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swaich said:
Burdak ji, interesting finding about the goddess Mawli.

In my opinion, common goddesses may or may not point towards common origins. Sometimes when communities/ethnicity intermingle or one is conquered by the other, certain deities cross over or gain new worshipers.
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Jaspreet Ji,

I too think in this direction but Bastar and Nagaur are very far off. It means Nagavanshi Rulers of Nagaur had their area of operation up to Bastar district.

I tried to find if there is any Jat connection? We have compiled some Nagavanshi Inscriptional information from Bastar on Jatland. I quote one:

Jatanpal Stone Inscription of Saka Year 1140 (A.D. 1218)

Source - Epigraphia Indica Vol. X (1909-10): A S I, Edited by Sten Konow, Ph.D.,p.40

(Deposited at Jagdalpur)

Jatanpal (जटनपाल) is a village 40 miles from Dantewara in the Bastar State. The inscription records the grant of land by one Kama Nayaka, a subordinate of a chief named Somaraju, under Maharaja Narasimhadeva, in the Saka year 1140, or A. D. 1218. In this year there was an eclipse of the sun and the month of Jyeshtha was intercalary. So it was doubly meritorious to make a gift in that year. Narasirhhadeva of this inscription must certainly be the same as that of Dantewara pillar inscription.

Jatanpal is situated to the north of the Indravati and is inscribed in the Nagari character on a slab measuring 4' x 1' 4-1/2" almost the whole of which is covered with big letters averaging 2". There are altogether 18 lines. Between lines 16 and 17 the imprecatory figures of a pig followed by an ass are inserted. On the top of the inscription there are the figures of the sun and the moon together with small circles in a row apparently representing the remaining 7 planets. The meaning of these is clear. The top figures denote that the grant is to last as long as the navagrahas or the 9 planets endure, while the bottom figures represent a curse on the transgressor of the gift declaring his father an ass and the mother a pig. The language is corrupt Sanskrit prose. The object is to record a grant of land made by one Kama Nayaka to one Bāhilā Pande. Kama Nayaka appears to be a subordinate of a chief named Somaraja under Maharaja Narasimhadeva. The mention of the mother Gangadevi after the king's name is not clear. The date given is the Saka year 1140 without specifying any other details. It corresponds to 1218 A.D. In this year there was an eclipse of the sun and the month, of Jyeshtha was intercalary. So it was doubly meritorious to make a gift in that year.

Narasimhadeva apparently belonged to the Nagavansa dynasty. Some other longer inscriptions of this king have also been found in the Bastar State. Before these are published it will be premature to make any remarks about him.

English translation of Jatanpal Stone Inscription of Saka Year 1140

LL 1-10: Hail ! (while) the illustrious Maharaja-Narasimhadeva-Rao (is ruling) (and) Gangadevi (i.) the mother (and) somaraja (is) the Mandalika, Kama Nayaka gave land, the recipients being Bahila Pande, Medani Pande, Deva-Nayaka, Jamu Sahu, Ghika Sethi and Somai - thee (are) the protectors (of this grant).

LL. 11-15. The killing of a Brahmana, [the killing] of a cow, parricide, the killing of children these are the sins of which [one] who resumes his land shall be guilty. He who resumes the grant given by himself or another is born a worm in hell and (grovels there) for sixty thousand years.

L. 16. The Saka (year) 1140 in figures.

LL. 17-18. He who despoils the land has an ass for (his) father (and) a pig for (his) mother.

You may see Sanskrit text on Jatland at - [Wiki]Jatanpal[/Wiki]

The name of place Jatanpal seems interesting. The king bears title - Rao !. Is it same as Rao clan of Jats ? Naveen Rao Ji may kindly help.

It bears some curious last lines !
 
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नादिरशाह को जाट-सिक्खों के बारे में दिया गया परिचय

नादिरशाह ने लाहौर के सूबेदार से पूछा था कि काबुल से लेकर दिल्ली तक मेरा किसी ने सामना नहीं किया, किन्तु ये लोग कौन हैं जिन्होंने छापा मार करके मेरे धन-माल को लूट लिया और फौज को हानि पहुंचाई ?

