Sher-e-Dilli Sajjan Kumar hit by Intra Party Rivalry

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Same career politicians or their kins contesting elections from the same old constituencies. Slogans, Ram temple issue revisited suddenly just before election time! Will there be a day in future when BJP can fulfill its Ram Temple promise? lady from Italy is Congress President! Rahul Ghandi as future Prime Minister. 50% italian, 25% brahmin, and 25% persian!
For common man the main issue is poverty. But Indian democracy marches on paying little attention to the common man.
 
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A politician is expected to serve the Nation through the party or through individual efforts.....but if a person is attached to a political party and its ideology then why should he leave......and when he has done so even during out of power period........An army man serves nation through defence forces.....what i said earlier....suppose a Battallion Commander i mean CO is planning to launch an operation in Kashmir against militants...and during planning a junior officers is not of the same oppinion or not impressed with the plan and it being effect....what he will do....will he take out his Rifle Company and launch a separate attack against militants.......

Sajjan Kumar ji Power mein the ya nahi the....unhone apne ilaake ke liye kaam jaari rakhei hain.....and thats why he has survived in politics....vo Public ke Neta hain......and thats why even Sonia ji could not ignore him during this latest episode against him.......unhone deekha diyaa ki vo Sher-e-Dilli Sajjan Kumar hain

Jat Ekta Jindabaad.....Jindabaad Bhai Jindabaad:rock
Jat Ekta Jindabaad.....Jindabaad Bhai Jindabaad:rock
Jat Ekta ke Parteek...Maharaaja Surajmal Jindabaad:rock

raj2rif said:
Dear Mr. Sachin Balyan Sir,

To me, a politician serves his constituency and not the party? That is the misconception and that is what is unfortunate in our political system. You represent your constituency in the Parliament or Legislative Assembly. You are given that right by the people who vote for you or elect you their leader.
Now, to do that, you might join a political party or you could do it as an independent. A true leader and a strong leader really does not depend on the political party he represents. His true strength is his constituency.
Getting ticket to his brother is all right. That is what is known as "Back Door Entry". To be honest, to serve the constituency you don't even have to be an MP.

Now, if an officer is denied promotion, does not mean he joins the terrorist outfits. It is true measure of his capabilities by the organization. If he did not become Colonel that means he is not considered competent enough to command a Battalion, but that does not mean he is not competent enough to continue his existing command. The two things really have no comparision.

I have nothing against Mr. Sajjan Kumar or for that matter any one. I discuss the issues and not the personalities. If Mr. Sajjan Kumar has been in the politics for such a long time, I am pretty sure, he must be having some strength to stay on.

Regarding alligations and proofs. I do respect the judicial system, but more often than not, it is doctored by our own law makers. Mr. Laloo Prasad was involved in many things, and so is Ms. Mayawati, and we can keep going on... but has any thing been proved against them?

You like Mr. Sajjan Kumar, nothing wrong in it. I am sure he must have done excellent work in his constituency. People really don't have to be elected representatives to do community work. We do our bit through North American Jat Charity, so is Mr. Naveen Gulia. What I had meant in my post (the point that has been missed by you completely, probability because of your unflinching loyalty towards Mr. Sajjan Kumar and Congress Party) is that a good leader can always find the ways to serve the community. Probably Mr. Sajjan Kumar found the way to serve the community through his brother. Many of our members said that they would have liked him doing it through his son. Nothing wrong in it. I guess, similarly all the political leaders is finding their ways to serve their communities through their next generations. So why cry out "Dynastic Rule" when it comes to non Jat leaders.
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Yesterday I was talking to a friend of mine who belongs to south delhi constituency... He told me that Sh Ramesh Kumar will win with huge huge margin..!!


Sh Sajjan Kumar Jindaabad... Sh Ramesh Kumar Jindaabad... Jat Ekta Jindabad !!!

sachinb said:
A politician is expected to serve the Nation through the party or through individual efforts.....but if a person is attached to a political party and its ideology then why should he leave......and when he has done so even during out of power period........An army man serves nation through defence forces.....what i said earlier....suppose a Battallion Commander i mean CO is planning to launch an operation in Kashmir against militants...and during planning a junior officers is not of the same oppinion or not impressed with the plan and it being effect....what he will do....will he take out his Rifle Company and launch a separate attack against militants.......

