HC stops Jat Mahapanchayat

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Omygosh, millions of reply! Obviously can’t read the entire thread but my two cents:

I would go with the opinion: Joyo aur jeene do! Leave them alone!

One simple thing I fail to understand here is: Is it that hard to comprehend that if the two families are happy and if the parents/elders of the groom and the bride had consented then what is the hitch?

Let me understand now. What are the issues?

1. Keeping Jat bloodline pure, is that the issue?

C’mon, you think this can be achieved forcefully or as it was done in this particular case, by getting the poor girl married to the Jat guy by force? What if the girl walks out of the marriage later or God forbid, decides to end her life, just in case? I, for one, would never support this unreasonable use of power, that too against the wish of the families involved.
Ok, hypothetically, lets assume that this will help restoring the “pure” Jat bloodline. But are we sure that it is pure as it is?

Pure bloodline: OK, Only one way: Let all the Jats undergo DNA test to assure that we have the pure lineage already before making lives of the poor people hell. Lets first assure what we have, what if its already “contaminated”! Mahapanchayat: what a farce..:rolleyes: !

# On a sidenote: In fact, at times I feel we should allow our lineage to mix with the others. Until now, what kind of professions Jats were excelling into? Lets talk about the majority and exclude the recent exceptions in modeling and bollywood and other handful of big names. What comes to your mind, honestly? Bus conductors, drivers, lower levels in fauj etc etc. I know many of you will not buy this and would argue for the lack of opportunity, Jats being primarily a farmers’ class! That is true but the conserved genetic pool playing a role to an extent can’t be ruled out either. What say?

2. As some of us had said, maintaining/continuing the Jat culture/traditions is the issue.
But c’mon every culture around the globe is equally good and respect worthy. This will not mean that I don’t like/respect our very own Jat culture, I love it and would try to propagate it in the future generations but not at the cost of someone’s life/happiness. Who are we to ask someone to make sacrifices, who gave us the power to do that, we all have equal liberty to take our own decisions regarding life. If you wanna sacrifice, you are most welcome, can not be forced on others!

By the way, this appreciation/flaunt for Jat culture is seen more in those Jats who are away from the main jatland, ask the poor villagers who have been there for years and do not see any bleak chance of getting out of there, they don’t have a choice like we handful of “sophisticated jats” have, for them it is the way of life, so I won’t buy this argument if look at the problem globally!

3. If it is the question of Jats’ prestige (since a Jat girl was involved and not the boy) , then it is B******t! What a way to maintain the spurious pride by degrading it even more. We will see how successful these mahapanchayats will be in “controlling” lives of people..:rolleyes: !

Moreover, the bottom line is: issues like marriages, I believe, are very much personal concerning the two individuals and their families. If there are no issues with them why the hell “others” are bothered?
 
Great

This is what I wanted to convey with my previous posts; it is very simple, if the couple is happy, their families are happy then who are we??

On a personal note, I would mind a Jat marrying anyone out of caste or in other words, I might feel uneasy about it. But I will NEVER EVER do anything to harm them or to ruin their happiness.

There are so many other social issues to ponder about, so my advice for so called "caretakers (undertakers!!)" of JAT kingdom:

"Take a shower, have a beer ( if you drink ), watch a movie and enjoy"
"Mauj lo, roj lo, na mile to khoj lo:D "

over and out!!
Ajay


poonam said:
Omygosh, millions of reply! Obviously can’t read the entire thread but my two cents:

I would go with the opinion: Joyo aur jeene do! Leave them alone!

One simple thing I fail to understand here is: Is it that hard to comprehend that if the two families are happy and if the parents/elders of the groom and the bride had consented then what is the hitch?

Let me understand now. What are the issues?

1. Keeping Jat bloodline pure, is that the issue?

C’mon, you think this can be achieved forcefully or as it was done in this particular case, by getting the poor girl married to the Jat guy by force? What if the girl walks out of the marriage later or God forbid, decides to end her life, just in case? I, for one, would never support this unreasonable use of power, that too against the wish of the families involved.
Ok, hypothetically, lets assume that this will help restoring the “pure” Jat bloodline. But are we sure that it is pure as it is?

Pure bloodline: OK, Only one way: Let all the Jats undergo DNA test to assure that we have the pure lineage already before making lives of the poor people hell. Lets first assure what we have, what if its already “contaminated”! Mahapanchayat: what a farce..:rolleyes: !

