Selling Haryana to outsiders

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solankimk said:
Seema agreed fully with you but it is little different from the thread anyway confirm few point
1. he had car or not?
2. are they going to come congested area near to their residence with few hundred meter
Click to expand...
it might be lil diverted from the thread, but was directly integrating to your helipad story in TOI...you again missed my point that those who have splurging habbits, they will spurge even if their lands are not sold...they will borrow even...the fault lies in mind not in a selling lands and getting money...

1. nopes they didn't have any car
2. they are a middle class family, living in 160 yards house...(for your answers, though it has nothing to do with the thread, as neither they had land nor they sold anything...moreover those whose lands are getting sold, their killas are getting sold not the houses...infact after selling lands, they are building better houses)

and educating their kids in better schools and colleges, thankfully the kids don't have to work in laamnis in their exams duration...and they are doing well what they used to do in farming times...that's the way to the future of india...educated and a modern india...
 
seemasindhu said:
it might be lil diverted from the thread, but was directly integrating to your helipad story in TOI...you again missed my point that those who have splurging habbits, they will spurge even if their lands are not sold...they will borrow even...the fault lies in mind not in a selling lands and getting money...

1. nopes they didn't have any car
2. they are a middle class family, living in 160 yards house...(for your answers, though it has nothing to do with the thread, as neither they had land nor they sold anything...moreover those whose lands are getting sold, their killas are getting sold not the houses...infact after selling lands, they are building better houses)

and educating their kids in better schools and colleges, thankfully the kids don't have to work in laamnis in their exams duration...and they are doing well what they used to do in farming times...that's the way to the future of india...educated and a modern india...
Click to expand...
Well said...Its correct...
 
seemasindhu said:
i know buddy...but you are again and again neglecting my point (intentionally/unintentionally), which is that such pompous people even if they don't have money, will splurge in any case...

i have seen people who don't have lands and neither they have sold anything, yet they will borrow money and splurge on unnecessary things...

i remember i had gone to a collegemate's wedding, and i was awstruck looking at the reception extravanza...a year later, i got to meet the guy riding his pregnant wife on bike in market...and i was thinking inside that if he had bought a car rather wasting so much of money on feeding 1000s of people in such splendid pandaal, his wife won't be facing this difficulty on riding on bike adjusting her baby bump...

so buddy, those who don't have brain will splurge in any case...keep aside land selling
Click to expand...

The % of people spending without reason is very less and it is going to exponentially rise once more people have more [Extra] money with them...

Also not diverting from the topic...selling Haryana/land to outsiders...is not at all appropriate...I am not against develpoment...lakin not on behalf of innocent farmers...

Why dont govt provide them with better infrastructure, better irrigation facilities, better education and health opportunities...
and for that matter why dont Govt provide them barren land...so that area also develops..
 
Selling off Haryana/Jat belt to outsiders

Once again, so far it has been an interesting discussion on the pros and cons of this one-sided development taking place in Haryana. In fact, would like to extend my thanks to Mukesh Solanki ji for endorsing my viewpoint.

I am sure those against the idea behind this thread must also be having the agenda of upliftment of the community close to their hearts. We know the destination, its just a matter of the route we take to reach there.

Jats have been an open and welcoming community embracing with open arms all the migrants from times in the distant past till now. The outcome of which has been that these communities have prospered alongside each other giving breathing space to each other. However, since the last 5-10 years this influx of outsiders has grown to such an extent that the original inhabitants are turning into a minority. I see so many threads where Jats from Haryana/Western UP/Rajasthan residing in some other state feel the need to be associated with their communities (please read this as roots) in some form or the other. Have we thought why does this happen - because they are a minority there - there are not many people who speak their language - share the same culture - have the relations residing nearby.

The only concern that comes to mind is - with so much of migration from outside taking place and the community not being present in a consistent and concentrated form - we as a community are bound to feel in our very own state/s the way we feel when we are in Bihar, W. Bengal etc., longing to return to our familiar surroundings and people. But a stage will come when we will have no where to return to because those familiar surroundings and people would have all changed by then.

The intention is not to paint a grim picture of the future of the community but to awaken everyone to the consequences of the impending crisis.

Lets take the concepts of modernity and development beyond the clothes we wear and the food we eat. We are proud to be Indians and we are concerned about the challenges being faced by our country. But as they say - Charity begins at home. First set your house in order before you can talk about the evils outside.

Give part of your today for your community's tomorrow. This contribution can be in any form - contribute by just doing your bit........
 