Sajjan Kumar ji Power mein the ya nahi the....unhone apne ilaake ke liye kaam jaari rakhei hain.....and thats why he has survived in politics....vo Public ke Neta hain......and thats why even Sonia ji could not ignore him during this latest episode against him.......unhone deekha diyaa ki vo Sher-e-Dilli Sajjan Kumar hain

Jat Ekta Jindabaad.....Jindabaad Bhai Jindabaad:rock
Jat Ekta Jindabaad.....Jindabaad Bhai Jindabaad:rock
Jat Ekta ke Parteek...Maharaaja Surajmal Jindabaad:rock
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You are Missing the Point!

sachinb said:
A politician is expected to serve the Nation through the party or through individual efforts.....but if a person is attached to a political party and its ideology then why should he leave......and when he has done so even during out of power period........An army man serves nation through defence forces.....what i said earlier....suppose a Battallion Commander i mean CO is planning to launch an operation in Kashmir against militants...and during planning a junior officers is not of the same oppinion or not impressed with the plan and it being effect....what he will do....will he take out his Rifle Company and launch a separate attack against militants.......

Sajjan Kumar ji Power mein the ya nahi the....unhone apne ilaake ke liye kaam jaari rakhei hain.....and thats why he has survived in politics....vo Public ke Neta hain......and thats why even Sonia ji could not ignore him during this latest episode against him.......unhone deekha diyaa ki vo Sher-e-Dilli Sajjan Kumar hain

Jat Ekta Jindabaad.....Jindabaad Bhai Jindabaad:rock
Jat Ekta Jindabaad.....Jindabaad Bhai Jindabaad:rock
Jat Ekta ke Parteek...Maharaaja Surajmal Jindabaad:rock
Click to expand...
Dear Mr. Baliyan,

I really admire your loyalty towards Mr. Sajjan Kumar. I wish many people had similar loyalty towards "Mother India" But coming to the point raised by you.

I don't think you have any idea about the functioning of the armed forces and the difference in the two professions: "Soldiering" and "Politics". Let me try out one more time to drive the point home.

1. Political system in our country is suppose to be a democratic system. Political parties elect their "party presidents" for a definite terms (Except some parties where the President is a for the life time, even though these parties call themselves democratic parties) Since Congress more often than not has had similar kind of situation that is why poeple start comparing the party system with the defense forces like you are doing. Unfortunately that does not make the two systems equal.

2. Indian constitution allows a politician to contest elections as an independent candidate. Thus a leader reallydoes not have to be tied to a political party if the purpose is to serve the community.

3. A polilitical leader can contest the election as an independent candidate and probably win the election, for it is based on his popularity among the constituents. A soldier/ Army officer, if tries to lead an attack all by himself, has an extremely remote chance of succeeding even though he might be popular among his troops.

4. As I had said earlier, the Commanding Officer of a Battalion dose not get to his post by popular vote in the battalion. And hence is the difference between military and political system. It is in the political system only that son of a prime minister with couple of years in politics can become the prime minister (as was the case with Late Mr. Rajiv Gandhi). In military if Commanding officer is killed, his son does not take over the battalion, but his Second in Command does.

5. Regarding officer having difference of opinion about the plan made by CO. Well officers do give their opinion duing operational discussions, before the plan is made. The commanding officer is the final authority to finalize the plan. A good opinion is always included in the plan, but once the plan is made all soldiers follow its execution.

6. If officer refuses to lead his men in battle: he is removed from his command, court martialled either for insubordination or cowardice (depending upon the circumstances)

7. The officer's second in command takes over and leads the company. Unfortunately/ Fortunately, we in the military do not have system to give command of that company to the officer's BROTHER or SON.