इसके जवाब में जाट-सिक्खों के बारे में सूबेदार-लाहौर ने नादिरशाह को यह जवाब दिया कि -

"जहांपनाह! यह एक विचित्र, जबरदस्त कौम है, जिसका इस समय न तो कोई स्थायी घर है और न कोई मुकाम। यदि रात्रि को यहां है, तो दिन को एक सौ कोस दूर पर इनका पता चलता है। जंगल के फल-फूल और साग-पात आजकल इनकी खुराक है। घोड़ों की पीठ ही इनकी चारपाई है। लड़कर मरने-मारने के लिए बहुत ही प्रेमी हैं। शीत, धूप और वर्षा उनके लिये सब समान है। सिर पर साफा, गले में चोला, कमर में जांघिया इनकी पोशाक है। मुसलमानों के दिली दुश्मन हैं। उनका एक-एक मनुष्य पचास-पचास पर भारी होता है। मृत्यु का तो उनको जरा भी भय नहीं है। वे अपने शरीर के जख्मों की मरहमपट्टी नहीं करते, उनके जख्म गेंडे पशु की तरह अपने आप अच्छे हो जाते हैं। हमारे बहुत से मनुष्य इनके हाथों से मर चुके हैं, परन्तु ये लोग काबू में नहीं होते। मजहब इनका हिन्दू व मुसलमान दोनों से निराला है। परस्पर बहुत ही इत्तिफाक रखते हैं। भूख या प्यास की कुछ भी परवाह नहीं करते। चाहे उपवासों पर उपवास बीत जाएं, परन्तु लड़ने से मरने तक भी नहीं हटते। इस कौम ने हमारा तो नाक में दम कर रखा है।" ([Wiki]जाट इतिहास:ठाकुर देशराज[/Wiki], पृष्ठ-247)
 
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Moar said:
I. Sara has suggests that the very name "Sikh" is derived from the ancient term, "Saka".[SUP][1][/SUP][SUP][2][/SUP]
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Wrong! The word 'Sikh' (सिख) means "disciple" (of Guru). It is derived from Sanskrit word शिष्य. Foreign historians - Iranians or Europeans or others - who did not have a taste of Indian languages, have made numerous such mistakes in their writings.

.
 
dndeswal said:
Wrong! The word 'Sikh' (सिख) means "disciple" (of Guru). It is derived from Sanskrit word शिष्य. Foreign historians - Iranians or Europeans or others - who did not have a taste of Indian languages, have made numerous such mistakes in their writings.D.
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Deswalji,

Hundred per cent correct. The word Sikh has nothing to do with 'SAKA.'

Thanks and regards.
 
Here is the Hindi dictionary meaning: सिख see सीख = counsel , top crest , a pupil, a follower of Guru Nanak
सीख = counsel, advice, instruction see शिक्षा
 
lrburdak said:
Origin of Sikh from Saka is wrongly derived as already stated by Rajpal ji and Deswal ji
lrburdak said:
Here is the Hindi dictionary meaning: सिख see सीख = counsel , top crest , a pupil, a follower of Guru Nanak
सीख = counsel, advice, instruction see शिक्षा
DrRajpalSingh said:
Deswalji,

Hundred per cent correct. The word Sikh has nothing to do with 'SAKA.'

Thanks and regards.
dndeswal said:
Wrong! The word 'Sikh' (सिख) means "disciple" (of Guru). It is derived from Sanskrit word शिष्य. Foreign historians - Iranians or Europeans or others - who did not have a taste of Indian languages, have made numerous such mistakes in their writings.

.
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GetlemEn, I respectfully disagree with You. I have some significantly supporting facts in My arsenal, but I shall first brush-them-up before I get involved in a serious debate over this one. It's better to first organise the content I have in mind.

I trust Sara because the Canadian barrister and solicitor has pointed out ( or advocated !! ) that the recent excavations in the Ukraine and Crimea provide visible links of Jats and Scythians.

Sara seems to have done a wonderful job over the issue !!

