samajh mei kisi ki kuch na aawe, ulte eb saare ch. sahab ke peeche lath thaa ke bhaaj padenge.
"Should the Govt amend HMA to ban 'same-gotra' marriage"?
- Thread starter virj
- Start date
Who says khaps or people are daf/blind on these problems, Please pick up any of thread on the subject, since I joined the forum, I never supported wrong orders/practices, I am also heading a khap, how can you people generalise. secondly, I do agree with dr chaudhary on most of the points, but his attack seems to be only on khap pardhans/chair occupiers, may i submit following for the considration of Dr and his learned jouree:-
1) Is khap means only pardhan and his committee members or the entire population of that gtra or area as applicable?
2) If khap managers are not doing their duties properly or giving wrong, unwanted directions, why the public is accepting such directions, who executes such directions, can pradhan or even his team execute such illegal orders ?
3) Why cannot such talebani khap leaders be remved, if khap people so desire it is not at all impossible.
4) who is mr perfact in this world, similarly khap people can also go wrong at times, thus instead of blaming a time tested good system of khap, why cannot the mistake or the person responsible, be corrected
5) who calls meeting or gethering of khap people, on whose request & as we all know well that such meetings take place in the oppen, discussions take place in the oppen, people are allowed to put up their openions/points, programmes of such meetings gernelly announced well in advance, why cannot our so called educated, learned, intelligent, urban residents whose routes are still in villages, go to such meetings & object such talebani illegal directions. My dear friends, it is very easy to talk from aircondition offices/houses, please go and takeup some responsibility of the society than your understanding will improve ,you will be able to bring some change & able to improve the system.
In my openion, we the elderly lot are to be blamed more because we failed to transfer good sanskara in new generation, due to varios reasons, but something must be done to improveupon the every day getting bad situation on this front. KHAPS, THEIR THINKING, THEIR STYLE OF WORKING/DECISION MAKING, THEIR KNOWLEDGE OF LAW OF THE LAND, THE ENVIRNMENT, CHANGING NORMS/VALUES OF PEOPLE ETC, NEED DRASTIC IMPROVEMENT. We have to be practical, we have to respect the law of the land, feelings of people & change/modify the traditions if required in the interest of the society. I also feel that except same gotra marriage no other ristrictions hold good.
At the same time our yougesters need to improve their behaviour, knowedge of our customs, traditions, practices, displine of the society including behaviour on this forum for example see immediately above post, keep one feet always on ground otherwise you will fall, as our one of the brother fallen and suffering with pain & diong hai hai hai, above. regards
1) Is khap means only pardhan and his committee members or the entire population of that gtra or area as applicable?
2) If khap managers are not doing their duties properly or giving wrong, unwanted directions, why the public is accepting such directions, who executes such directions, can pradhan or even his team execute such illegal orders ?
3) Why cannot such talebani khap leaders be remved, if khap people so desire it is not at all impossible.
4) who is mr perfact in this world, similarly khap people can also go wrong at times, thus instead of blaming a time tested good system of khap, why cannot the mistake or the person responsible, be corrected
5) who calls meeting or gethering of khap people, on whose request & as we all know well that such meetings take place in the oppen, discussions take place in the oppen, people are allowed to put up their openions/points, programmes of such meetings gernelly announced well in advance, why cannot our so called educated, learned, intelligent, urban residents whose routes are still in villages, go to such meetings & object such talebani illegal directions. My dear friends, it is very easy to talk from aircondition offices/houses, please go and takeup some responsibility of the society than your understanding will improve ,you will be able to bring some change & able to improve the system.
In my openion, we the elderly lot are to be blamed more because we failed to transfer good sanskara in new generation, due to varios reasons, but something must be done to improveupon the every day getting bad situation on this front. KHAPS, THEIR THINKING, THEIR STYLE OF WORKING/DECISION MAKING, THEIR KNOWLEDGE OF LAW OF THE LAND, THE ENVIRNMENT, CHANGING NORMS/VALUES OF PEOPLE ETC, NEED DRASTIC IMPROVEMENT. We have to be practical, we have to respect the law of the land, feelings of people & change/modify the traditions if required in the interest of the society. I also feel that except same gotra marriage no other ristrictions hold good.
At the same time our yougesters need to improve their behaviour, knowedge of our customs, traditions, practices, displine of the society including behaviour on this forum for example see immediately above post, keep one feet always on ground otherwise you will fall, as our one of the brother fallen and suffering with pain & diong hai hai hai, above. regards
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Fatehji, it is not quite clear what part of Dr. Chaudhary's article you agree with, though your disagreements are clear. Can you please list all the points you agree with for our understanding? Thanks & Regards.