I hope you would understand the difference in the two diverse system. If it is still not clear, then my humble suggestion would be to carry out a little study on the system "Defense/Military" so that it is easier for you to differentiate and comment on "Affairs Military". The reason is, that some time we make authenticated statements on the subjects after hearing some thing from some one, who may have inadequate knowledge of the subject. Such statement lead to "Rumors", which is not good for any system.

I wish you and Mr. Sajjan Kumar a good election.
 
Colonel Sahab,

I know the difference very well. I also know the functioning of Armed Forces very well. You tell me on how many occasions armed forces personnel use their rights....How many officers file ROG against the wrong done.....why they become mute spectators of their seniors......they are also human being.....I know the difference.....there is a difference in civil and defence.....and based on the knowledge of that difference I am giving my oppinion that why shouldnt Sajjan Kumar ji leave Congress to fight as an independent.

What I am talking is the practical thing. As far as Indian constitution is concerened same way any registered party also has a constitution of its own.....so what a big deal if a person has faith in the constitution of party as well as Indian constitution.......why should he leave the party when he can do all those things staying with in the party no matter if he has been given a MP ticket or not.

You might not be aware, three terms back when Sajjan Kumar ji was not even a MP even then tickets of more than 25 MLAs were decided on his recommendations and same holds true for the Councilors

Hi leaving congress to do the good work is immaterial when he has enough say whether he gets the party ticket or not.:rockWhy you are so adamant on the point that he should leave congress and fight election.

And main thing is that he was not involved in 84 riots......this I am not saying based on any CBI clean chit or any report of commission.

Jat Ekta Jindabaad:rock

raj2rif said:
Dear Mr. Baliyan,

I really admire your loyalty towards Mr. Sajjan Kumar. I wish many people had similar loyalty towards "Mother India" But coming to the point raised by you.

I don't think you have any idea about the functioning of the armed forces and the difference in the two professions: "Soldiering" and "Politics". Let me try out one more time to drive the point home.

1. Political system in our country is suppose to be a democratic system. Political parties elect their "party presidents" for a definite terms (Except some parties where the President is a for the life time, even though these parties call themselves democratic parties) Since Congress more often than not has had similar kind of situation that is why poeple start comparing the party system with the defense forces like you are doing. Unfortunately that does not make the two systems equal.

2. Indian constitution allows a politician to contest elections as an independent candidate. Thus a leader reallydoes not have to be tied to a political party if the purpose is to serve the community.

3. A polilitical leader can contest the election as an independent candidate and probably win the election, for it is based on his popularity among the constituents. A soldier/ Army officer, if tries to lead an attack all by himself, has an extremely remote chance of succeeding even though he might be popular among his troops.

4. As I had said earlier, the Commanding Officer of a Battalion dose not get to his post by popular vote in the battalion. And hence is the difference between military and political system. It is in the political system only that son of a prime minister with couple of years in politics can become the prime minister (as was the case with Late Mr. Rajiv Gandhi). In military if Commanding officer is killed, his son does not take over the battalion, but his Second in Command does.

5. Regarding officer having difference of opinion about the plan made by CO. Well officers do give their opinion duing operational discussions, before the plan is made. The commanding officer is the final authority to finalize the plan. A good opinion is always included in the plan, but once the plan is made all soldiers follow its execution.

6. If officer refuses to lead his men in battle: he is removed from his command, court martialled either for insubordination or cowardice (depending upon the circumstances)

7. The officer's second in command takes over and leads the company. Unfortunately/ Fortunately, we in the military do not have system to give command of that company to the officer's BROTHER or SON.

I hope you would understand the difference in the two diverse system. If it is still not clear, then my humble suggestion would be to carry out a little study on the system "Defense/Military" so that it is easier for you to differentiate and comment on "Affairs Military". The reason is, that some time we make authenticated statements on the subjects after hearing some thing from some one, who may have inadequate knowledge of the subject. Such statement lead to "Rumors", which is not good for any system.

I wish you and Mr. Sajjan Kumar a good election.
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Bilkul sateek aiwam sahi santulit jawaab !!!


