Why could there be no other Bal Thackrey?

Bhinderwala is termed as "Saheed" by many Sikhs. Check youtube, you will get loads of videos praising Bhinderwala. And it is no hiding fact who raised him to that stature! Similar lines Raj Thackery is playing Marathi manus politics. Winning 12 seats within a span of 4-5 years of party formation speaks in itself. And more than winning, his party got 2nd or 3rd highest votes in many constituencies which hampered ShivSena a lot and hence Kaan-grease was able to regain power in Maharashatra with Pawar. Thats why no hard action was taken against Raj Thackrey when his partymen were attacking people from other states because he is doing a big favor to Kaan-grease by cutting into vote share of ShivSena! On one hand kaangrease says that we dont do politics of dividing people, on other hand they support such people. This is called Hypocrisy (for those who think anti-congressies are hypocrite)

Another example of hypocrisy of kaan-grease -> A whole lot of muslims are indulged in terrorist activites, but they are termed as 'militants', but when a few hindus are caught they term them as "Saffron terrorists".. And this term was used by one of the most prominent leaders of Kaan-grease in Parliament. This is hypocrisy. (I am not favoring any kind of terrorist activites here, but why brand terrorist activities with religion??)

Now as we see that this region based politics is flourishing, who should be held responsible? One, the person who is doing it or the one who is allowing it to flourish? Definitely the first one is the starter, but the latter by no means can escape from the fact that it is equally responsible too for such non-sense politics.
 
@ - Rinku and Deepak.

It's true Bal Thakre or Bhindrawala for that matter werent produced in a vaccum. There actions, crimes were as much a product of the system, society or the government as their own motivations and convictions. But that doesnt at all decrease the enormity of their actions or give a licence to deflect responsibility. This is true for Naxals too or every separatist movement everywhere in the world. I feel the responsibility rests more on the individual. The same Mumbai society can produce cops like those who fought bravely in 26/11 and the same Mumbai society produces Bal Thakre.
 
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VPannu said:
hmm, no wonder 20 lakh people attended his funeral. 'apne log' se upar 'apna desh' nahi aata ke ? JKLF, IRA, Babbar Khalsa, NDFB, LTTE sab legitimate tha fer to.
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apne desh ka constitution hi hume sikhata hai kahin na kahin inke baree mein ki apne log hote hain
1. reservation policy
2.regional policies(370 for J&K and non residents cannot buy land in himachal pradesh and special status for some states)
3.religion policies(hindu marriage act,muslim personal law etc.)
.
Nothing wrong in talking about benefits of once religion, castes and residents of area
 
ravinderpannu said:
I fail to understand how people can keep anything else above motherland(nation)...!!
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we remember the famous quote of ch.mahendre singh tikkait when ch.devilal made his son ch.omprakash chautala the new CM
or sare desh me iska virodh tha.
Jo apne kunbey or parivaar(apne log) ki nahi sochta wo desh ki kya khakh sochega
 
A friend asked me today, "what did Bal Thackrey hated the most, non hindus or north indians"?
And I said "dude its Article 19 of the constitution"

(copied)
 
swaich said:
@ - Rinku and Deepak.

It's true Bal Thakre or Bhindrawala for that matter werent produced in a vaccum. There actions, crimes were as much a product of the system, society or the government as their own motivations and convictions. But that doesnt at all decrease the enormity of their actions or give a licence to deflect responsibility. This is true for Naxals too or every separatist movement everywhere in the world. I feel the responsibility rests more on the individual. The same Mumbai society can produce cops like those who fought bravely in 26/11 and the same Mumbai society produces Bal Thakre.
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Mr Swaich
Let us not involve naxalism in this because again that is due to lack good of governance otherwise why people in Delhi or Haryana( it is better than where we have naxalism) have not taken guns ??? lets leave this for other thread or time

I personally hate the identity politics or politics of appeasement or politics of minority or politics of Aam Admi( ek baar Jayant Chaudhary ne parliament mein pucha tha ki Sab kuch Aam Admi k liye hai iska matlab Koi to KHAS hai, Kon hai vo KHAS aadmi??) No one is decreasing the identity politics that was done by Bhinderwala or Thackrey.You are an intellectual person so Answer me one thing, Who allowed Raj Thackeray to be person he is today, is it him or the system??? If it is only individual why we had only 1 Bhinderwala or thakrey? i can bet that we have lacs of people who want to be like them if it boils down completely to individuals.

Bit off topic,For Khaps i keep hearing the govt calling them unconstitutional and saying no body will be spared but why they become silent when one person( Raj Thakrey in this case) or his follower are allowed to go free hand and do vandalism in one of the biggest cosmopolitan city in india?
 
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It applies to all but like i have been saying, if they pass the test of democracy it implies people accept them.

Case in point in Ajit Singh who was given a wast empire by his father but today is limited to a few seats in VS and a couple of seats in LS for various reasons.


rinkusheoran said:
Does it apply to all including yadavs,chautala,Hooda, Badals, Ch Charan Singh family and most importantly Gandhis????
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desijat said:
It applies to all but like i have been saying, if they pass the test of democracy it implies people accept them.
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So when Chautla was made CM after People verdict and you called it flawed thinking for Ch Tikait when he gave his opinion .He was entitled to his opinion and he was a very well respected leader. isn't it derogatory to call the thinking Of such person as flawed when he just gave his opinion on that? I think in your terms should i call it as hypocrisy ??
 