Anyways, I look forward to soon introduce My notes over the issue; and I AM asking for some time because I have My exams "Coming Soon" .... lOl :)
 
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सिख जाट रानी बीबी साहिबा का साहस

1794 ई० के आरम्भ में मरहठों की एक बड़ी भारी सेना लछमनराव और अन्टाराव के साथ पंजाब की तरफ लूटमार करने के लिए आ पहुंची। जींद और कैथल आदि के रईसों ने भेंट देकर मरहठों की अधीनता स्वीकार कर ली, लेकिन बीबी साहबकुंवरि को यह बात अपनी मान-मर्यादा के विरुद्ध जान पड़ी और उन्होंने मरहठों से युद्ध की तैयारी कर दी। राजगढ़ के मैदान में युद्ध हुआ। मरहठों की सेना अधिक थी, इसलिए पटियाले की सेना के पांव न जम सके। बीबी साहिबा यह देख रथ से नीचे आ गई और फौज के सामंतों को सम्बोधन कर कहा -

“यदि आप लोग कायर हैं अथवा आपको प्राण प्यारे हैं और मान-मर्यादा का कुछ भी ख्याल नहीं तो आप भाग जा सकते हैं। पर मैं प्राण रहते समरक्षेत्र से हटने वाली नहीं। वीर क्षत्राणियों ने इसी दिन के लिए आपको जना था। आप चाहें तो उनके दूध को लज्जित कर सकते हैं। अपमान की हजार वर्ष की जिन्दगी से मान की एक दिन की जिन्दगी कहीं अधिक अच्छी है। एक स्त्री को जो कि राजघराने, साथ ही आपके परिवार की भी है, मैदान में अकेली छोड़कर संसार के सामने मुंह दिखाने की हिम्मत कर सकते हैं तो आप लोग अविलम्ब मैदान छोड़कर भाग जायें!”

बीबी साहिबा के उपर्युक्त ओजस्वी भाषण ने सेना में और सेनापतियों में मर मिटने की लगन पैदा कर दी - “न दैन्यं न पलायनम्” के सिद्धान्त के अनुसार उन्होंने मरहठों की सेना पर धावा कर दिया। “हिम्मते मर्दा मददे खुदा” कहावत के अनुसार बीबी साहिबा की विजय हुई और मरहठे मैदान छोड़कर भाग खड़े हुए!

सन्दर्भ : [Wiki]जाट इतिहास:ठाकुर देशराज [/Wiki], पृष्ठ-414
 
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Moar said:
GetlemEn, I respectfully disagree with You. I have some significantly supporting facts in My arsenal, but I shall first brush-them-up before I get involved in a serious debate over this one. It's better to first organise the content I have in mind.

I trust Sara because the Canadian barrister and solicitor has pointed out ( or advocated !! ) that the recent excavations in the Ukraine and Crimea provide visible links of Jats and Scythians.

Sara seems to have done a wonderful job over the issue !!

Anyways, I look forward to soon introduce My notes over the issue; and I AM asking for some time because I have My exams "Coming Soon" .... lOl :)
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Welcome your challenge to disprove our notion on the issue of the origin of the word 'Sikh'.

Keep it up and come out with your latest version at your convenience please.

Best wishes for your success in University Examinations.
 
Scythians had political control over Ancient India as far back as 5th century B.C.

Herodotus reveals that the Scythians as far back as the 5th century B.C. had political control over Central Asia and the northern subcontinent up to the river Ganges. Later Indo-Scythic clans and dynasties (e.g. Mauryas, Rajputs) extended their control to other tracts of the northern subcontinent. The largest Saka imperial dynasties of Sakasthan include the Satraps (204 BC to 78 AD), Kushanas (50 AD - 380), Virkas (420 AD - 640) while others like the Mauryas (324 - 232 BC) and Dharan-Guptas (320 AD - 515) expanded their empires towards the east.