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selling Haryana

it has been a very interesting as well as concerning topic for not only jats from haryana but jats from up, rj and delhi.
I have read most of the previous threads and most of the responses are very informative and really make a healthy debate.
some of our friends debating over safeguarding the rights of the land for jats. my question for them is
could you please tell me how much is the average net income from agriculture in Haryana. If we consider other factors like increasing costs, inflation, overall growth of economy in harayan and all over India, we can easily conclude that agricultural income is not sifficient even for the basic survival today in 2007. and we are talking about future, 30-40 years from now. its time for change. change in peoples mentality, change in our life style and most important change in our EDUCATION SYSTEM. the parameters of success have changed now.We are talking about safeguarding the rights of land for jats. How many Jats fom the NCR and new delhi area, who sold thier lands to industrialists and developers and made Crores, have used their money wisely. I still remember few years ago, when the sectors were developed in gurgaon, that EVERY JAT FROM THESE AREAS HAD A SCORPIO OR TATA SAFARI. Same people who till then were struggling to even afford a bike. I am sure most of you folks are aware of that issue. Only a handful of Jats from those were able to invest that money and most of them JUST BLEW IT.
Who is to blame for that?
Nobody but us only.
the political system and government is corrupt in not only Haryana but everywhere on earth. So its time for all the Jats to take the matters in their own hands and act. its time for change. those who do not want to change will really find it difficult to make it in the coming years.

"ZAMEEN KI AKAD" has been one of the reasons so far for lack of development in Jats. THOSE OF US WHO HAVE COME OUT OF THIS AKAD, ARE SUCCESSFUL , AND THE REMAINING WILL SUCCEED ONLY WHEN THEY COME OOUT OF THIS ZAMEEN KI AKAD.
For that I believe education is very important. the education to keep pace with the changing technology. its the INTERNET AGE. and I m sure most of the Jats are very smart and intelligent( otherwise they won't use cell phone while working in the fields)
Comparing JATS with other communities, we are very hard working, smart, intelligent and generous. we only need to follow the right direction
 
Selling off Haryana/ Jat belt to outsiders

Though there have been so many responses to this thread making up a healthy discussion, it seems most of us on this thread have not got the central message of this thread.

The message the author would like to bring out is that safeguarding land rights is not a substitite to good education and progressive outlook. We as a community need good education and a responsive government. But the question remains - out of all things in the world, is development only possible through selling land. Can't the son of a farmer become a doctor, engineer or a software professional without selling his land. In which book of wisdom is it written that Land has to be sold for development. Why can't we have on the same land, world class schools in our state with faculty from outside India with seats reserved for the underpriviliged children of the state/community instead of those swanky malls. By doing this we can ensure that we give a level playing field to these tiny tots so that when they face the big bad world outside they are well equipped to beat the competition given by a bengali or a tamilian whizkid (with all due respect to the acknowledged intellect of these people).

The only thing that the author stresses on is that learn, prosper and grow but selling land for that is not a solution, but a problem in the making which we are blissfully ignoring in our comfortable present and which is like wasting precious water while approaching a mirage in a desert.

We say all the governments in the world are corrupt. Where is it written again that if somebody is accepting a wrong without resistance, we also have to accept it. We do all things modern because somebody else does it. Why cannot we have thought leadership and do something which others may not be doing but if you do it, it benefits your community/state. A good example of the thought leadership and being a ME-TOO is the trend of using packaged water. We Indians blindly aped the west in using packaged mineral water. The uses were really good - quality drinking water anytime and anywhere. Then the Americans realised that the use of polypet bottles for packaged drinking water harms the environment and have discouraged its use. We Indians again have realised after the Americans have, that it is harmful to use packaged stuff and have started following them in this trend.

For once, why cannot we be original and think on our own two feet what is good and bad for us instead of just thinking that They (other states) have corrupt governments and so we will also have to live with it.

We need to for our own sake realise the power of WE, WE THE PEOPLE. We can make mountains move if we all get together and make a concerted effort. There are many examples of this collective might of people - creation of Haryana, Uttarakhand etc.

-----------------------------------
The woods are lovely, dark and deep,
But I have promises to keep,
And miles to go before I sleep,
And miles to go before I sleep.
 
Development of Haryana

Kadian ji I fully agree with what your point. If we could have that kind of development, then we would be really having a sustainable development of not only jats but the whole Haryana. But how can get the message sent across the people and make them realiseit importance. that's a big challenge.
I m not saying that it is impossible but who is going to take the responsibility.
We all have been thrown in a kind of rat race that hardly we are left with any time to think about our society. and if some people dare to take initiative there are hundreds of other people waiting sippress such people.
Why does India has such a high growth rate? and a high growth rate should be a symbol of growth of people, prosperity and overall a healthy economy. Why are struggling with the same issues we struggled 30 or 40 years ago.
Do you still think reservation system can be good for any society?
there are hundreds of issues that we are facing in Haryana( as well as whole India)
In my point as you said QUALITY EDUCATION seems to be strongest weapon to deal with all these issues.
Its hightime that we should have a better education system which is sustainable. that would lead to overall change in peoples perspective and would ultimately lead to development in the area.
 
aha

ur right! If the government uses up the land of harayana to build malls and offices , what will happen to the cultural heritage of harayana and others lands like punjab gujrat and so on!
 
hISTORY AND CULTURE IS IMPORTANT

Dear Saarthak Beta very wise thought.

