Reservation versus Commonwealth Games

Sir, this is scope creep.....

I know management guys will use this type of sophisticated terminology to make it difficult for ordinary people to understand. I will be very keen to know any project report which conclusively proves that this type of big events bring economic benefits to people. Any relatively poor country whose economy changed significantly for better after holding such events? May be I am ignorant. I will certainly like to get educated on this subject. I know at least of Montreal and Athens where they could not pay for the games expenditure and will be paying for years.

RK^2
 
इसका अर्थ ये है की श्री राजकुमार जी का लेख वर्तमान सूत्र के दायरे से बाहर है. राष्ट्रमंडल जैसे खेलों से नफा-नुक्सान और आरक्षण का आन्दोलन दो अलग श्रेणियाँ हैं. ऐसे खेलों की आयोजना हो या नहीं, इस के लिए हम एक अलग सूत्र आरम्भ कर सकतें हैं.

iska matlab samjhao Nitin Ji, kuch samajh sa na aaya, mhari angrezi thodi kamjor si hai.
 
1. Sir, I completely understand the anguish and the frustration due to the problems that we have in our country. There are still villages in India without any electricity line. But, again I fail to see the alleviation of these problems with reservation or from our agitation for reservation.

2. I completely agree with this point but I guess what the author meant earlier was to keep the agitation within the parameters so as not to cause national disruption and embarrassment. Our people in North India are already suffering from the shortage of water supply and electricity. Then a sect of society in India is torturing them for its personal gains. Why the former should be penalized. Should I be twisting the arms of children and my neighbors and keep them hostages to negotiate for my personal motives? I think this cannot be acceptable.

I completely agree that there is need to bring the benefits to the rural population of India (all communities, even they shed their bloods for India). So, I feel that we need to work out a different strategy and demands for the same. Even though 90% of the rural population cannot afford the fees, after reservation, 99% will still not be covered by such minuscule benefits.

What strategy do you think these helpless people adot which will bring them in the mainstream of development? Please put your suggestion point wise. Also please give justifications as to how sure you are that your strategy will work. Please don't misunderstand me. I am not quizing you. May be your younger mind has some better and practical ideas.

RK^2
 
I completly agree that at times such games can proove to be white elephants, especially for developing countries but then we can discuss the benefits and economic burden of such mega events in a seperate thread. Sir, I will not let you justify our present agitation on such grounds :) This is an entirely separate issue.

I know management guys will use this type of sophisticated terminology to make it difficult for ordinary people to understand. I will be very keen to know any project report which conclusively proves that this type of big events bring economic benefits to people. Any relatively poor country whose economy changed significantly for better after holding such events? May be I am ignorant. I will certainly like to get educated on this subject. I know at least of Montreal and Athens where they could not pay for the games expenditure and will be paying for years.

RK^2
 
I will be extremely interested to discuss on this but will have to get back to you later with the possible list of suggestion. Right now I need to fulfill other obligations.

What strategy do you think these helpless people adot which will bring them in the mainstream of development? Please put your suggestion point wise. Also please give justifications as to how sure you are that your strategy will work. Please don't misunderstand me. I am not quizing you. May be your younger mind has some better and practical ideas.

RK^2
 
1. So, I feel that we need to work out a different strategy and demands for the same.

What sort of different strategy???? Do u know a practical one in the current scenerio?


Even though 90% of the rural population cannot afford the fees, after reservation, 99% will still not be covered by such minuscule benefits.

Really? Do you have the data ?? Whats the source of this information?? Do you really know what benifits reservation provide???

I hope u will answer this in details same way as u ridicule things :D


Mene to nu lage s tu yo baja sa bajaye j he har chiz ne ridicule kare j s. Tereti mene ek be ya bat pahli bhi batayi thi
 
You cant just take a line and start hammering around it. What I said here is in a particular context. I am not a spokesperson of RLD or Ajit Singh. Each party has their own priorities and agendas. What I know from newspapers is that Harit Pardesh is an important issue in RLDs agenda. For some khap issues could be priority and for some other issues could be priority, it all depends on person to person and party to party. We can not take an issue and say that ok this is number 1 priority for everyone.