Reference : Origin of the Saka Races - Collapse of the Brahminist Empire (Chapter 3) | by Khshatrapa Gandasa
 
Yashpal Malik
Yashpal Malik is President of All India Jat Reservation Agitation Committee. He has conducted large number of successful meetings and rallies to motivate Jat Community people to demand Reservation in Jobs. We have created a page here - [Wiki]Yashpal Malik[/Wiki]
 
Col. Malleson in his History of the Native States, describing Jats valour and turbulent character says :-

" They were Jats, who in 1026 harassed Mahmud of Gazni in his march from Somnath to Multan and who, in the following year were nearly destroyed by him; they were Jats who in 1398 were encountered and massacred by Tamurlane on his march by Multan to Delhi; and finally they were Jats who disquieted Babur during his advance through the Panjab in 1525."
 
lrburdak said:
Col. Malleson in his History of the Native States, describing Jats valour and turbulent character says :-

" They were Jats, who in 1026 harassed Mahmud of Gazni in his march from Somnath to Multan and who, in the following year were nearly destroyed by him; they were Jats who in 1398 were encountered and massacred by Tamurlane on his march by Multan to Delhi; and finally they were Jats who disquieted Babur during his advance through the Panjab in 1525."
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Burdakji,

To me this entry shows the Jats' love for their motherland and sense of valour and sacrifice before the foreign marauders. Not their turbulent character.

Thanks and regards,
 
Col. Malleson says about Maharaja Ranjit Singh

Col. Malleson in his Native States of India eulogizes the event of treaty of the 17th April 1805 in the following terms :-

" But though the Raja of Bharatpur lost by the line he had taken both money and territory, he gained in prestige and credit. His capital was the only fortress in India from whose walls British troops had been repulsed, and this fact alone exalted him in the opinion of princes and people of India."
 
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Burdak uncle gi Thanks for info.......... Yes mene bhi esaa hi suna h ye donu ek hi h Salasar Balaji se aage Malasi me bhi h temple..... one, The Mahamaya Temple also in Nawal garh


lrburdak said:
Some facts about Mahamaya

I asked about Mawli. I was told by some local persons that Mawli is Mahamaya.

Mahamaya was Wife of Suddhodana, king of Kapilavastu ;Buddha conceived by her.

Skanda Purana tells us that Lord Vishnu remembered goddess Mahamaya and sought her help. Mahamaya appeared instantly and looked at Lord Vishnu with her large eyes.

Shalya Parva, Mahabharata/Book IX Chapter 44 tells us the ceremony for investing Kartikeya with the status of generalissimo (सेनागणाध्यक्ष), the diverse gods, various clans who joined it). Mahamaya is one of them in shloka 39:
39 पालितकं कालिकं च महामायाविनाव उभौ | पूषा च पार्षथौ पराथात कार्त्तिकेयाय भारत

The Mahamaya Temple is there in Ratanpur which is an ancient historical village in Kota tahsil of Bilaspur district in Chhattisgarh.

Rati gave to Pradyumna the Vidya known as Mahamaya, the destroyer of all other Mayas. Pradyumna fought with Samvara and killed him with the help of Mahamaya. Pradyumna (प्रद्युम्न) is Chandravanshi King, son of Krishna by Rukmini.(Bhagavata Purana SKANDHA X. CHAP. 55 )
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lrburdak said:
Col. Malleson in his Native States of India eulogizes the event of treaty of the 17th April 1805 in the following terms :-

" But though the Raja of Bharatpur lost by the line he had taken both money and territory, he gained in prestige and credit. His capital was the only fortress in India from whose walls British troops had been repulsed, and this fact alone exalted him in the opinion of princes and people of India."
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Burdakji,

Good quote for which you deserve congratulations.

But according to contextual reference it pertains to Maharaja Ranjit Singh [not to Maharaja Suraj Mal] under whose command the Jat forces had repulsed the four successive onslaughts of the British on Bharatpur in 1804-05. The echo of these successive failures of General Lord Lake and Governor General Wellessely was heard in the House of the Commons of Britain. To that successful resistance Malleson is referring and the Hero was Maharaja Ranjit Singh.

Thanks
 
DrRajpalSingh said:
Burdakji,

To me this entry shows the Jats' love for their motherland and sense of valour and sacrifice before the foreign marauders. Not their turbulent character.

Thanks and regards,
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Rajpalji the quote is by Col. Malleson whose point of view is bound to differ from our angle.
 
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