I agree with you our history and culture is important.
wish you and your family a very happy new year 2008.
we are in Lexington KY. You are welcome to visit us.
God bless you happiness and success.
 
Land is impotant for farmers

I fully agree with Sunil Kadian.
Land is very important for Farmers.
Learn lesson what happened to Delhi Jats in 1940-50-60-70-80.
Few generations lost in Daru and Drugs
This is not any government job to rob farmers and give land to Punjipati as a present.
NO TO SEZ IN HARYANA OR ANY WHERE ATLEAST IN JATHEARTLAND- UP- HARYANA- RAJAASTHAN
AND PUNJAB
No farmer should sale the land on any price.
If some one want to buy land- sale on 99 years leese.
No farmer should sale land on price as freehold.
The government is acting like a estate agent.
The rate of commission was 10% during one DESHBHAGAT CM time.
He was known as MR 10%
Now the rate is 50% Fifty/Fifty.

The message the author would like to bring out is that safeguarding land rights is not a substitite to good education and progressive outlook. We as a community need good education and a responsive government. But the question remains - out of all things in the world, is development only possible through selling land. Can't the son of a farmer become a doctor, engineer or a software professional without selling his land.
 
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ek jat sarvkhab panchayat hoya karti up mein us ne jatta ke jameen bechan pe bann laa diya tha. ukk jat jameen te bech sake se par choice is
1 aapne ghar mein bechega
2 aapne gaon ne bechega
3 aapne jat ne bechega
4 ..................................

rajputo ki tereh kuch jat bhi mughalo ke pittu ho gaye the up main unhone mughlo ka anusaran kiya aur apni jameen jaydad aiyashi mein bech khani shuru kar di. jab jaake jaton ne ya farman lagu kiya etc etc.
even in canada, usa, aboriginal tribes are given reservation in those universities why not jats are not given reservation in thoe universities which are made on jatland.
sindh was populated, gujrat, maharashtra were all jat lands as about 1300 years back one quasim invaded sindh when all buddhist jats supported him but hardly sufficient traces of jats are found in sindh today similar is fate of delhi and tommorow it will be the fate of all jatland that starts from indus in the west to ganges and chambal in the east.
 
Recent important developments to take lessons from

Four very important events/announcements that highlight the importance of safeguarding our land.

First, Congratulations to the Chief Minister of Goa, Mr. Digambar Kamath in taking on the Central Government head-on on the issue of SEZs by denotifying/cancelling the sanctioned SEZs in his state (though the same is being contested by the Central government obviously due to the monetary gains it would be making by selling land to the land sharks). All credit goes to this CM who has the foresight to look into the pitfalls of having SEZs sprouting up everywhere in his state thereby preventing the resources (including land) of his state from getting into the hands of a few well connected and rich corporate bigwigs including real estate sharks. Credit for this also goes to the people of Goa who looked beyond their comfortable present into the dark implications of wanton concretisation of their lands. Only wish my people including the state politicians could also rise up to the occasion and look into the seemingly not so obvious, but negative consequences of selling off our land to outsiders.

Second, credit also goes to the CM of Bihar in opposing on the ground of selective targetting of Biharis, the Delhi Lieutenant Governor's proposed directive of every person in Delhi mandatorily possessing some documentary identity proof. Though, to challenge or even comment on such directives issued by one state is not the prerogative of any other state's CM, Sh. Nitish Kumar rose to the occasion/challenge by taking up the case of lakhs of Biharis working and residing in Delhi. Despite being scorned for hailing from a backward and feudalistic state, which Bihari's chest would not swell to see their CM coming to their rescue in another state where he does not have any jurisdiction. This move of Id-proof would also affect the migrants from Haryana who might not be having any id-proof issued by the Delhi government, yet there was no similar gesture from any politician from Haryana.

Third, the Gujarat CM, Sh. Narendra Modi exhorting the PM to ensure the well-being of the prosperous Gujarati community in strife torn Kenya which is witnessing civil war like situation on account of friction among various tribes. It is one thing to project its initiatives on well being of its citizens by the state government and quite another to actually work on those projections on ground/in reality.