You and someone else has said this thing quiet a few times (you said the same for Khap controversy). Could you please tell us what are the / should be the important issues for Jat parties? Please provide comprehensive list if possible.

Also what should be the important topic for Jat people?

Seriously I want to know.
 
Kapil,

I don't think Bindra is a introvert..he is doing lot of ads . But the thing is Vijender have more charming looks and well built body as compare to Bindra.

V.Anand, Tendulkar, Dravid and many others do ads. And they are not extroverts. Ads are done to make money, not because they suit your personality. Vijender appeared on a lot of TV programs like Dus ka dum, chat shows, etc. Bindra didn't. You can see Yuvi and Bhajji doing that. Dravid and Sachin don't do that. Anyone will give their right arm and leg to get Sachin appear on their show. Anyways, the point I was making was quite different. This was said in a very specific context. And being an extrovert is not bad, nor is appearing on TV shows, so I hope you are not thinking that I was showing Vijender in poor light compared to Bindra.
 
You know every bullshit abt jat poltics and u dont know abt this fact that RLD is opposing it openly..strange?

Piyush,

Looks like that I dont read same newspapers as you. May be you can post the links next time. Your statement that Ajit is not supporting Jat reservation forced me to do some search and here is what I found. This is totally opposite to what you have been claiming so far. It is not necessary that every jat leader or party has to agree the way Yashpal Malik is going for jat reservation. He has his own way to achieve the goal and other might have their own way:

Now read:
http://www.hindustantimes.com/CM-supports-Jats-OBC-demand/Article1-557653.aspx
CM supports Jats' OBC demand
Excerpts:
"Report from Meerut said that Rashtriya Lok Dal and other Jat stalwarts have distanced themselves from closure of water supply to Delhi from Muradnagar Plant of Ghaziabad on Sunday."
"They (protestors) had full support of the district administration", blamed Yashbeer Singh, president of RLD's district unit. BSP supported the move of Samiti only to scuttle Ajit Singh's efforts to seek reservation for Jats in the centre, added Singh distancing his party from any move which is troublesome for people.
" We do not support any acts like closure of water", he insisted.
While supporting reservation for Jats in the centre Bhartiya Kisan Union spokesman Rakesh Tikait, said "such violent actions maligns the image of entire community ".
"Instead of creating troubles for people we should adopt the method of conversation to get our demands fulfilled", he quipped.
BKU chief Mahendra Singh Tikait and national general secretary of All India Jat Mahasabha Yudhveer Singh also have condemned stoppage of water supply to Delhi."

None of these leaders have made any statement against jat reservation, they were just opposed to the method adopted at Muradnagar.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...-RLD-before-UP-polls-/articleshow/6013113.cms
Ajit bargains hard as Cong courts RLD before UP polls
"The returns expected by RLD could be interesting. Sources said while a Bharat Ratna for Charan Singh, former prime minister and father of RLD chief Ajit Singh, will send out the “right message” to “farmers community”, the process can be sweetened by extending reservation to Jat community at the Centre."

Piyush,
I think that just claiming that Ajit is opposed to reservation is a mere propaganda by you. You fully support Yashpal Malik and be all ga ga about him here but my only request is that you do not have to do that by maligning others.

Haryana has got so many Jat CMs, why they have not provided reservation to Jats at state level? Why you keep singling out just Ajit for this.
A)I am saying coz this JAT family producing MP since last 40-45 years..still they have 5 MPs in parliament. You still did not reply how many times he asked question abt JAT reservation. He is only jat pol leader from our state thats why I read about him.