# On a sidenote: In fact, at times I feel we should allow our lineage to mix with the others. Until now, what kind of professions Jats were excelling into? Lets talk about the majority and exclude the recent exceptions in modeling and bollywood and other handful of big names. What comes to your mind, honestly? Bus conductors, drivers, lower levels in fauj etc etc. I know many of you will not buy this and would argue for the lack of opportunity, Jats being primarily a farmers’ class! That is true but the conserved genetic pool playing a role to an extent can’t be ruled out either. What say?

2. As some of us had said, maintaining/continuing the Jat culture/traditions is the issue.
But c’mon every culture around the globe is equally good and respect worthy. This will not mean that I don’t like/respect our very own Jat culture, I love it and would try to propagate it in the future generations but not at the cost of someone’s life/happiness. Who are we to ask someone to make sacrifices, who gave us the power to do that, we all have equal liberty to take our own decisions regarding life. If you wanna sacrifice, you are most welcome, can not be forced on others!

By the way, this appreciation/flaunt for Jat culture is seen more in those Jats who are away from the main jatland, ask the poor villagers who have been there for years and do not see any bleak chance of getting out of there, they don’t have a choice like we handful of “sophisticated jats” have, for them it is the way of life, so I won’t buy this argument if look at the problem globally!

3. If it is the question of Jats’ prestige (since a Jat girl was involved and not the boy) , then it is B******t! What a way to maintain the spurious pride by degrading it even more. We will see how successful these mahapanchayats will be in “controlling” lives of people..:rolleyes: !

Moreover, the bottom line is: issues like marriages, I believe, are very much personal concerning the two individuals and their families. If there are no issues with them why the hell “others” are bothered?
 
Dear all,

let me request 2 things here.

Firstly please dont take debates personal, and , if at all u get sucked into that please do it by messaging privately.

Secondly the josh shown by people here seems to be only on the paper. If u seriously have concern about the community, its purity and blah blah blah. There are better ways of executing it. The series of request regarding dedicating time, efforts and money for JANJAGRITI has been lukewarm.
If each one of us take up One village boy and monitor his progress, and take responsibility for maulding him into a good human being. I think, that would be much better then writing a full volume of ur concern and sincerity towards community, here on this forum.

The idea behind Janjagriti was somewhat loosely like that and i would request members to devote their time there and make themselves available whenever they can.

Regards,
 
[...without really having read any of the posts...but extrapolating
on the likely direction of the debate based on the subject and the numerous
responses to this thread...here is another smart arse with an opinion...] :D :eek:

On the face of it, *most* of us here "jo do-char aksar padh ke
apne aap ne ghane shayane la baithen saen" would go the "jiyo aur
jeene do"..."Miya beewi raazi toh kya kareega kaazi" route. And given the
oooh-soooo many "haaye raam" pretty non-Jat babes that I've got to see
in my travels I would gladly support this camp of enlightened Jatland thinkers.
[The sheer brain power here humbles me.] :p

Having said that I'd still support the Jat Mahapanchayat for a couple
of reasons:

1) It is my belief that these Panchayats are still fairly true representatives
of our Jat populace. And it is my belief that the Jat populace still very
strongly thinks on the lines of the decisions being made by these panchayats.
In that sense the decisions are pretty much adhering to the dominant Jat
mindset. And I believe that is the larger purpose of these Panchayats.
i.e. To reflect the will of Jats. So I think it would be unfair to blame
the Panchayats here. If anything you can blame the larger Jat populace
(in which case...good luck!).

2) The second reason is that, based on my rather scant historical
knowledge, the Panchayats have since the time of Mughals and earlier
stood for Jat independence from outside authority and interference. It has
been a way for us to say that yes we do coexist but we live by our own
rules. ie. A sort of tribal live and let live organisation. A way of saying:
"You don't mess with us and we won't mess with you."

For right or wrong, I believe in the strength of this setup that allows us
to govern our own social mores without outside interference (for
all practical purposes). In that sense I believe that such outside
interference (as by the High Courts) are undermining the independence of
Jats that we so love.

Therefore, I support the Mahapanchayat. I do not want to undermine
them. I may not agree with their decisions, but as long as I am a minority
opinion and the Mahapanchayat's decisions are adhereing to the majority
Jat will then I think they are serving their purpose.

