.
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rajkphogat
Banned
Bhai Ojus
In so called refugeeya ne aaye 63 saal hogey eb ye kad tai refugee rehngey. U can call them punjabi refugee word doesn't sounds good
Rahi job ki baat PSU me jaki dekh totally punjabi & unki gharaali se, Pvt sector me bhi yahi haal hai.
Local te madey bhot eb dikhan lagey se we bhi engr., itney engg. collge khulya pachey. Na te local khatar police fauj er Master ye e job thi.
Ye punjabi ek lagega 10 admiyan ney gel luwawenge.
prashantacmet
New member
Ojus!! You looks right but whatever are the reasons on an average Jats are not good enough to compete with refugees, brahmins,kayasthas, baniyas in job market. I am not saying that all refugess are intellectual or all jats are dumb in comparision of refugees. Jats can compete with rajputs, yadavs , gujjars etc but they still fall behind from refugees, brahmins, baniyas and kayasthas
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