Remember that UP jats already has reservation at state level.
A)Who gave this reservation in UP state? Ajit singh?
Is jat reservation only issue left for parties? Are there no important issues left for jat parties to take?
A)Don’t you think being dependend on jat vote ? shld;nt we question it?
I have no idea whether RLD is happy or not, neither have I read any news regarding their happiness.
A)You know every bullshit abt jat poltics and u dont know abt this fact that RLD is opposing it openly..strange?
Why should they support it? Have they been invited to take part in agitation? Politics is a very complex affair, all these decisions to join an agitation or not have impact on electoral politics. May be Yashpal Malik never wanted them to join the agitation in Muradnagar in first place. Again why you singling out Ajit only? Did Chautala went to Muradnagar? or Hooda?
A)Do you know about Meerut JAT aarakshan rally on 8th feb 2008. All jat leader from all party invited there . Mr. Ajit also joined it and assured people he will raise it in parliament but he didnt raise it? Why? Us samay 2009 loksabha ke chunav honey wale the ajit singh ne sapne mein bhi itney jat nahi dekhe honge. Over 3 lac jat gathered there from all over india. Wha to kehe aaye ke mein isi mudde par har party se baat karunga fir kya hua? Hey jawab? After this meeting JATs gave him 5 MP in parliament before that they were 2 only? What he has given to JAT?
Your sole energy on this site is directed in projecting Yashpal Malik as a true jat leader and demeaning Ajit Singh. I have provided some light on why Mayawati supported the agitation and you brought over Ajit and his politics into this. What does his support to BSP/Congress/BJP has to do with this? In politics no one is a permanent friend or foe.
if any party leader who supports JAT OBC reservation we shld welcome it? what is wrong in this? if Ajit or any other Jat leader support it.. we wud be happy. Like chautala and other party leader supported it.
Why are you obsessed with what Ajit said when? In politics all this is too common. These politicians say one thing today and some other thing the next day. Is Ajit a Mahatama Gandhi? No. Promises to sabhi parties or neta karte hai, jabki poora kabhi nahi karte. Agar karte hote to desh ab tak developed country ban chuka hota. Sirf Ajit Singh ko single out karne se kya hoga. He is the only Jat leader in western UP who has considerable influence on jats in that region, usse bhi gira doge to western UP ke jats ke paas kaun sa neta bachega? Ajit mei chahe laakh burai ho ke log pher bhi Ajit ko pyar bahut karte hai or maante bhi bahut hai.
A) And brother why you so annoyed? If I am giving you video footage? Thanks you finally agreed on it"Ajit mei chahe laakh burai ho par gaam ke log pher bhi Ajit ko pyar bahut karte hai or maante bhi bahut hai." Fir Ajit singh is demand ko sansad mein kyo nahi uthate hai?
 
Last edited:
यहाँ लोग बार बार शांतिप्रिय ढंग से प्रदर्शन की बात कर रहे हैं | क्या यह पानी रोकने की नौबत रातो रात आई हैं ? यह शांतिप्रिय वाला प्रदर्शन १७ सालो से चल रहा था | पीछे ८ फ़रवरी को शांति से एक रैली की गई थी पर क्या नतीजा हुआ | आप लोगो को इन प्रदर्शनों का इल्म नहीं होगा क्योकि आप लोग सिर्फ अखबार में पढ़ के अपनी राय जाहिर करते हो बस और आपके इन अखबार टीवी वालो ने भी सिर्फ इस बार तवजू दी हैं जाटों के प्रदर्शन को | इससे पहले आपने कितनी बार पढ़ा जाटों के प्रदर्शन के बारे में | मोर साहब ने कहा के यहाँ ऐसा कोई नहीं जो गोलियों के आगे अड़ने वाला हो तो भाई मोर आपने यह बात पूरी तस्सली करके लिखी हैं या एक तीर चलाया हैं ? नरेंदर जी खरब , जित्नेदर जी हूडा , आदि कई ऐसे सदस्य हैं इस साईट के जो इन प्रदर्शनों में हिस्सा लेते आये हैं | रही बात इन् जाट नेताओ की जो इस प्रदर्शन की मुखालफत कर रहे हैं तो इनके इस तरह के ब्यान इनकी जलन दर्शा रहे हैं | टिकेत साहब रास्ता रोके , दिल्ली को उजाड़े तो सब जायज और जहाँ अजित सिंह , टिकेत साहब का नाम नहीं हुआ वो प्रदर्शन गलत हो गया | ये जाट नेता १७ सालो से हमे बहका रहे थे जाट आरक्षण के नाम से अपनी रोटिया सेक रहे थे अब इनका सत्कार इनकी पुकार नहीं हुई तो इन्हें जलन हो रही हैं | कोई इनसे पूछे की ये जाट नेता कितनी बार पिछड़ा कमीशन के सामने पेश हुए , कितनी बार अपनी तकरीरे रखी , कितनी बार इन्होने संसद में आवाज उठाई ?
यहाँ लोगो को एक विजेंदर की फ़िक्र सता रही हैं और जो लाखो करोड़ो विजेंदर बेचारे संघर्ष कर रहे हैं उनका क्या ?
 