If we want change, change the will of the majority Jat populace. Simple.
 
prashantacmet said:
aap sab karpya Gusse main mat aawo......... RAATHI BHai.........., RITU BObbo.............. kirpya aapna GUSSA SHANT kar lo.................. Bas mujhe ek Baat bata do.......... agar hum padhe likhe logo ko Caste system pe believe nahi karna chaiye......... Sab ek hai......... TO yeh JATLAND kyoun.............. kyoun haamne History section start kiya hai........ki Jaat Mahan hai............ Kyom haam UK,USA , GERMANY mai rehte hue bhi sochte hai........ ki haam ROHTAK, SONEPAT.......ke JAAT hai........ kyon haamne JAtland join ki hai.............kyon hamare Gharwaale hamari SHAADI aapni ki caste main karna chahte hai......... kyon haam riste ke liye pehle kissi CHAMAR ke yaha nahi Jaate.......... ?

Prashant Bhai, toipc ko fir se padh. Koi yah nahi kah raha ki intercaste marriage karo.. Bat simple si hai. Ek Jat Larkee ne ek Harijan larke se shadi ki aur Jatton ne panchayat bula li. Kiya hume kisi ke personal mamle me dhakal deni chahiye? Shadi to wo kar chukee thee...jo hona thaa wo sab ho gaya...ho sakta hai wo pregnant bhi ho ... Wo sab hone ke bawajood kiya hum jatton ko unkee shadi todnee chaiye ? Baat bas itnee si hai... Shadi byaah personal maamle hain aur 99% Jats Jatton me hi Shadi karte hain...ek do cases aise hain jahan par intercaste shadiya ho jatee hain kisi bhi karna se aur jin par maa baap ka bhi control nahi hotaa.. Maa baap ko majboori me haan me haan milaani partee hai..

RK^2
 
raj_rathee said:
[...without really having read any of the posts...but extrapolating
on the likely direction of the debate based on the subject and the numerous
responses to this thread...here is another smart arse with an opinion...] :D :eek:

On the face of it, *most* of us here "jo do-char aksar padh ke
apne aap ne ghane shayane la baithen saen" would go the "jiyo aur
jeene do"..."Miya beewi raazi toh kya kareega kaazi" route. And given the
oooh-soooo many "haaye raam" pretty non-Jat babes that I've got to see
in my travels I would gladly support this camp of enlightened Jatland thinkers.
[The sheer brain power here humbles me.] :p

Having said that I'd still support the Jat Mahapanchayat for a couple
of reasons:

1) It is my belief that these Panchayats are still fairly true representatives
of our Jat populace. And it is my belief that the Jat populace still very
strongly thinks on the lines of the decisions being made by these panchayats.
In that sense the decisions are pretty much adhering to the dominant Jat
mindset. And I believe that is the larger purpose of these Panchayats.
i.e. To reflect the will of Jats. So I think it would be unfair to blame
the Panchayats here. If anything you can blame the larger Jat populace
(in which case...good luck!).

2) The second reason is that, based on my rather scant historical
knowledge, the Panchayats have since the time of Mughals and earlier
stood for Jat independence from outside authority and interference. It has
been a way for us to say that yes we do coexist but we live by our own
rules. ie. A sort of tribal live and let live organisation. A way of saying:
"You don't mess with us and we won't mess with you."

For right or wrong, I believe in the strength of this setup that allows us
to govern our own social mores without outside interference (for
all practical purposes). In that sense I believe that such outside
interference (as by the High Courts) are undermining the independence of
Jats that we so love.

Therefore, I support the Mahapanchayat. I do not want to undermine
them. I may not agree with their decisions, but as long as I am a minority
opinion and the Mahapanchayat's decisions are adhereing to the majority
Jat will then I think they are serving their purpose.

If we want change, change the will of the majority Jat populace. Simple.

Even we support Rathee Sahab.. Bas matbhed jara saa hai ki kiya Panchayat ko personal issues me interfere karna chahiye? Shadi Byaah bilkul personal matter hai aur community ko usme interfere nahi karna chahiye...haan agar wo like nahi karte to family ka socially alag kar sakte hain..baas itnee si baat hai... aur sunaiye, bade dinon baad yeh Muchchon wali Tasveer lekar aaye ho ...

RK^2
 
Double standards

How many Jatlanders are/may be(in future) married in other caste??
the analysis of result will be jatlanders resultant opinion.

I am/will NOT be in List.
 
shooda said:
How many Jatlanders are/may be(in future) married in other caste??
the analysis of result will be jatlanders resultant opinion.