Sachin bhai Jindaabad !!!
Jat Ekta Jindabaad !!!

sachinb said:
Colonel Sahab,

I know the difference very well. I also know the functioning of Armed Forces very well.

What I am talking is the practical thing. As far as Indian constitution is concerened same way any registered party also has a constitution of its own.....so what a big deal if a person has faith in the constitution of party as well as Indian constitution.......why should he leave the party when he can do all those things staying with in the party no matter if he has been given a MP ticket or not.

You might not be aware, three terms back when Sajjan Kumar ji was not even a MP even then tickets of more than 25 MLAs were decided on his recommendations and same holds true for the Councilors

Hi leaving congress to do the good work is immaterial when he has enough say whether he gets the party ticket or not.:rockWhy you are so adamant on the point that he should leave congress and fight election.

And main thing is that he was not involved in 84 riots......this I am not saying based on any CBI clean chit or any report of commission.

Jat Ekta Jindabaad:rock
Click to expand...
 
anilsangwan said:
Yesterday I was talking to a friend of mine who belongs to south delhi constituency... He told me that Sh Ramesh Kumar will win with huge huge margin..!!


Sh Sajjan Kumar Jindaabad... Sh Ramesh Kumar Jindaabad... Jat Ekta Jindabad !!!
Click to expand...

MODERATORS OF THIS THREAD - I have written here what I heared or say openion of some experienced individuals, where is that ?????????????????????????????????????????????

Should we Campaign for Mr. Ramesh Kumar only in this thread or we can submit neutral/ unbaised comments also????????????

Kindly revert
 
Excellent!!!!

sachinb said:
Colonel Sahab,

I know the difference very well. I also know the functioning of Armed Forces very well. You tell me on how many occasions armed forces personnel use their rights....How many officers file ROG against the wrong done.....why they become mute spectators of their seniors......they are also human being.....I know the difference.....there is a difference in civil and defence.....and based on the knowledge of that difference I am giving my oppinion that why shouldnt Sajjan Kumar ji leave Congress to fight as an independent.

What I am talking is the practical thing. As far as Indian constitution is concerened same way any registered party also has a constitution of its own.....so what a big deal if a person has faith in the constitution of party as well as Indian constitution.......why should he leave the party when he can do all those things staying with in the party no matter if he has been given a MP ticket or not.

You might not be aware, three terms back when Sajjan Kumar ji was not even a MP even then tickets of more than 25 MLAs were decided on his recommendations and same holds true for the Councilors

Hi leaving congress to do the good work is immaterial when he has enough say whether he gets the party ticket or not.:rockWhy you are so adamant on the point that he should leave congress and fight election.

And main thing is that he was not involved in 84 riots......this I am not saying based on any CBI clean chit or any report of commission.

Jat Ekta Jindabaad:rock
Click to expand...

Dear Mr. Baliyan,

I appreciate your depth of knowledge on most issues concerning civilization, society, political system and what not. I have never doubted your intelligence, or depth of knowledge for once. So, please dont' get carried away with the notion that any one is doubting your knowledge about armed forces. Probably, I may have to carry out some study of armed forces to get myself updated. After all time takes it toll, and people do get rusted as they grow old.

I have never said that Mr. Sajjan Kumar should leave Congress. The issue was that he was denied the party ticket due to inter-party rivelary, and the second point raised was that he is a good community worker.

My argument has been for both the above point:

1. If he has been denied party ticket due to inter-party livelary and if party high command respects him as a heavy weight, in that case probably it was wrong on the part of the party to deny him the ticket in first place.

2. Secondly, a good communty worker really does not have to be elected representative to serve the community. He/she can do that work otherwise. Specially if some one has the popularity like Mr. Sajjan Kumar enjoys in the constituency.

3. If it should benefit the constituency for Mr. Sajjan Kumar to be the elected representative, and the Congress Party has denied the ticket to him, then probably it might be a good idea to contest the election as an independent candidate.