Last edited:
यहाँ लोग बार बार शांतिप्रिय ढंग से प्रदर्शन की बात कर रहे हैं | क्या यह पानी रोकने की नौबत रातो रात आई हैं ? यह शांतिप्रिय वाला प्रदर्शन १७ सालो से चल रहा था | पीछे ८ फ़रवरी को शांति से एक रैली की गई थी पर क्या नतीजा हुआ | आप लोग सिर्फ अखबार में पढ़ के अपनी राय जाहिर करते हो बस और आपके इन अखबार टीवी वालो ने भी सिर्फ इस बार तवजू दी हैं जाटों के प्रदर्शन को | इससे पहले आपने कितनी बार पढ़ा जाटों के प्रदर्शन के बारे में | मोर साहब ने कहा के यहाँ ऐसा कोई नहीं जो गोलियों के आगे अड़ने वाला हो तो भाई मोर आपने यह बात पूरी तस्सली करके लिखी हैं या एक तीर चलाया हैं ? नरेंदर जी खरब , जित्नेदर जी हूडा , आदि कई ऐसे सदस्य हैं इस साईट के जो इन प्रदर्शनों में हिस्सा लेते आये हैं | रही बात इन् जाट नेताओ की जो इस प्रदर्शन की मुखालफत कर रहे हैं तो इनके इस तरह के ब्यान इनकी जलन दर्शा रहे हैं | टिकेत साहब रास्ता रोके , दिल्ली को उजाड़े तो सब जायज और जहाँ अजित सिंह , टिकेत साहब का नाम नहीं हुआ वो प्रदर्शन गलत हो गया | ये जाट नेता १७ सालो से हमे बहका रहे थे जाट आरक्षण के नाम से अपनी रोटिया सेक रहे थे अब इनका सत्कार इनकी पुकार नहीं हुई तो इन्हें जलन हो रही हैं | कोई इनसे पूछे की ये जाट नेता कितनी बार पिछड़ा कमीशन के सामने पेश हुए , कितनी बार अपनी तकरीरे रखी , कितनी बार इन्होने संसद में आवाज उठाई ?
यहाँ लोगो को एक विजेंदर की फ़िक्र सता रही हैं और जो लाखो करोड़ो विजेंदर बेचारे संघर्ष कर रहे हैं उनका क्या ?


I am neither Ajit singh nor Tikat supporter. Nobody is worried about Vijender as he is more capable than any one of us around here to take care of his own affairs..

Just one quick close Ended question for you..
Is reservation the only ray of hope for Jats?
 
.......... Just one quick close Ended question for you..
Is reservation the only ray of hope for Jats?