I am/will NOT be in List.

How can you expect answers to such question? Rarely any Jat will marry outside caste if its arranged marriage. How can someone answer about love marriage...it does not happen by design...it just happens...these are aberrations and cannot be predicted.

RK^2
 
Dont know why some people have problem with anyone going Abroad? Its same way like villagers are upset with URBANISED JATS N URBANISED JATS ARE UPSET WITH WESTERNISED JATS....aur jab mouka milega to sab daudd laga dengey...tabhi tak frustration nikal rahi hai westernised jats ke liye:)
 
aaj paad ke kitna dukh ho raha hai,,,,sab yahan pe sarpanch baan re see,,,but why dont u guys think ki uss ladki ne kuch sooch kar hi deccission liya hoga,,,,,,maine khud kahati hoo ki jo izzat apani caste maine hai woh kissi aur caste maine nahin,,,but agar apani caste maine shadi kar ke woh ladki dukhi rahi,,, to uss ki life to aaise he narak se....and if she is happy with tht chamar ,,,let her be,,,she has taken her own decision,,cousulting with her parents,,what has panchyat to do with tht,,,,,,,,i think she is responsible enough ,,,,,,,
 
i totally agree with u deswal ji
if these khaps and maha panchyat start giving there decisions,,,then can sombody tell me tht do u have ur own individuality
spdeshwal said:
Dear Members,

I have a dear friend who incidently was born in Chamar family. He is a highly respected docter in his speciality and a superb human being.He has married with a jat girl and have two beautiful kids. Now i can't imagine my this friend going through all this **** of these khap panchayats like the poor guy in the present case.

To me, this act of so called mahapachayat is most inhuman and cowardice. Most deplorable act! These panchaytees are losers and suffering from sick mentality.

Sampuran bhai, perhaps you did not read the news report in the begining of the thread. The division bench of high court was headed by a jat justice K.S Grewal. So there is no reason for your apprehention that no civil court understand the general jat social traditions.

cheers!
 
rkumar said:
Better would have been to argue your points logically and not calling names to people. Never loose control like this as it won't take too far in life. Whose blood will you call pure genetically in this world? Every caste, race is mixed millions of times and there is nothing like pure. Pure breeds got extinct long back as they could not sustain environmental assaults. Kings married almost from any caste or religion. If we want our girls to marry only Jats, better we improve our educational standards at every level; else we will hear such stories more often. Why can't well-meaning guys like you and others educate young Jat boys and motivate them to be better educated so that we have a large pool of prospective grooms in our community.

RK^2

I apologise for my that very comment. I had no intentions to point out any personal comment on anyone here.

I do agree with your views sir, its the youth power which can bring the fairest and quickest result not only for the jat community but to the whole nation and the other communities as well.

ty
 
sunitahooda said:
Hmmmm.....bhadans to nikal hi gayi ab:)

Sister, everybody in this world have different thinking. I might sound a bit orthodox but m not an extremist. Kayee logga ne aade apni bhadas kaadhi hai (including me). Even some of my posts has been deleted. Some of the members here took me wrong.... oh mein pher wahe kahani le ke baith gaya.
Sereously, its none of anyone's bussiness to interfare in anyone's life.


"Whenever u bow against anyone, make sure this isnt due to scareness"

-anonymus
 
Thats what i meant to say....i'myself am orthodox to the core and even if i was Modernised....i couldn't force anyone to marry someone against their choice:)
yashmalik said:
Sister, everybody in this world have different thinking. I might sound a bit orthodox but m not an extremist. Kayee logga ne aade apni bhadas kaadhi hai (including me). Even some of my posts has been deleted. Some of the members here took me wrong.... oh mein pher wahe kahani le ke baith gaya.
Sereously, its none of anyone's bussiness to interfare in anyone's life.


"Whenever u bow against anyone, make sure this isnt due to scareness"

-anonymus
 
sir ye khabar bhi pad li aur ye bhi samajh me aagay ak ab os bechari ki durgat hone ali h.aur jo log ye khabar sun k raaji horahe h na thode dino m onhe dusri khabar bhi mil ege ek va chori mar gayi.jab ji bhar k rajee ho lege.dhikkar h aiise soch p jiske aage ek insaan ke jeevan ka kuch mol nahi.



rkumar said:
here is the latest on the subject...

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2006/20060613/main4.htm

Girl is remarried in the jat caste now... I am sure people won't leave them in peace even now...

RK^2
 
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