Now, if congress is more important than the constituency, then there is no argument to make on my part. In that case, as a normal layman I feel, that it is more important to serve the political party rather than serving the community. Thus the community is subservient to the political party one represents. If that be the case, then why talk about the community in first place.

Regarding how many officers file the ROG, depends upon how many legitimately feel that they have been wronged, and how many do have courage of their convictions to do that. It really is not a number game. Those who make loose talks about the organization that they serve when sidelined/ not promoted, are the people who propogate negatively about the organization. I am not saying that every thing is good in the armed forces, for human beings serve there too. What I am saying is that there is no comparision between the two issues.

I have already appreciated your commitment to this site and the community in my earlier post. If one counts the numbers only, you have an average six posts per day, since you joined this site. Most threads have your posts. What does it mean to a layman like me? I take it as a committed person who is devoting his valuable time to help educate the community and that needs to be appreciated.
 
raj2rif said:
Dear Mr. Baliyan,

I appreciate your depth of knowledge on most issues concerning civilization, society, political system and what not. I have never doubted your intelligence, or depth of knowledge for once. So, please dont' get carried away with the notion that any one is doubting your knowledge about armed forces. Probably, I may have to carry out some study of armed forces to get myself updated. After all time takes it toll, and people do get rusted as they grow old.


I have already appreciated your commitment to this site and the community in my earlier post. If one counts the numbers only, you have an average six posts per day, since you joined this site. Most threads have your posts. What does it mean to a layman like me? I take it as a committed person who is devoting his valuable time to help educate the community and that needs to be appreciated.
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Sir,
That is high praise for a kid with too much time on his hands ... unless its sarcasm !!;)
 
Perception!!

sidchhikara said:
Sir,
That is high praise for a kid with too much time on his hands ... unless its sarcasm !!;)
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Dear Mr. Chikara,

What I have stated in the two paragraphs, you have highlighted is a statement of facts.

I don't mind admitting my own inadequacies, or lack of knowledge on a particular subject, for I am not suppose to know any thing and every thing. So, I don't mind going back to learn some thing to comment upon.

Just for the information of readers, I have organized the Retired Defense Services Officers here, and we do interact with each other alost monthly basis. I do get calls from some of my retired JCO's and NCO's, some of them are now active in politics as well. So, I do get little bit of information from the people on ground, apart from the information available on the internet. Since I don't devote as much time as it requires to be probably expert on a subject, I have not hesitation in admitting that my information might be stale/obsolete/outdated (whatever word we might use). I really can't be as authentic as the people on ground seeing the real action.

Regarding praise for Mr. Balyan. Well if you see his contribution on this site: I would say that is immense. It is almost about six posts a day. That kind of contribution not only requires a lot of time, but also patience, dedication, persistence for writing as also searching the information to share. So, I take it as a positive.

I am personally, more inclined to discuss the issues rather than the personalities. That is exactly has been the intention of my posts on the threads that I contribute.
 
raj2rif said:
Dear Mr. Chikara,

Regarding praise for Mr. Balyan. Well if you see his contribution on this site: I would say that is immense. It is almost about six posts a day. That kind of contribution not only requires a lot of time, but also patience, dedication, persistence for writing as also searching the information to share. So, I take it as a positive.

I am personally, more inclined to discuss the issues rather than the personalities. That is exactly has been the intention of my posts on the threads that I contribute.
Click to expand...


Dear Uncle ji,

Very balanced post. Thanks for praising Sachin bhai's contribution. Though he fights with me also few times over issues but his posts are always full of knowledge on the topics. Till now, I have seen that he has very good knowledge of Western UP, Delhi and Haryana politics as well as defence related issues(as written in above posts).

Balyan bhai has very good understanding of social issues as well. If people read his posts being neutral, they will find that whatever he writes is correct at least 99.99 percent times :)

Sachin bhai Jindaabad !!! Jat Ekta Jindaabad!!

Regards,
Anil
 
Perception!!

anilsangwan said:
Dear Uncle ji,

Very balanced post. Thanks for praising Sachin bhai's contribution. Though he fights with me also few times over issues but his posts are always full of knowledge on the topics. Till now, I have seen that he has very good knowledge of Western UP, Delhi and Haryana politics as well as defence related issues(as written in above posts).