This reminds me of whenever i go to attend some function and find the first 1-2 rows marked as reserved. I look at the people who grace these first 1-2 rows. I have seen where car parking slots are marked VVIP. Reservation in India has become something like that. I have often attended political functions where all sorts of crap sits on dias. Reservation in India has become like this. Who started this and who is continuing with this? Can we blame our rural folks who feel discriminated in the name of reservation? Is reservation not akin to a shorter line for some previlaged people to reach the counter? This is causing lots of heartburn among many sections of society. Best will be to stop reservation in all walks of life. If that can not be done, why blame Jats or Gujjars? Present reservation system is nothing but discrimination. If some people are breaking que and government is supporting that, others can not remain silent for ever. I suppose this is what our fellow Jats are doing now. If government can not give equal facilities to their kids, what options they have? When peaceful methods don't work, what should they do? When all posts are filled through back door, what should they do? We have no moral right to ask them to remainpeaceful if peaceful methods don't work.

RK^2
 
Last edited:
You and someone else has said this thing quiet a few times (you said the same for Khap controversy). Could you please tell us what are the / should be the important issues for Jat parties? Please provide comprehensive list if possible.

Also what should be the important topic for Jat people?

Seriously I want to know.

Let me try.

1. Female infanticide. It is foolish to ignore the lowest ratio in the country and/or attribute it to some make-believe factors. I have no qualms in admitting that I have seen an overwhelming desire for a male child in most of my relations. Having a preference either ways is natural. But in our society it goes to an extreme, where people actually express sympathy on a girl child and congratulatory messages on a male child. And in more extreme cases, to not letting the female child take birth. The issue has to be taken up before it causes irreparable damage.

2. Education. The villages have no good schools to speak of. Any amount of reservation taken in name of village kids is not going to help those who drop out at 5th/8th/10th/12th level. Those who do finish school would still be competing with urban reserved population. Some would obviously manage to get through and sadly would be used as examples of how the reservations worked. In my book, if reservations benefit 10% rural population and 90% urban population, then it is a big time failure. Anyways, assuming Jat parties manage to get reservations, for it to benefit the rural population, the rural students need to have a good foundation. I think no one should argue with that irrespective of their stand on reservations. The Jat parties need to think of solutions that suit the rural population the most. For example, private schools can be told to set up rural branches (need not be 1 per village, but 1 for a few closeby villages with a school bus network carrying children) and/or admitting rural students as a conditon for opening urban centers. The govt. can give education coupons to parents that can be used to pay fee in any school- the school still gets the same fee, but parents get to choose the school, thus leading to competition and hence better quality education. The money for this can be got from the subsidy that pays for sarkari schools and the corruption around them. There would be many more ideas that can be converted to demands and policies.

3. Rural economy including agriculture: Land holdings are getting smaller and smaller. There are too many people working on too little land. What do the Jat parties say on this? Just saying Jai Jawan, Jai Kisan is not going to change anything. If farmer has to get paid more, there has to be consolidation in agriculture and growing crops that sell. The middleman monopoly has to be broken by getting farmers access to final markets. Should be possible in this age. Through internet, a local representative should be able to find, anytime before sowing to harvesting, a buyer for the products and lock in a forward price. The price guaranteed, the farmer should be able to get loans/insurance from the banks. It should also remove the last minute pressure on the farmer to sell at a distressed price. Some automatic demand and employment opportunities can be created by setting up food processing industries. I am talking big picture here, devil would be in the detail. Undoubtedly, a lot would need to be done. But every big change has to start somewhere. I don't see anyone making demands on this apart from kneejerk demands for increasing the MSP for this and that.

4. Land Acquisition: Industries are needed to employ the whole population gainfully. But you also need to make sure that it doesn't lead to land grab by the rich and the powerful. And that it is not someone else's gain, and farmers' pain. Don't see any discussion on this. Whosoever is in power just announces some big projects and those who are out of power cry hoarse about corruption.

5. Infrastructure: Roads, electricity, water, railway lines, airports and the works in Jat areas. I mention it in 1 line but everything depends on these and these affect everything.