How many politicians/elected representatives (in the parliament) from Haryana, have raised questions in the interest of its residents in the parliament?? During discussions and debates in the parliament, you get to see and hear elected leaders from almost all states except Haryana raise issues on development/ resource requirement/allocation for their regions. Is our elected representatives' job only to get elected, have a decent government bungalow/flat alloted in Delhi, go to the parliament to sit quietly and mark their attendance and at the end of the five-year term get re-elected? Are they actually our representatives and if so, are our (the state's people's) issues/concerns not their concerns?

Fourth, another major influx of outsiders knocking at the doorsteps of the Jatbelt. Please refer to the recently announced Delhi Government's plan to develop 5 new mega-cities in Delhi (please read this as Delhi's outer jat belt) to accomodate the ever-increasing mass of outsiders (73 Lakhs to be precise). And as has happened in the past, the ignorant residents of Outer Delhi (rural Jatbelt) would gleefully sell their land seeing the sudden rush of easy money in lieu of their land. IF ONLY WE COULD LEARN FROM OUR PAST MISTAKES...

May I request one and all from this esteemed website to educate the people they know in this outer Delhi Jatbelt on the consequences of ignorantly selling their lands while eyeing the easy money against their land. Can we have some retired Lawyers/Judges form a panel to take up the cases of the people who would not want to get their land acquired. It's time we said - Enough is Enough and take collective action to prevent the onslaught of outsiders.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Even if I knew that tomorrow the world would go to pieces,
I would still plant my apple tree.

- Martin Luther
 
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Recent important developments to take lessons from

Four very important events/announcements that highlight the importance of safeguarding our land.

First, Congratulations to the Chief Minister of Goa, Mr. Digambar Kamath in taking on the Central Government head-on on the issue of SEZs by denotifying/cancelling the sanctioned SEZs in his state (though the same is being contested by the Central government obviously due to the monetary gains it would be making by selling land to the land sharks). All credit goes to this CM who has the foresight to look into the pitfalls of having SEZs sprouting up everywhere in his state thereby preventing the resources (including land) of his state from getting into the hands of a few well connected and rich corporate bigwigs including real estate sharks. Credit for this also goes to the people of Goa who looked beyond their comfortable present into the dark implications of wanton concretisation of their lands. Only wish my people including the state politicians could also rise up to the occasion and look into the seemingly not so obvious, but negative consequences of selling off our land to outsiders.

Second, credit also goes to the CM of Bihar in opposing on the ground of selective targetting of Biharis, the Delhi Lieutenant Governor's proposed directive of every person in Delhi mandatorily possessing some documentary identity proof. Though, to challenge or even comment on such directives issued by one state is not the prerogative of any other state's CM, Sh. Nitish Kumar rose to the occasion/challenge by taking up the case of lakhs of Biharis working and residing in Delhi. Despite being scorned for hailing from a backward and feudalistic state, which Bihari's chest would not swell to see their CM coming to their rescue in another state where he does not have any jurisdiction. This move of Id-proof would also affect the migrants from Haryana who might not be having any id-proof issued by the Delhi government, yet there was no similar gesture from any politician from Haryana.

Third, the Gujarat CM, Sh. Narendra Modi exhorting the PM to ensure the well-being of the prosperous Gujarati community in strife torn Kenya which is witnessing civil war like situation on account of friction among various tribes. It is one thing to project its initiatives on well being of its citizens by the state government and quite another to actually work on those projections on ground/in reality.

How many politicians/elected representatives (in the parliament) from Haryana, have raised questions in the interest of its residents in the parliament?? During discussions and debates in the parliament, you get to see and hear elected leaders from almost all states except Haryana raise issues on development/ resource requirement/allocation for their regions. Is our elected representatives' job only to get elected, have a decent government bungalow/flat alloted in Delhi, go to the parliament to sit quietly and mark their attendance and at the end of the five-year term get re-elected? Are they actually our representatives and if so, are our (the state's people's) issues/concerns not their concerns?

Fourth, another major influx of outsiders knocking at the doorsteps of the Jatbelt. Please refer to the recently announced Delhi Government's plan to develop 5 new mega-cities in Delhi (please read this as Delhi's outer jat belt) to accomodate the ever-increasing mass of outsiders (73 Lakhs to be precise). And as has happened in the past, the ignorant residents of Outer Delhi (rural Jatbelt) would gleefully sell their land seeing the sudden rush of easy money in lieu of their land. IF ONLY WE COULD LEARN FROM OUR PAST MISTAKES...

May I request one and all from this esteemed website to educate the people they know in this outer Delhi Jatbelt on the consequences of ignorantly selling their lands while eyeing the easy money against their land. Can we have some retired Lawyers/Judges form a panel to take up the cases of the people who would not want to get their land acquired. It's time we said - Enough is Enough and take collective action to prevent the onslaught of outsiders.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Even if I knew that tomorrow the world would go to pieces,
I would still plant my apple tree.

- Martin Luther
 
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