Balyan bhai has very good understanding of social issues as well. If people read his posts being neutral, they will find that whatever he writes is correct at least 99.99 percent times :)

Sachin bhai Jindaabad !!! Jat Ekta Jindaabad!!

Regards,
Anil
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Dear Mr. Anil Sangwan,

Thanks a lot for your praise and classifying my post as a balanced one. I really appreciate your compliments.

The problem is once again perception!!. as I had mentioned earlier. What may look to you to be a balanced post may look differently to someone else. That does not mean we are 99.99 percent right, for again what is right and what is wrong also depends on one's beliefs and perception. It is very difficult to either classify or prove whether the reader is reading our posts with a biased mind or unbiased mind, for that is also depends on our perception about others. What I try to do is to concentrate on the LOGIC part of the discussion. Any thing that defies the logice really is difficult for me to swallow.

Having knowledge of any subject is extremely important. However it does become a little difficult to master every subject. Even when we were students we had our favorite subjects and the one we had to study to pass the examination. One can become JACK of all traits, but to become MASTER of all traits is really extra ordinary. But again it depends on the time one devotes to the subject. If someone concentrates a lot on each issue, probably he can master those subjects. Again the word "LOT" is not definite, and grasping power of each individual is different.

When we learn about a subject, we learn from the information avaialable in media, meeting people on ground, understanding their concerns, and also analyzing their consistency with the issues. Then we make a logical conclusion of that issue based on our own analysis, beliefs and perception. There after we might find people in agreement with us or in disagreement with us. So long we do an honest job with best of our capabilites that is what matters.

By the way, your contribution is also not less on this site. You are also a very regular contributor on most subjects. I really don't know what does the activity level means on this site, but your activity level is also close to perfect. Keep doing good job. We need regular contributors on the site who take time off their busy schedule, study the most subject and are not afraid of giving out their opinion.

Once again thanks for your compliment. I like your friendship with Mr. Baliyan, and that is what we need to promote on this site. As you say: "A firend in need is a friend indeed". Keep going and spreading the word of "Friendship" around.
 
sachinb said:
No??

Actually that time I was playing with a Dariyaayi Ghorra and he was ensuring that it doesnt harm me :rock
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Oh ok ... so you belong to a family of daryayi ghorra. Seems like hippos have started being loyal to politicians. Hippos are they new dogs I guess.
 
nahi bhai main to insaan hi hun.....lekin ek Dariyaayi Ghorra jiski gheetti ghani saari motti se...uski gel khelyaa kartaa..,,,,,,,,,,,:D,,,,,,,,uski puchhadi bhi kheench liyaa kartaa,,,,,,,ar ib te vo Dariyaayi Ghorra ghana e badda ho rhyaa se:rock

Jat Ekta Jindabaad:rock.........Ch. Sajjan Kumar Jindabaad:rock

sidchhikara said:
Oh ok ... so you belong to a family of daryayi ghorra. Seems like hippos have started being loyal to politicians. Hippos are they new dogs I guess.
Click to expand...
 
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i guess folks are hunting for a ruff diamond in a sick, old, abandoned diamond mine in sierra leone... i fail to understand the need for such elaboration, when the matter seems to be just so trivial.
 
साउथ दिल्ली आल्यो ..... क चाल रा स इस सीट पे .... देखियो इन्घेने ऊँघेने ... आर हाल बताओ इस सीट का .... रमेश कुमार जी ने जीतवा की भेजो ..... जाटों का नाम रोशन करो !!


:rock :rock :rock






.
 
anilsangwan said:
साउथ दिल्ली आल्यो ..... क चाल रा स इस सीट पे .... देखियो इन्घेने ऊँघेने ... आर हाल बताओ इस सीट का .... रमेश कुमार जी ने जीतवा की भेजो ..... जाटों का नाम रोशन करो !!


:rock :rock :rock






.
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Hope so.......... but
 
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