6. Sports: Jats are naturally good at sports. Mittal is supporting the boxing academy in Bhiwani. More investment and sponsorship could be sought from other industrial houses to make Bhiwani a world class boxing hub. Not only Jat boxers would benefit, but entire Bhiwani belt will. Young atheletes in any sports can be identified at an early age and provided with facilities/coaching so that they become world class. Money is not the issue it used to be. Cricket has become a profitable sport. The same can be true for other sports, if they are promoted. A whole industry can be set around sports and Jat areas can lead the way.

There are more points to add to the list, but as a start, this is enough.

PS: I am editing this much after the main post. I have used infanticide in the above post, which is incorrect. I meant to use foeticide. Infanticide is killing a live infant, which I think would be much much rarer than foeticide, which is aborting an unborn foetus.
 
Last edited:
I am neither Ajit singh nor Tikat supporter. Nobody is worried about Vijender as he is more capable than any one of us around here to take care of his own affairs..

Just one quick close Ended question for you..
Is reservation the only ray of hope for Jats?

यहाँ मैं अजित सिंह या टिकेत की ही नहीं सभी जाट नेताओ के बारे में कह रहा हु इनका नाम इसलिए लिया क्योकि एक पोस्ट में इनका जिक्र आया हैं | विजेंदर से मतलब CWG में खेलनेवाले चंद खिलाडियों से हैं | मुल्क में बेचारे करोड़ो जाट विजेंदर बेरोजगारी से लड़ रहे हैं और यहाँ आपको देश के नाम की पड़ी हैं | १७ सालो से जिनकी सुनवाई नहीं हो रही थी अब CWG का समय नजदीक आता देख इनको पसीना आ रहा हैं देश की दुहाई दे रहे हैं जिनकी हाँ में हाँ हमारे कुछ जाट भाई भी मिला रहे हैं , संयम की भी एक हद होती हैं |
"ray of hope " बहुत हैं पर उनमे से यह आरक्षण भी एक बहुत बड़ी 'ray of hope ' हैं | इसे लेने में हर्ज कोई नहीं हैं | आपने शायद आरक्षण को पढ़ा नहीं हैं पहले आप इसके बारे में पूरा पढ़ ले इसको जान ले उसके बाद आप तकरीरे करे तो बेहतर होगा | अगर इसको लेने में कोई हर्ज़ होता तो इतने सालो से जो जातिया इसका आनंद मान रही हैं वो इसको कभी का छोड़ चुके होते इसकी अवधि बार बार नहीं बढ़वाते | यह साधारण सी बात मैंने आपके लिए कही हैं , इस साईट पर आरक्षण को लेकर बहुत से तर्क व तकरीरे हुई हैं |
 
Let me try.

1. Female infanticide. It is foolish to ignore the lowest ratio in the country and/or attribute it to some make-believe factors. I have no qualms in admitting that I have seen an overwhelming desire for a male child in most of my relations. Having a preference either ways is natural. But in our society it goes to an extreme, where people actually express sympathy on a girl child and congratulatory messages on a male child. And in more extreme cases, to not letting the female child take birth. The issue has to be taken up before it causes irreparable damage.

2. Education. The villages have no good schools to speak of. Any amount of reservation taken in name of village kids is not going to help those who drop out at 5th/8th/10th/12th level. Those who do finish school would still be competing with urban reserved population. Some would obviously manage to get through and sadly would be used as examples of how the reservations worked. In my book, if reservations benefit 10% rural population and 90% urban population, then it is a big time failure. Anyways, assuming Jat parties manage to get reservations, for it to benefit the rural population, the rural students need to have a good foundation. I think no one should argue with that irrespective of their stand on reservations. The Jat parties need to think of solutions that suit the rural population the most. For example, private schools can be told to set up rural branches (need not be 1 per village, but 1 for a few closeby villages with a school bus network carrying children) and/or admitting rural students as a conditon for opening urban centers. The govt. can give education coupons to parents that can be used to pay fee in any school- the school still gets the same fee, but parents get to choose the school, thus leading to competition and hence better quality education. The money for this can be got from the subsidy that pays for sarkari schools and the corruption around them. There would be many more ideas that can be converted to demands and policies.