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Dear Ssindhu are all non supporters of khap, not rude, such comments by anybody including ravinderjeet, you or me, are taking away the discussions from the main toppics. If possible we all should avoide please. regards
Firstly, my dear sunni, write correct spelling of my name, secondly, if you read carefully my post, it is very very clear about my agreement with Dr chaudhary. What so ever I have not contradicted means agreement. Is it clear mr Dalal
wah bhai wah tanne kah di ar hamne maan li. Tere dhore byah ka card aaya tha uska? khaamkha ki mat udaave.
Bhai Raka, aapne bera pate to mene bhi batayiyo yo kaam kukar hoya kare s
Fatehji, I have corrected the spelling of your name in the above post. I am sorry about that unintentional mistake. What's sunni?
I read your post again. I'd have appreciated if you could have listed all the points you agreed with, but it is okay if you don't want to. Thanks for your reply. Regards.
sunillathwal
New member
Sir, I really want to appreciate your effort in explaining/discussing/ the khaps BUT majority of your audience know 'everything'. Questions raised by you in your last post have been proved futile time in other threads (for the absence of any answer from the concerned 'knowing alls').
I have ABSOLUTELY no DOUBT that most of 'these' gentlemen have never been to a panchayat, never seen how a Khap Panchayat works. Without having any iota of idea about the khap/panchyat's functioning, they label them MEAN (some go to extent of labeling them Talibani, barbaric and murderous).
Many members including myself have raised many genuine questions in support of khap system. There are many threads where these issues were discussed and some brilliant arguments were put forward by members. But none of these 'enlightened प्राणी' have given any rational answers to any of those arguments. They read what they want to read and move ahead.
After a lull of 1-2 days.. same rhetorics about khaps.... in a different thread. One can even do "right click+select all+Search google for ..." their post and find the "source" of their enlightenment... news papers' comments-section.
In a jiffy they put forward the argument of 'a democratic country has no place for khaps' or 'Courts are there for resolving issues' without having any idea of kind of issues folks from villages face or kind of co-dependency prevails in villages even today.
Any argument against khap (Dalit Virdohi, poor Virodhi, women-sexuality oppression [do not shock, many claim this]) holds true for police, courts and conventional panchayats also but only khaps are problematic (my guess is: खाप शब्द में नाम-दोष है; two 'a's or two 'h's in the new khhaap might change the people's perception towards it).
One facet of this problem is --Though these anti- khap elements have no first (or second or third) hand knowledge of khaps (thanks to urban upbringing- their idea of village-life is mostly shaped by electronic and print media, which in turn is again बैंगन of the same बेल)-- they have good writing skills and hence influencing others (otherwise virgins) also with their own distorted version of khaps. On the other hand, those of us who actually know khaps are by default taken as गंवारs. Anything you put in favor of khaps is taken as an irrational blabbering. Poor writing skills (and although true but misplaced logics on our part) does not help us either.
In my opinion, more than rural-folks, these anti-khap wagons of all ilks NEED to open their minds. Writing in english or using fancy word does NOT NECESSARILY means you are right !! Nothing wrong in warming to the idea that Khaps exist even today because they are still relevant to people.
But then: मुझे नहीं लगता की इन 'enlightened भैंसों' के आगे बीन बजाने का कोई फायदा है... आप बेकार में अपना समय व्यतीत कर रहे हैं| These illuminatis are cocksure about everything.
हम्म मुझे अचम्भा नहीं है की आप खाप के अनुगामी हो. क्यूंकि और कोई कारण नहीं दिख रहा इस नकारात्मक दृष्टिकोण का. मन्ने न्यूं तो बता दो की मन्ने थारी कुक्कर भेंस खोल्ली. मैंने तो दोबारा पढ़ा अपना सूत्र और मुझे तो कोई आपत्तिजनक बात दिखाई नहीं दी.. पिछली बार भी हवा में बात गोल कर गए थे और उत्तर दिया नहीं मेरे प्रश्नों का. http://movies.indiainfo.com/100216143236_dharmendra_has_changed_his_name_to_dilawar_khan-859706.html
Is link te mere ib tayi nahi samaj aayi ke caste kukar change hoya kare he. Yo baja sa chod de ek be har daun tariyan samja yo pher baja liye
Ke pher tene bera bhi s tu bole ke s?
अर्रे ले खुश हो जा भाई. जाट ही रहा पर कटवा बन गया... बस.. ईब खुश हो गया... क्या हासिल हो गया... विषय के उपलक्ष में भी कुछ योगदान देदे मेरे यार.
Acha re, isi isi bat kaad ke lave tu inte vishay me ke yogdan hove s bhai. Baki vishay me yogdan de rakha s hamne to panne palat ke dekh le har yo vishay jispe tu vichar kare s yo(thread) suru bhi mene hi kara tha.