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Mr. Sheoran,

You are right, they were the product of system which facilitates men to emerge as sole votaries of certain ideology or political idiom and enjoy the support of system. Therefore So long as Hero worshiping is there, none can blame but the system for emergence of 'heroes'.

thanks
 
rinkusheoran said:
So when Chautla was made CM after People verdict and you called it flawed thinking for Ch Tikait when he gave his opinion .He was entitled to his opinion and he was a very well respected leader. isn't it derogatory to call the thinking Of such person as flawed when he just gave his opinion on that? I think in your terms should i call it as hypocrisy ??
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I was responding to the ideology presented by Jai and did not take any names and I stick to what I said, it is a flawed ideology.

Also, you responded in a hurry, read my post again with edits and example.

But you seem to agree, right? In several posts I have seen you criticizing much greater leaders than Tikait(I dont count him as a great leader) or Choutalas on the account of the same theory that you are supporting right now. Whose being a hypocrite here?
 
rinkusheoran said:
So when Chautla was made CM after People verdict and you called it flawed thinking for Ch Tikait when he gave his opinion .He was entitled to his opinion and he was a very well respected leader. isn't it derogatory to call the thinking Of such person as flawed when he just gave his opinion on that? I think in your terms should i call it as hypocrisy ??
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When leaders from rural area especially belonging to peasant class in general and the Jat community in particular start to emerge at national level whether it were Chaudhary Chhotu Ram, Chaudhary Charan Singh, Chaudhary Devi Lal, M S Tikait and so on, they are cut to size by the vested interests by labeling them as only Jat leaders in a bid to marginalize their support base and importance in contemporary polity whereas they all were men of masses and represented 36 birdaries in their life times. This is the real face of 'system'.
 
desijat said:
I was responding to the ideology presented by Jai and did not take any names and I stick to what I said, it is a flawed ideology.

Also, you responded in a hurry, read my post again with edits and example.

But you seem to agree, right? In several posts I have seen you criticizing much greater leaders than Tikait(I dont count him as a great leader) or Choutalas on the account of the same theory that you are supporting right now. Whose being a hypocrite here?
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you were not responding to Jai but his content in that post and i replied to that but as usually you took the way you wanted.I think this time you didnt give a deep thought to it :)

Waho wali baat jo humare baap ko baap nhi manta hum uske baap ko bhi baap nhi manegey.Tere liye bhai leader mujhe pta nhi ki kon hai n teri leader ki kya paribhasa hai, For me no one is above Rehbar-e-Azam Ch Chhoturam Ohlyan and other like Ch Tikait, ch Charan singh, ch Devilal n ye vo log hain jinhone teri ya teri party ki ideology/ leadership ko kai saal pahle chhod dia tha kyunki inko asliyat jaldi samajh aa gia thi
 
DrRajpalSingh said:
When leaders from rural area especially belonging to peasant class in general and the Jat community in particular start to emerge at national level whether it were Chaudhary Chhotu Ram, Chaudhary Charan Singh, Chaudhary Devi Lal, M S Tikait and so on, they are cut to size by the vested interests by labeling them as only Jat leaders in a bid to marginalize their support base and importance in contemporary polity whereas they all were men of masses and represented 36 birdaries in their life times. This is the real face of 'system'.
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Completely in Agreement, i have never seen anyone being labeled as brahmin( Nehru/Vajpayee/MM Joshi) or a Baniya( Gandhis) leader, sometimes i wonder whether they ever had any leader or not ???
 
DrRajpalSingh said:
Mr. Sheoran,

You are right, they were the product of system which facilitates men to emerge as sole votaries of certain ideology or political idiom and enjoy the support of system. Therefore So long as Hero worshiping is there, none can blame but the system for emergence of 'heroes'.

thanks
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Again completely agree with you Dr Sahab,I dont understand why some people are not able to recognize/understand this basic thing.It is very much obvious and anyone in there senses can see that. Thakrey or Bhinderwala were not the first and it is not end of son of soil ideology politics as well
 
I am not sure why do you pretend to know me better than myself? Let me be the judge of myself, truce?

Also, I think you will help both, the discussion and JL by responding to the topic instead of questioning my definitions and my belief because you hardly know me or my belief. Your last few posts have been away from the topic and more focused on me, while I enjoy getting so much attention but I doubt others do so. If you wish to discuss my ideology on personal level then you are more than welcome to write to me personally, you already have my e mail ID.

Cheers

rinkusheoran said:
you were not responding to Jai but his content in that post and i replied to that but as usually you took the way you wanted.I think this time you didnt give a deep thought to it :)

Waho wali baat jo humare baap ko baap nhi manta hum uske baap ko bhi baap nhi manegey.Tere liye bhai leader mujhe pta nhi ki kon hai n teri leader ki kya paribhasa hai, For me no one is above Rehbar-e-Azam Ch Chhoturam Ohlyan and other like Ch Tikait, ch Charan singh, ch Devilal n ye vo log hain jinhone teri ya teri party ki ideology/ leadership ko kai saal pahle chhod dia tha kyunki inko asliyat jaldi samajh aa gia thi
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