3. Rural economy including agriculture: Land holdings are getting smaller and smaller. There are too many people working on too little land. What do the Jat parties say on this? Just saying Jai Jawan, Jai Kisan is not going to change anything. If farmer has to get paid more, there has to be consolidation in agriculture and growing crops that sell. The middleman monopoly has to be broken by getting farmers access to final markets. Should be possible in this age. Through internet, a local representative should be able to find, anytime before sowing to harvesting, a buyer for the products and lock in a forward price. The price guaranteed, the farmer should be able to get loans/insurance from the banks. It should also remove the last minute pressure on the farmer to sell at a distressed price. Some automatic demand and employment opportunities can be created by setting up food processing industries. I am talking big picture here, devil would be in the detail. Undoubtedly, a lot would need to be done. But every big change has to start somewhere. I don't see anyone making demands on this apart from kneejerk demands for increasing the MSP for this and that.

4. Land Acquisition: Industries are needed to employ the whole population gainfully. But you also need to make sure that it doesn't lead to land grab by the rich and the powerful. And that it is not someone else's gain, and farmers' pain. Don't see any discussion on this. Whosoever is in power just announces some big projects and those who are out of power cry hoarse about corruption.

5. Infrastructure: Roads, electricity, water, railway lines, airports and the works in Jat areas. I mention it in 1 line but everything depends on these and these affect everything.

6. Sports: Jats are naturally good at sports. Mittal is supporting the boxing academy in Bhiwani. More investment and sponsorship could be sought from other industrial houses to make Bhiwani a world class boxing hub. Not only Jat boxers would benefit, but entire Bhiwani belt will. Young atheletes in any sports can be identified at an early age and provided with facilities/coaching so that they become world class. Money is not the issue it used to be. Cricket has become a profitable sport. The same can be true for other sports, if they are promoted. A whole industry can be set around sports and Jat areas can lead the way.

There are more points to add to the list, but as a start, this is enough.

Yogesh ji,

Kapil has summarized rays of hope. I asked you something in Yes & No. Let me ask you one more very critical question. Let assume Jats will get reservation before CWG games. In how many years you think problems related to unemployment among Jats will be solved?

I am really not aware but just want to know.. Are Jats asking for reservation in private job sector also?

If we won't get reservation after all these pani roko, bijli roko and Bus Jalao protests, Do you think Jats are going to ask for separate nation?

I am sure leaders who are leading these agitations have some contingency plans...
 
Let us look at the problem in a different way. In free market thouse who have more resources grow more relative to those who have less resources. Usually poorer people work for richer people and this is how the wealth gets created. Net beneficiary are rich people. Let us model this problem now and compare with a electric capacitor where more and more charge is getting accumulated at one plate. There is a limit to which one can accumulate the charge, beyond which sparking starts. Present demands for reservations are akin to the beginning of sparking between two plates of a capacitor. Sparking can be delayed by inserting some sort of dielectric material, but not for ever. In my view if difference between poor and rich grows beyond a level, sparking/ social unrest is bound to happen. Demands for reservation and things like that are nothing but form of sparking which bring the difference to managable levels. Laws of science dictate that these sparkings have to happen whether we like or don't like. If not handled carefully, sparkings burn the entire capacitor.

RK^2
 
Last edited:
Yogesh ji,

Kapil has summarized rays of hope. I asked you something in Yes & No. Let me ask you one more very critical question. Let assume Jats will get reservation before CWG games. In how many years you think problems related to unemployment among Jats will be solved?

I am really not aware but just want to know.. Are Jats asking for reservation in private job sector also?

If we won't get reservation after all these pani roko, bijli roko and Bus Jalao protests, Do you think Jats are going to ask for separate nation?

I am sure leaders who are leading these agitations have some contingency plans...

I have a different question, on plan B. Yogeshji mentions 17 years of struggle. That's one full generation. Imagine one Jat bhai who started fighting for reservations when he was 21, so that he cud get a job. Now he is 38. His time is almost gone.