Baki me to bas tene itna bataun tha jis chiz ka bera na ho uske bare me bolna jaroori koni hove. Tere to bidhak beth ri he "Bhajo-Bhajo, Khap aaga , Khap aaga" har nu bera koni khap hove k s.
Baki me to bas tene itna bataun tha jis chiz ka bera na ho uske bare me bolna jaroori koni hove. Tere to bidhak beth ri he "Bhajo-Bhajo, Khap aaga , Khap aaga" har nu bera koni khap hove k s.
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rakeshsehrawat
New member
Some see God in stone and for some there is no God apni apni manyataa hai ji. I had never expected people love being called jat but against own traditions and customes and don't know $!-!!T about community.
Let's start with knowing the most basic value a community can stand for- respect for women......
ravinderjeet
New member
Let's start with knowing the most basic value a community can stand for- respect for women......
if a women work against society ,why that women wants respect from the same society.
ravinderjeet
New member
aapke signature se pataa chaltaa hey ki aap akele chalney waale lok ho,samaj naam ki sansthaa se aap jesey lokon kaa koi lenaa denaa nahi hey.wesey bhi agar jaaton ke riti riwaaj aap nahi maantey to aap ko apney aap ko jat nahi kahnaa chaahiyey.vichaaron ki bhinntaa ho sakti hey,purey samaaj ko nakaarnaa ,samaaj ko badnaam karnaa hey , aur jo aadmi ussi samaaj se hone kaa daawaa kartaa ,aur uskaa virodhi hey ,wo sabse jayaadaa nuksaan kartaa hey .par aap jessey purey samaaj ko badnaam kartey hein. jo ye ghatnaaye ho rahi hein ye unki hi den hein.you are more rude than me, becouse you are demeging the society.i demaged only your ahankaar.
jitendershooda
New member
First thing is that ... if he has put this article here ... he should discuss the replies here itself in public like in panchayats. We like transparency .... no ghol-moll in personal mails on this topic ... rediff dot com should be kept for personal things not for a public issue like this. Thanks.
__________
Some recent examples of same gotra marriages. Please don't use this word only Manoj-Babli is the case. Yes, I can accept your view points as to what should be done in case of same gotra marriage. But atleast don't deny the facts. "Aswasthama mara gaya (aap log sirf itna kahete ho .... NAR NAHI KUNJAR ... kon kahega?)"
Recent Same Gotra issues-
1) Here is one Same gotra marriage link ...
http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal...s-to-help-of-same-gotra-couple_100365409.html
2) * February 2- Marriage of Sangeeta and Abhishek was annulled by the Biradari panchayat in Baghpat as the couple shared the same gotra .
3) Also one more killed by family last week in baghpat district .... there was no panchayat held ... it was not public .... only after their death it has gone public .... both belong to the same gotra and were neighbours
4) One was there in Yadav's near pataudi few months back.
I just wish to bring to your kind notice that Honour killing is much of a family issue. It is taking place in wider area and where there are no khap panchayats involved. Some recent examples are as follows.
Mind it ... NO KHAP PANCHAYAT IS INVOLVED IN ANY OF THE CASES. So please stop painting Khaps in Black all the time. If you like to articulate things, I assure you can do so by positive mindset too.
1) Jharkhand - Nirupama Pathak
http://www.ndtv.com/news/india/was-...an-honour-killing-family-questioned-22671.php
2) Sitapur - Lucknow
http://www.ndtv.com/news/cities/gir...other-alleges-honour-killing-29591.php?u=1516
3) Andhra Pradesh
http://www.india-server.com/news/andhra-nizamabad-swapna-sunkari-honour-27292.html
4) Punjab
http://ibnlive.in.com/news/honour-killing-in-punjab-couple-shot-dead-by-family/83769-3-1.html
Again in punjab
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/another-honour-killing-in-punjab/598104/
Again in punjab
http://www.hindustantimes.com/Two-die-in-Punjab-honour-killing/Article1-542853.aspx
5) Allahabad
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/5926054.cms
I agree with points like bhaichara should be voluntary, gohand should be voluntary, more participation of khaps in day to day issues should be increased. But who will do so?
Khap/Panchayat to me is a collection of people of a particular area. Now if learned jats have created there own smaller groups to be in more light then its their problem. Aap purane samay ki duhai dete ho ... pahele wale learned jats himmat rakhte they aur unhone jo sudhar lagu karvae wo panchayaton ke madhyam se karvai ... naki unse doori bana ke.
Why cant the learned attend the panchayats and then struggle there to change the mindset of people altogether. But there is a shortcut available to satisfy their soul and to be in news and that is Articles/media coverage full of Khap/Panchayat bashing.
Many of your points are good but rest filled with pre-assumed and preoccupied mindset.
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I had expected a reply of this sort. It takes a lot to be generous and show respect for another human being. Baaki aapki ichcha.