Is there a time limit at which we'd say okay this is not happening, let's do something else. The plan B, that is. People try for IITs, IAS, don't make it, do something else. Is the plan to fight indefinitely till we get reservations? Should the person who is 21 year old now spend his time and energy on the struggle? Is there a time frame- 1 year, 5 years? at which he should stop and try something else?

We have heard "bas is baar to le ke rahenge" a number of times in the last 17 years." Lots of people spent their best years in this hope. I am not talking about the professional strugglers like politicians, whose time is best spent fighting for a cause. But the ordinary folk who take part in the struggle hoping to derive some benefit. Let's be practical and acknowledge it may take more time. What's the plan B for them?
 
Point taken . If that was the case than Sushil kumar was also a olympic medalist..

Sachin is in different league besides him all players are in same bucket. they can do anything for money..

well on lighter note I think Vijender have perfect looks as bollywood hero..
thats why he is more visble on tv these days..producers are rushing for him . he is like a youth icon.

V.Anand, Tendulkar, Dravid and many others do ads. And they are not extroverts. Ads are done to make money, not because they suit your personality. Vijender appeared on a lot of TV programs like Dus ka dum, chat shows, etc. Bindra didn't. You can see Yuvi and Bhajji doing that. Dravid and Sachin don't do that. Anyone will give their right arm and leg to get Sachin appear on their show. Anyways, the point I was making was quite different. This was said in a very specific context. And being an extrovert is not bad, nor is appearing on TV shows, so I hope you are not thinking that I was showing Vijender in poor light compared to Bindra.
 
कपिल जी की दलीले गौरतलब हैं |
समाज में सुधार की बहुत जरुरत हैं और यह आरक्षण भी इस सुधार की कड़ी का ही एक हिस्सा हैं |
यदि इतने बड़े पैमाने पर और आन्दोलनों की जरुरत पड़ी और उसके बावजूद भी जाट कामयाब नहीं हुए तो फिर जाट अपने आप को मरा समझे | अलग मुल्क का तो फिर सवाल ही नहीं उठता क्योंकि उसके लिए बहुत बड़ी जंग लड़नी पड़ती हैं |
आपके हिसाब से आरक्षण लेने में कोई हर्ज़ हैं ? यदि हैं तो क्या हर्ज़ हैं ?
हमारे समाज में समस्या क्या हैं की इसमें दो तबके हो गए एक वो जो मजबूर होकर अपने हक के लिए पानी रोकते हैं उनकी तादाद ज्यादा हैं और एक आप लोगो का जो खामखा का या काम का पता नहीं पर गुणा जोड़ घटा करते रहते हैं | ज़मीनी हकीक़त से आप लोगो का कोई सरोकार नहीं होता इसलिए आपलोगों का गुणा जोड़ घटा कही कोई मायेने नहीं रखता |
मोर साहब जहा तक मैंने देखा हैं आप लोग अखबारी ज्ञान के हिसाब से तर्क करते हैं | मेरी आपसे गुजारिश हैं के जब भी आप भारत आये तो अपने कीमती समय में से एक हफ्ता मुझे दे ताकि मैं आपको असली नजारा दिखा संकू की ये जाट नेता (राजनीति वाले नहीं) हमारी कौम की भलाई के लिए क्या सोच रखते हैं और क्या क्या कदम उठा रहे हैं आरक्षण के इलावा | उस तजुर्बे के बाद आप यहाँ तर्क करे |
 
Time-Out

Time-Out Guys..... What are you we discussing here. There are tons of irrelevant things, lets keep them off the table..

Point taken . If that was the case than Sushil kumar was also a olympic medalist..

Sachin is in different league besides him all players are in same bucket. they can do anything for money..

well on lighter note I think Vijender have perfect looks as bollywood hero..
thats why he is more visble on tv these days..producers are rushing for him . he is like a youth icon.
 
Back
Top